# I refuse major label beers **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [May 31, 2016, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185 "2016-05-31T20:25:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 19\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/21 "2016-06-01T18:43:27Z")
> [@Channing\_Idaho\_Banks](#): > > You would think that a lot of people would feel the same way as the OP, however, it seems that everybody keeps buying the beer that’s at the lowest common denominator, maybe because it’s cheaper than beers that are probably better. Never underestimate the effect that price has. And especially on a very hot day, a macro brew lager can be pretty refreshing. The jokes about it being close to water, actually help in that case. And pale lagers are generally inoffensive because they don’t actually taste like much at all. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/22 "2016-06-01T18:45:09Z")
> [@Euphonious\_Polemic](#): > > In my opinion, monopolies are not good for the consumer in the long run. In the case of numerous small brewers that are around and the ease of entry into the market, I don’t think that simply owning 90% market share equals monopoly power in the market. And it doesn’t seem to effect consumer benefit. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/23 "2016-06-01T18:47:24Z")
I gave up “major labels” nearly 20 years ago. I didn’t do it out of protest though. I just wanted something tasty. And I don’t consider myself a “beer snob” either. As I’ve liked pretty much any microbrew I’ve tried so far. You’d think a true snob would be a little more discerning than that. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/24 "2016-06-01T21:37:52Z")
I only refuse warm beer. Anybody offering free cold beer, I’ll take it. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2016, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/25 "2016-06-01T22:20:08Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > I think most parts of the US have plenty of locals who control a ‘boutique market’. There is, basically, plenty of choice and plenty of room for smaller brewers. In the Atlanta market, where I reside, there are more than a few local brewers doing quite well (Sweetwater, Red Brick, Three Taverns, Orpheus, Wild Heaven, Second Self, Monday Night, Eventide, etc. and going a bit farther Terrapin). So what does it matter otherwise? The reason it matters is distribution. There will always be plenty of small breweries that produce good beer, and if you have access to them, then mergers aren’t a big deal. But the mergers give the behemoths undue influence on the distribution of all beers. When InBev owns so many brands, they can dictate the terms: “you will put our beers on at least 80% of your taps, or you don’t get any.” Access to the independent brewers is cut off. ---
**Author:** ![Derleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Derleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Derleth)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/26 "2016-06-02T00:00:15Z")
I, too, refuse all major label beer. I also refuse all minor label beer. And all beer without labels. And all beer in cups, mugs, tankards, and vessels. I refuse all beer. Therefore, I’m infinitely more hipster than you, as I refuse to support any monopoly, real or imagined. I support local culture by not killing yeast. So there. ---
**Author:** ![Wallaby](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/dc4da7/32.png) [@Wallaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wallaby)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/27 "2016-06-02T02:18:32Z")
> [@ThisSpaceForRent](#): > > You would be surprised at the number of “craft breweries” that AB InBev has acquired…Red Hook…Boulivard…Kona…Widmer …just to scratch the surface. Woah - had my first Redhook down here in OZ just last week. I was impressed. Does that mean I’m not allowed to drink it anymore:p It’s a standard practise down here, too. A good, small brewery will inevitably be taken over by a major supplier _ **IF** _ they produce a good, popular product. And why not? If it means more people get to try it due to an increase in volume production, that’s great (assuming the manufacturing process remains the same, of course). It’s the same with music - there’s always those people who complain ‘That band was so much better before they became popular, and started selling more records’. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 4:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/28 "2016-06-02T04:26:12Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > The reason it matters is distribution. There will always be plenty of small breweries that produce good beer, and if you have access to them, then mergers aren’t a big deal. But the mergers give the behemoths undue influence on the distribution of all beers. When InBev owns so many brands, they can dictate the terms: “you will put our beers on at least 80% of your taps, or you don’t get any.” Access to the independent brewers is cut off. If this was to happen, it would be in quite clear violation of Section 1 of the Sherman Antitrust Act and the Clayton Antitrust Act. So I don’t think you should fear. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 4:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/29 "2016-06-02T04:42:23Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > If this was to happen, it would be in quite clear violation of Section 1 of the Sherman Antitrust Act and the Clayton Antitrust Act. So I don’t think you should fear. [Oh really](http://www.wsj.com/articles/craft-brewers-take-issue-with-ab-inbev-distribution-plan-1449227668)? My scenario is exaggerated a bit - thus far InBev is offering incentives to distributors who drop craft brewers, so it’s “voluntary”. But the result is the same - small brewers get pushed out because InBev has an outsized influence on distribution of beer. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/30 "2016-06-02T04:47:51Z")
And more [here](http://www.reuters.com/article/us-abinbev-doj-antitrust-exclusive-idUSKCN0S623R20151012): > [@](#): > > Antitrust regulators are also reviewing craft brewers’ claims that AB InBev pushes some independent distributors to only carry the company’s products and end their ties with the craft industry… > > Nikos Ridge, CEO of Ninkasi Brewing Co in Oregon, said that when two of his distributors were bought by AB InBev in 2011 and 2012, he saw what had been healthy sales growth quickly stall until it found alternative distributors… An executive at a second craft brewer, who asked not to be named, said that AB InBev had recently bought one of its distributors. “It (the distributor) is slowly but surely divesting itself of everything that is not ABI.” ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/31 "2016-06-02T10:23:37Z")
> [@Omar\_Little](#): > > I only refuse warm beer. Anybody offering free cold beer, I’ll take it. Overheard at a local bar that has an old, faded sign reading “FREE BEER TOMORROW”: “Hey, didja see the sign? We should come back tomorrow.” ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 1:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/32 "2016-06-02T13:25:34Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > And especially on a very hot day, a macro brew lager can be pretty refreshing. The jokes about it being close to water, actually help in that case. And pale lagers are generally inoffensive because they don’t actually taste like much at all. Pretty much my story. I usually don’t care for beer and the attributes that beer aficionados look for make it less attractive to me. But, when I’ve been working in the yard, “beer flavored water” is pretty much what I want, not some hearty bread in a bottle. Bring on the cheap macrobrews! ---
**Author:** ![excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/e8c25b/32.png) [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/excavating_for_a_mind)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/33 "2016-06-02T13:59:40Z")
“If you’re not brewing your own beer, you’re just drinking what someone else thought they could get you to like” I am not a fan of Light American Lager, as a style, but there are many that are. I don’t like Beyonce’s music. That does not mean her music is bad or inferior or that the people who do like it are inferior examples of human beings. It just means I don’t like that kind of music. Same for Bud Light. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/34 "2016-06-02T14:38:40Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > [Oh really](http://www.wsj.com/articles/craft-brewers-take-issue-with-ab-inbev-distribution-plan-1449227668)? > > My scenario is exaggerated a bit - thus far InBev is offering incentives to distributors who drop craft brewers, so it’s “voluntary”. But the result is the same - small brewers get pushed out because InBev has an outsized influence on distribution of beer. > [@TroutMan](#): > > And more [here](http://www.reuters.com/article/us-abinbev-doj-antitrust-exclusive-idUSKCN0S623R20151012): So what you are saying is that if InBev starts to engage in anti-competitive behavior the DOJ will investigate? Wasn’t that my exact point? (of course the real issue is that states still have silly you have to go through a distributor laws, which just incentivizes attempted vertical integration, but that’s somewhat separate) ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 2:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/35 "2016-06-02T14:53:28Z")
> [@excavating\_for\_a\_mind](#): > > “If you’re not brewing your own beer, you’re just drinking what someone else thought they could get you to like” If I WAS brewing my own beer, chances are I’d be drinking something _no one_ could like… 😛 ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/36 "2016-06-02T15:31:35Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > So what you are saying is that if InBev starts to engage in anti-competitive behavior the DOJ will investigate? Wasn’t that my exact point? (of course the real issue is that states still have silly you have to go through a distributor laws, which just incentivizes attempted vertical integration, but that’s somewhat separate) The investigations went nowhere. The second article includes links to brewers who have already been impacted by the consolidation of brewers and distributors. I appreciate your optimism that the government will fix all this and keep the market wide open for all, but I don’t share that optimism. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/37 "2016-06-02T16:00:39Z")
As the Reuters article you linked states: > [@](#): > > The authorities could step in if AB InBev bought so many distributors that craft brewers lost significant access to a local market, said Jonathan Lewis, an antitrust expert at the law firm Baker Hostetler LLP. He estimated that the breaking point could be when AB InBev owned some 50 percent of distributors in a given area. Not having 50% of the distributors in an area, which basically just results in some craft brewers to switch distributors I don’t think rises to the level of anti-trust violations, nor should it. I’d rather not assume guilt before it occurs (if it does). ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/38 "2016-06-02T16:09:46Z")
I mean if you are really concerned you just do what some states already have done and forbid distributors from being owned by producers. Vertical integration is the problem, not horizontal. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2016, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185/39 "2016-06-02T17:20:02Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > I mean if you are really concerned you just do what some states already have done and forbid distributors from being owned by producers. Vertical integration is the problem, not horizontal. It’s not only me who is concerned, it is many small brewers who deal with the challenge of getting their beer distributed. The distribution network has been a major concern in the craft industry for the last few years - you can google it and see this is not some unfounded concern of mine; it is a major issue facing the industry. You are lucky you live in an area that has access to a wide variety of beers. I am even more so, living in Portland OR. But many people live in areas served only by an InBev owned or aligned distributor, and their choices are more limited. Even in Portland we see its effect: Widmer, for example, entered their agreement to let InBev take part ownership to gain access to InBev’s distribution network. Is Widmer making the same beer today they as they would have as a completely independent brewery? Tough to say. I understand that control of the distribution market is somewhat separate from InBev purchasing small breweries. But it is directly related to my decisions about what kind of beer I drink and what companies I support, which is where this thread started. 10 Barrel was one of my favorite breweries, and I think they still make fantastic beer after their purchase by InBev. But I would rather my money go to an independent brewery who is working to support the growth of small breweries everywhere, rather than a company whose growth plan is dependent on limiting the prospects of others. My decision to no longer drink 10 Barrel is not about being a snob or thinking it’s not hip to drink their beer; it’s all about who I want to support. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-refuse-major-label-beers/756185.md?page=1)