# I saw a B-17 today! **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [June 18, 2013, 12:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222 "2013-06-18T00:30:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 10\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2013, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222/21 "2013-06-18T21:34:34Z")
> [@blondebear](#): > > Very cool is right! > > I became a Flying Fortress fan as a kid thanks to watching Twelve O’Clock High (the TV series) in the 60s. [I took a ride](http://youtu.be/nr82ZhzLYVM) on the Collings Foundation’s “Nine O Nine” several years ago…expensive, but it was worth every penny! One of my fellow passengers was a former crewmember who was shot down over Germany. I asked him a mundane question about how cold it was up at altitude and he replied that being cold was the least of their worries. That’s as long as the heated suit was plugged in and working. My grandfather said that when the cable to his heated suit got shot through, he got up and out of the ball turret tout suite and hung out in the radio room, which was heated and manned the gun there instead. He said that without the heated suit, you could very easily freeze to death quickly. (Gramps was a flight engineer/top turret & sometime ball turret gunner on B-17Fs in the 549th Sqdn, 385th Bomb Group from about Aug. 1943 - December 1943) ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2013, 10:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222/22 "2013-06-18T22:18:23Z")
> [@Laggard](#): > > And last summer leaving our home in South Minneapolis I saw a Japanese Zero fly overhead. I did a double take. With all respect, are you sure? I didn’t think there were any flying examples left. There are a bunch of mock-ups from T-6s flyin’ around. I’ve seen two different “real” non-flyers, however. ---
**Author:** ![Battle\_Pope](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@Battle\_Pope](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Battle_Pope)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2013, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222/23 "2013-06-18T22:49:52Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > Come to [this](http://www.maam.org/maamwwii.html). You just missed it for this year. Next year its June 6-7-8. \ We just don’t have anything near that in Australia, though I hope to get to [Warbirds over Wanaka](http://www.warbirdsoverwanaka.com/) in the next few years. The closest thing to a B-17 I’ve seen would be [this lady](http://www.conniesurvivors.com/VH-EAG.htm) at the Avalon Airshow in '97. ---
**Author:** ![pullin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/c57346/32.png) [@pullin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pullin)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2013, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222/24 "2013-06-18T23:45:06Z")
> [@runner pat](#): > > Heavy, like a wet sponge. > > But then, it does have four engines. Everything seemed to be in slow motion, and the controls were fairly heavy. It seemed to be InputAileron-\>ManeuveringCommitteeMeets-\>VoteTaken-\>PlaneRolls. The engines were LOUD. You had to wear ear protection to ride anywhere up front. The rudder pedals were really hard to push. I couldn’t imagine what it would’ve been like for pilots to hold against a failed engine. For hours. Over the channel. For about an hour, I rode in the tailgunner’s position. Just quietly by myself, trying to feel what they must’ve felt in the war. I tried to imagine their experience, but I doubt I even came close. A former tail-gunner rode with us on one flight. He’d been shot down, and found the rear door wouldn’t open and everything forward of the waist gunners was in flames. He told us the tailwheel was extended when he was trying to get out (he never knew whether on purpose or due to hydraulic failure, most of the forward crew perished). He finally dove out the small opening around the tailwheel and spent the rest of the war as a POW. A former B-17 pilot (Captain) also rode with us to an airshow honoring the Mighty 8th. On one mission, he lost his copilot to flak, and had to fly most of the way back trying to hold the body away from the yoke (it had fallen forward). He had also kept a small notebook during the war, with all the names of the crew in his quarters, starting with the first day he arrived in theatre. Out of 48, only two survived (he and one other). The pilots gave him the left seat for a lot of the flight (everyone figured he’d earned it). It was very apparent he knew the airplane well, even after 4-5 decades. I got to attend an 8th Air Force reunion on one trip. It was one of the most memorable things I ever got to do. I actually got to meet and shake “Gabby” Gabreski’s hand, and even talk to him for awhile. He was very polite and warm. At one point during the ceremony, the color guard brought the flags into the room, and the sound of chairs sliding back as men stood to attention was like thunder. One man in a wheelchair was struggling to stand, and several of his companions rushed over and helped him come to attention. He was going to stand for the flag, even if it was his last time. It was really moving (I still get sniffles thinking about it). Anyway, sorry for rambling. Reminiscences of an old man, I guess. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Pork\_Rind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pork_rind/32/111_2.png) [@Pork\_Rind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pork_Rind)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2013, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222/25 "2013-06-19T00:57:10Z")
> [@Gatopescado](#): > > With all respect, are you sure? I didn’t think there were any flying examples left. There are a bunch of mock-ups from T-6s flyin’ around. > > I’ve seen two different “real” non-flyers, however. Paul Allen’s museum [has one](http://www.flyingheritage.com/TemplatePlane.aspx?contentId=20) that’s a genuine airframe but with a substitute engine. It’ll be flying next weekend. The hangar where they used to restore Me-262s now has a Zero under restoration, but I don’t know the full story on it. ---
**Author:** ![Laggard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/9de053/32.png) [@Laggard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laggard)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2013, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222/26 "2013-06-19T03:31:30Z")
> [@Gatopescado](#): > > With all respect, are you sure? I didn’t think there were any flying examples left. There are a bunch of mock-ups from T-6s flyin’ around. > > I’ve seen two different “real” non-flyers, however. Maybe not. Could have been a Kate for all I know. ---
**Author:** ![Kenm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/bc79bd/32.png) [@Kenm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kenm)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2013, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222/27 "2013-06-19T04:20:46Z")
I shot pix of a Lancaster bomber in August 2009 that had visited Winnipeg. The area where it was parked was so small I could capture the entire aircraft only with a 28mm wide-angle lens on my 35mm camera, so I shot it from the end of the port wing. [**The Lancaster**](http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/1364/sq7g.jpg) [**Two front guns**](http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/2792/cvl5.jpg) (200mm lens) [**The bomb bay**](http://img849.imageshack.us/img849/6361/qe0v.jpg) [**A prop**](http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/3848/iubc.jpg) (105mm lens) Interior tours were offered, but the lineup was very long. I would have had to wait in line in the hot sun for an hour or more, so I skipped it. ---
**Author:** ![GusNSpot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gusnspot/32/436_2.png) [@GusNSpot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GusNSpot)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2013, 4:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222/28 "2013-06-19T04:33:19Z")
> [@Kenm](#): > > I shot pix of a Lancaster bomber in August 2009 that had visited Winnipeg. The area where it was parked was so small I could capture the entire aircraft only with a 28mm wide-angle lens on my 35mm camera, so I shot it from the end of the port wing. > > [**The Lancaster**](http://img577.imageshack.us/img577/1364/sq7g.jpg) > > [**Two front guns**](http://img845.imageshack.us/img845/2792/cvl5.jpg) (200mm lens) > > [**The bomb bay**](http://img849.imageshack.us/img849/6361/qe0v.jpg) > > [**A prop**](http://img825.imageshack.us/img825/3848/iubc.jpg) (105mm lens) > > Interior tours were offered, but the lineup was very long. I would have had to wait in line in the hot sun for an hour or more, so I skipped it. Most excellent pictures. ---
**Author:** ![terentii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/terentii/32/212_2.png) [@terentii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/terentii)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2013, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222/29 "2013-06-19T05:03:49Z")
> [@Laggard](#): > > And last summer leaving our home in South Minneapolis I saw a Japanese Zero fly overhead. I did a double take. I worked as a site guide at Historic Fort Snelling back in the '80s. Every year, the CAF would buzz the fort with a wide selection of aircraft during their annual airshow in St Paul. It was hard to do the 1827 Living History bit with F4Us, A-26s, P-51s, and God knows what else flying overhead at treetop level. Every now and then, we’d also get craft from the nearby airbase zooming by: F-15s, A/F-18s, C-130s, C5As, and lots of helicopters in particular. ---
**Author:** ![Malacandra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Malacandra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malacandra)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2013, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222/30 "2013-06-19T05:43:14Z")
> [@N9IWP](#): > > I was at EAA for the end of WWII 50th anniversary. They had ~140 warbirds going overhead (at 3 different altitudes) 🆒 > > I thinik it was the same year they had an Avro Shackleton (? It was one with multiple cota-rotating props) > > Brian (Yes, the Shackleton was a four-engined descendant of the Lancaster via the Lincoln, and did have contra-rotating props on all engines. I saw a static example at Duxford on Monday.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-saw-a-b-17-today/661222.md?page=1)