# "I see this country falling apart." **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 7, 2015, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859 "2015-10-07T20:47:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Little\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c57346/32.png) [@Little\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Pig)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/1 "2015-10-07T20:47:42Z")
[Roseburg, Reeling From Massacre, Finds Security in Gun Ownership.](http://www.nytimes.com/2015/10/08/us/oregon-roseburg-shooting-umpqua-community-college.html?_r=0) After reading this I have to agree, this country is falling apart… ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/2 "2015-10-07T20:59:26Z")
Unconvincing argument. While gun violence is a serious and significant issue, crime rates are falling for the most part. I personally don’t see more guns as a solution to the problem of mass shootings. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Pig](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c57346/32.png) [@Little\_Pig](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Pig)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/3 "2015-10-07T21:46:16Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Unconvincing argument. While gun violence is a serious and significant issue, crime rates are falling for the most part. I personally don’t see more guns as a solution to the problem of mass shootings. Well yeah. That was the whole point of my post. Others Do See More Guns as a solution to the problem of mass shootings. ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 10:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/4 "2015-10-07T22:05:47Z")
It’s foolish and self-destructive, but that’s just human nature. We do silly things like that. It isn’t anything that rises to the level of “The country is falling apart.” That should be reserved for things like John Adams’ presidency, when we almost had a civil war, or the Jefferson/Burr election, or…the real American Civil War. Little things like the sixties just don’t come up to that level, and certainly not today’s gun crisis. Alcohol is a worse social ill than guns are. (I’m strongly in favor of gun-control legislation!) ---
**Author:** ![VarlosZ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d78d45/32.png) [@VarlosZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VarlosZ)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2015, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/5 "2015-10-07T22:53:05Z")
[QUOTE=Telemark[/quote] I personally don’t see more guns as a solution to the problem of mass shootings. [/QUOTE] In the sense that there would be more shootings overall, but these kinds of one-man terror attacks would be deterred or stopped in their tracks? ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2015, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/6 "2015-10-09T18:23:01Z")
> [@VarlosZ](#): > > I personally don’t see more guns as a solution to the problem of mass shootings. In the sense that there would be more shootings overall, but these kinds of one-man terror attacks would be deterred or stopped in their tracks? [/QUOTE] Even as pro-gun as I am, I can’t see more guns helping. Person A manages to shoot the bad guy. Person B comes into the room and sees Person A shoot the bad guy. Person B doesn’t know the bad guy is the bad guy, shoots Person A. We can’t have a bunch of unqualified people firing at each other. ---
**Author:** ![control-z](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/eada6e/32.png) [@control-z](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/control-z)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2015, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/7 "2015-10-09T18:33:43Z")
Wow the quoting got really messed up on that. I don’t even remember quoting a post. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2015, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/8 "2015-10-09T19:37:35Z")
I don’t understand why the response to bad people shooting innocents being “I need to defend myself” causes you to think the country is falling apart? How else is one supposed to defend against an armed killer? Should every lower class Oregonian hire a full time bodyguard? You might disagree with their logic, but how is it indicative of the country “falling apart”? ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2015, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/9 "2015-10-09T20:03:58Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > I don’t understand why the response to bad people shooting innocents being “I need to defend myself” causes you to think the country is falling apart? How else is one supposed to defend against an armed killer? Should every lower class Oregonian hire a full time bodyguard? > > You might disagree with their logic, but how is it indicative of the country “falling apart”? I think the “falling apart” thing is that so many people feel like they need guns to defend themselves. Or perhaps that so many people think that the solution to gun violence is doubling down on more guns. Also, when you compare the US against the relatively strict gun laws in most of the rest of the modern world, it does seem a bit crazy that we are so into guns. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2015, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/10 "2015-10-09T20:54:34Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > It’s foolish and self-destructive, but that’s just human nature. We do silly things like that. > > It isn’t anything that rises to the level of “The country is falling apart.” That should be reserved for things like John Adams’ presidency, when we almost had a civil war, or the Jefferson/Burr election, or…the real American Civil War. > > Little things like the sixties just don’t come up to that level, and certainly not today’s gun crisis. Alcohol is a worse social ill than guns are. > > (I’m strongly in favor of gun-control legislation!) Hell, you could argue this country started “falling” apart right away, what with the Alien and Sedition Acts. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2015, 11:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/11 "2015-10-09T23:50:03Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > In the sense that there would be more shootings overall, but these kinds of one-man terror attacks would be deterred or stopped in their tracks? Even as pro-gun as I am, I can’t see more guns helping. Person A manages to shoot the bad guy. Person B comes into the room and sees Person A shoot the bad guy. Person B doesn’t know the bad guy is the bad guy, shoots Person A. We can’t have a bunch of unqualified people firing at each other. [/QUOTE] This scenario would occur with surprisingly lack of frequency. Person A comes in and shoots clerk; Mgr. comes out and shoots Person A. Person B comes in and sees Person A being shot by Mgr. 1. Bullet-riddled Person A is a stranger or disgruntled ex-employee. 2. Case closed. It doesn’t take a rocket surgeon. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [October 9, 2015, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/12 "2015-10-09T23:51:48Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > I don’t understand why the response to bad people shooting innocents being “I need to defend myself” causes you to think the country is falling apart? How else is one supposed to defend against an armed killer? Should every lower class Oregonian hire a full time bodyguard? Of course not…they are to call the police! [chortle/guffaw/snort :p}. ETA: I love cops. I just realize that their agenda may be at odds with mine, and 99.999999% of the time their availability will be nowhere near the level of mine. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [October 10, 2015, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/13 "2015-10-10T01:33:45Z")
Oh hell, the country has _always_ been “falling apart” – that is, there have been Chicken Littles in the Republic since Day One. I think the US is going in a generally positive direction myself. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2015, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/14 "2015-10-20T00:08:42Z")
> [@control-z](#): > > We can’t have a bunch of unqualified people firing at each other. I’d bet a dollar to a donut that unqualified people would not be firing at others. ---
**Author:** ![Fubaya](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c2a13f/32.png) [@Fubaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fubaya)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2015, 1:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/15 "2015-10-20T01:18:19Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > I’d bet a dollar to a donut that unqualified people would not be firing at others. In my experience, the vast majority of them are highly unqualified. There are very very few CCW carriers that I would feel comfortable firing anywhere within a mile of me. ---
**Author:** ![Omar\_Little](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/omar_little/32/269_2.png) [@Omar\_Little](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Omar_Little)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2015, 2:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/16 "2015-10-20T14:40:16Z")
If the media didn’t publicize these events nationally, then other insane people wouldn’t get the idea of getting their 30 minutes of fame before they go out in a blaze of idiocy. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2015, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/17 "2015-10-20T15:32:59Z")
> [@DrCube](#): > > I don’t understand why the response to bad people shooting innocents being “I need to defend myself” causes you to think the country is falling apart? How else is one supposed to defend against an armed killer? Should every lower class Oregonian hire a full time bodyguard? Why, is someone about to shoot every lower class Oregonian? It must be pretty damn scary, living in such a dangerous place that you need a gun to defend yourself. Most places in the U.S. aren’t like that. Do we need to send a peacekeeping force to Oregon? ---
**Author:** ![Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kolak_of_twilo/32/73_2.png) [@Kolak\_of\_Twilo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kolak_of_Twilo)\ **Post date:** [October 20, 2015, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-this-country-falling-apart/733859/18 "2015-10-20T15:38:53Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > It doesn’t take a rocket surgeon. This. 😃