# I pit YogSosoth **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 6, 2009, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503 "2009-03-06T08:47:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2009, 5:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/61 "2009-03-09T05:39:39Z")
Your right - like the U.S. Army, the IDF is almost purely carbine these days. Hell, even our SAWs have folding stocks. ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2009, 6:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/62 "2009-03-09T06:05:45Z")
There has to be a joke in here somewhere about the Jews, circumcision, and barrel/magazine size…but I’m just not seeing it. Maybe someone else can do the honors, but I give up. Just wanted to let you guys know that I didn’t fail to see the potential here, even if I did fail to actualize it. ---
**Author:** ![Walker\_in\_Eternity](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/46a35a/32.png) [@Walker\_in\_Eternity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walker_in_Eternity)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2009, 10:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/63 "2009-03-09T10:07:09Z")
> [@Mr.Excellent](#): > > La! La! Cthulhu ftaghn! La! La! Cthulhu ftaghn! Fanatasic, beat me to it by miles. Got to be the most apt pit response for ages. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2009, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/64 "2009-03-14T02:35:13Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > [Sez here:](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barrel_shroud) So it’s like a pot holder for a gun barrel? 😉 But why the holes? Is that to vent the heat, so that the shroud doesn’t just get as hot, and negate the purpose? (Sorry to bump this-but my modem kicked out last week, and I only got the new one hooked up today) ---
**Author:** ![Kobal2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kobal2/32/20_2.png) [@Kobal2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kobal2)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2009, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/65 "2009-03-14T03:12:56Z")
> [@MandaJo](#): > > Anyone else come in here expecting to see the pitting of an Elder God? _raise hand_ And frankly, I’d be all for it. I mean, seriously, who Lurks at the fucking Threshold?! Get in or stay the fuck out, don’t just stand there like a moron ! Say what you want about fatass Chtulhu or that inbred, anti-birth control sack of shit Shub Niggurath, but they don’t fuck around with this oooo I’m the omniscient key shit, THEY DRIVE YOU NUTS AND EAT YOUR SOUL, OK ?! And they fucking look the part as well. I mean, giant sleeping sea god with tentacle face ? Scary. Evil goat with a thousand young ? Ominous. But you ? You don’t even try, do you ? You’re what, “a congerie of irridescent globes” ? Oh yeah, a pile of testes. That’s fucking spooky. Sorry Yog, but you’re a LAME fucking god and you should just give up. Now. FUCK. ---
**Author:** ![Todderbob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e47774/32.png) [@Todderbob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Todderbob)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2009, 9:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/66 "2009-03-14T09:43:51Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > So it’s like a pot holder for a gun barrel? 😉 > > But why the holes? Is that to vent the heat, so that the shroud doesn’t just get as hot, and negate the purpose? > (Sorry to bump this-but my modem kicked out last week, and I only got the new one hooked up today) The holes are so more air gets past the barrel, cooling it off faster. Laws of thermodynamics, and whatnot. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [March 14, 2009, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/67 "2009-03-14T16:51:54Z")
Gotcha. Makes sense. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [March 18, 2009, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/68 "2009-03-18T17:53:15Z")
I don’t want to feed the troll anymore, so I’m going to respond to him here, so I can point out he’s a troll. And a fucking willfully ignorant idiot who wants to shit all over the Constitution rather than honestly trying to amend it. Response follows: > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/444): > > Yes yes, keep lying as if it was true. It is true, exactly as I stated. Your original rationalization was bullshit, and then you shifted the goalposts and added other metrics than “necessity”. Yes, I know, you got caught making an ignorant argument and then changed it without admitting your first one was wrong. Good show. > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/444): > > No, they cannot, because man needs more than sacks and bland food. Wrong. > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/444): > > Post some sources. Already done several times in this thread by several other people, including bob who just posted to you specifically. You accidentally didn’t see all the times the data has been posted and discussed in this thread. I’m sure. > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/444): > > “Every weapon is dangerous” is a pointless non-sequitor intended to bolster your argument with weasel words and mindless rhetoric. Yes, duh, weapons are dangerous, but that’s not why I want gun control. Hell, every THING is dangerous, from plastic bags you can choke on to a necklace that can get caught. So you’ve now admitted that in addition to “necessity”, “danger” is also a bullshit rationalization. You’re doing a bangup job here. > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/444): > > Assault weapons are useful in self defense? Yeah, sure, if you’re defending the president. Have you, perhaps, considered learning WTF you’re talking about? Just a suggestion. Again your “sarcasm” just reveals that you’re making shit up as fast as you can type, and you are willfully ignorant of the facts. There’s a reason why the secret service generally uses automatic weapons and not “assault weapons” to protect the President. But of course, your attempts to destroy part of our Constitution have to be based on less than honest fear mongering, eh? > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/444): > > What, a robber busts into your house and you aim the minigun at his face? You routinely strap AK47’s to you back when you go to Burger King? Your argument would look less laughably ignorant if you had a clue. Even a basic clue. A minigun is not an “assault weapon”, the AK that’s an “assault weapon” is functionally no different from any other hunting rifle. You are ignorant and simply making shit up. > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/444): > > And with hunting, there are slower firing, less concealable guns you can use that pose less danger to other people. Name five hunting rifles. :rolleyes: Who do you think you’re fooling? We all know you’re just making this up as you go along and you know nothing about guns. Here’s a hint, you’d be stupid if you’d rather someone take a shot at you with a bolt action thirty ought six rifle than with an AK at 150 yards. > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/444): > > And I guess your comment about handguns makes you an enthusiastic supporter of handgun control, right? Your guessing skills are about as accurate as your research skills. Idiot. ---
**Author:** ![Walker\_in\_Eternity](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/46a35a/32.png) [@Walker\_in\_Eternity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walker_in_Eternity)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2009, 9:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/69 "2009-03-19T09:53:05Z")
> [@Kobal2](#): > > _raise hand_ > > And frankly, I’d be all for it. > I mean, seriously, who Lurks at the fucking Threshold?! Get in or stay the fuck out, don’t just stand there like a moron ! Say what you want about fatass Chtulhu or that inbred, anti-birth control sack of shit Shub Niggurath, but they don’t fuck around with this oooo I’m the omniscient key shit, THEY DRIVE YOU NUTS AND EAT YOUR SOUL, OK ?! > And they fucking look the part as well. I mean, giant sleeping sea god with tentacle face ? Scary. Evil goat with a thousand young ? Ominous. But you ? You don’t even try, do you ? You’re what, “a congerie of irridescent globes” ? Oh yeah, a pile of testes. That’s fucking spooky. Sorry Yog, but you’re a LAME fucking god and you should just give up. Now. FUCK. And don’t call him [soap.](http://www.macguff.fr/goomi/unspeakable/vault29.html) No really, [don’t](http://www.macguff.fr/goomi/unspeakable/vault24.html). ---
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [March 19, 2009, 10:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/70 "2009-03-19T10:25:51Z")
> [@](#): > > There’s a reason why the secret service generally uses automatic weapons and not “assault weapons” to protect the President. But of course, your attempts to destroy part of our Constitution have to be based on less than honest fear mongering, eh? I have a friend and rugby teammate from high school who was in the Secret Service for a few years after serving as a platoon sergeant in the USMC. I have seen his photos from this time, and the two weapons that he generally used were an MP5 and a P90 (a small futuristic-looking submachinegun chambered for the 5.7x28 round). Both of these weapons are automatic (well, technically, select-fire - capable of firing in semiauto or automatic.) Neither of these are readily available to civilians. There is a neutured semi-auto version of the P90 (can’t remember what it’s called) with a longer barrel, available to civilians - I personally don’t see the point of it, since the whole point of a submachine gun is to provide automatic fire in a compact package, and the semi-P90 clone has neither of those, so you’re better off with a pistol IMO. There is also a really lame clone of the MP5 made by some company (Vector Arms?) that is semi-auto only. If Barack Obama were really against “assault weapons,” he would have his Secret Service details armed with bolt-action 1903 Springfields. I mean, he supported a handgun ban, so his Secret Service detail shouldn’t be able to have those either. I’m sure that four Secret Service agents with 1903 Springfields would be more than satisfactory to ensure the safety and protection of President Obama. I mean, those rifles can hit a target hundreds of yards away, and if someone tries to attack him at close range, well, they can beat him over the head with the stock. Why should his agents have to carry evil assault weapons that “have no place on our streets” when they’d be perfectly fine with more “reasonable” firearms? But of course - the life of the president is simply WORTH more than my life, or my family’s life, or your life, or the life of your kids. Or the life of someone who lives in a dangerous neighborhood and has to walk to work at a liquor store that gets robbed twice a month, or the life of someone who’s stuck in an area filled with looters or rioters, in the middle of a natural disaster or something, who might actually NEED a weapon for self-defense that was high-capacity and effective at long ranges. I mean, these people are just people - the president is a president, and above such restrictions. It’s a “do as I say, not as I do” attitude. There’s a famous picture somewhere of Chuck Schumer, one of the most anti-gun politicians in America, joyfully firing a TEC-9 at a shooting range. Just sheer elitist hypocrisy. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2009, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/71 "2009-03-20T17:43:26Z")
Thanks for the pit. I guess you can respond to people honestly in here without fear of the law? What are the rules here, if any? By the way, yes, I really do believe what I was saying, this isn’t some kind of pointless fake poster out to get a laugh. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2009, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/72 "2009-03-20T18:04:34Z")
> [@Ike\_Witt](#): > > I was thinking, this pitting is a plea to be eaten last… I thought the plan was to be eaten first, so you are spared some of the worst horrors. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2009, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/73 "2009-03-20T18:21:50Z")
> [@YogSosoth](#): > > T I guess you can respond to people honestly in here without fear of the law? What are the rules here, if any? Try reading the stickies you willfully ignorant ignorant, shit-stupid troll. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2009, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/74 "2009-03-20T18:39:35Z")
> [@YogSosoth](#): > > Thanks for the pit. I guess you can respond to people honestly in here without fear of the law? What are the rules here, if any? > > By the way, yes, I really do believe what I was saying, this isn’t some kind of pointless fake poster out to get a laugh. I didn’t join in the original thread because I’ve learned that trying to debate 2A issues with a troll is just exactly like rolling in shit. You accomplish nothing except getting covered with shit. You’re a troll. Go away. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2009, 12:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/75 "2009-03-21T00:59:28Z")
Dear troll: > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/483): > > And here is where your critique of me is flawed. By stating the 100% accurate truth and pointing out how you were forced to continually move the goalposts as each one of your rationalizations was shot down? Yah, my bad. :rolleyes: > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/483): > > I asked a question, with a simple 2 sentence elaboration. Yes, showing your profound, willful ignorance of the mechanics and nature of various firearms. And arguing that since they weren’t necessary (in your ignorance-based view), people should not have them. Of course, you’ve also remained deliberately ignorant of why you’d use various firearms for various purposes (your claim that a handgun could replace a hunting rifle is priceless), or for that matter, why a flash suppressor, muzzle shrouds, etc.. need to be banned. Generally when someone tries to pin you down on that point, you shift the goalposts again and complain about how it’s simply unreasonable for someone to ask that you know wtf you’re talking about before you attempt to violate the Bill of Rights. > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/483): > > and for you or anyone else to take that as anything but a beginning is an intellectually dishonest debate tactic. You obviously have no clue as to what intellectual honesty means. Here’s a hint, it doesn’t mean “pointing out that your original ignorance-based rationalization was crap, and you shifted the goalposts as soon as you were caught at it.” Complaining about how you are being held to your own words though, you whiny bitch? Yah, that might do it. > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/483): > > Your reply included _"Assault weapons also have no functional definition and the term is a meaningless scare phrase. "_ Shall I assume that is your ONLY objection to the AWB? Yes, if you’re a moron. That means: go ahead spunky. Of course, were you not a deliberately ignorant trolling asshole, you might even recognize that one can add different arguments without abandoning the first. While you, on the other hand, abandoned your first and added additional rationalizations, without ever conceding that you were wrong. > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/483): > > You didn’t mention anything about incompentent writers of the bill at all, yet you use it as a foundation for your later objections! No, you lying schmuck. When you, like the gleefully stupid troll you are, pointed out that you were supporting a bill without even having read it, many of us responded by pointing out that since the bill itself was created by people who were ignorant or lying on the subject of the bill, there was no reason to place blind faith in them. I know you’re also painfully stupid, but try real hard to figure out why " ‘Assault weapon’ is a meaningless scare phrase… and the people who are using it are wrong to do so" is not shifting the goalposts but “People should not have ‘assault weapons’ because they’re not necessary. Er, I mean, they’re too dangerous. Er, I mean, they’re too dangerous and their functions can be replaced by any other gun. Er, I mean, they have no uses. Er…” is shifting the goalposts. > [@Obama to Seek New Assault Weapons Ban](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/obama-to-seek-new-assault-weapons-ban/487475/483): > > However your debate tactic of falsely attributing a single, 3 sentence post as my **entire** argument is nothing short of extreme strawman and a sad waste of what could have been a decent debate, True, especially since you’re lying through your rotten little troll teeth in order to pretend that I did any such thing, you stupid son of a bitch. What did I, in fact, say, you liar? Ya know, in the post you quoted and responded to, idiot? > [@](#): > > Your original risible rationalization for violating the Bill of Rights was “necessity”, only. > Once when you realized how poor a metric that was, you added in additional rationalizations. And then started claiming that since you shifted the goalposts once you were caught, that it was somehow a lie to point out what your original argument had been. What did I say [before that](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=10942552&postcount=426)? > [@](#): > > By your own standard, which you quickly changed and shifted the goalposts, the only metric was necessity. Only necessity. Not any of your other post-hoc rationalizations. You stupid liar, why lie about me when all I have to do is quote my own posts? Obviously, I made quite clear that I was taking you to task for your stupidity in your original argument, and how you had changed it. Are you really so fucking stupid that you think that my specific claim of you shifting the goalposts meant you never changed your tune? Are you really that much of a fool? That when I delineate between your original argument and the rationalizations that you added in later when you shifted the goalposts, that I’m claiming your argument remained exactly as it was at first? I don’t believe it. You’re stupid, but you’re not that stupid. Just a troll. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2009, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/76 "2009-03-21T01:04:19Z")
> [@FinnAgain](#): > > … (your claim that a handgun could replace a hunting rifle is priceless), … But it could Some people with a mean streak would enjoy seeing someone go bear hunting with a pistol. You could hunt the bear, but I don’t think you’d be too thrilled with the results. I wonder, do bears mount people heads on their wall? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 21, 2009, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/77 "2009-03-21T02:45:56Z")
> [@Argent\_Towers](#): > > Downsides of the FAL: Confusing inch/metric pattern compatibility issues, thought to have the worst sights of the 3 battle rifles, is heavy. You left out “inaccurate as hell in full-auto mode”. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2009, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503/78 "2009-03-23T16:23:38Z")
> [@SteveG1](#): > > But it could Some people with a mean streak would enjoy seeing someone go bear hunting with a pistol. You could hunt the bear, but I don’t think you’d be too thrilled with the results. I wonder, do bears mount people heads on their wall? 😃 Bear hunting with a pistol is not unknown. I know a fellow who bagged one with a scoped .44 magnum revolver. One shot, one bear. Therein lies the key: the pistols one might use to hunt bear are not the same pistols one might use for self-defense against humans. Pistols suitable for the hunting of large, perhaps dangerous, game tend to be heavy, bulky affairs. Concealment and such do not enter into their design parameters. They also use deeply penetrative, hard-recoiling cartridges which are liabilities in terms of over-penetration and follow-up shots when used for self-defense. The right tool for the job is as true with guns as anything else. I’d feel quite confident hunting bear with one of the heavy magnum pistols. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-pit-yogsosoth/488503.md?page=3)