# I see we are not the only country with our race relations askew. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 18, 2005, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878 "2005-04-18T13:10:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ea5d25/32.png) [@Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Scrappy_Hero_Pup)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/21 "2005-04-18T17:50:58Z")
> [@](#): > > Middleton Technology College headteacher Allison Crompton confirmed that braided hairstyles were generally banned in the school but she would make exceptions for hairstyles which are a reflection of cultural heritage rather than a fashion statement. I base it on this. The rule is: no hairstyle extremes. The exception is: unless it’s cultural. I attended boarding school complete with school jacket and school tie and all the other trappings of preppiedom and our policy was similar. As far as banning “street culture,” I say bravo. Sure, in some places street = “stereotypically ‘black,’” but that’s not exclusively the case. And it’s sound policy to ban the trappings of thuggery, regardless of the ethnic group with which it is associated. Was this handled well? I really don’t know, but I would say that, given the flap, it could have been handled better. And I’m curious to know why she can’t take it out for two weeks. ---
**Author:** ![holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e95f7d/32.png) [@holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/holmes)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/22 "2005-04-18T17:51:27Z")
What this thread shows me that we as Americans are still trapped in sins of our forefathers. This isn’t about African-Americans, this is the UK, which has people from Africa, and the Caribbean which treats braided hair the way the Scotts treat Kilts. Is it part of their culture…we Americans are bastards of the world and have gone out of our way to boil every bit of the cultural uniqueness of our forebearers into a grey, pasty mush. > [@](#): > > Afro-Caribbean background are allowed to attend the school with similar hairstyles because it reflects their cultural heritage. > > The teenager usually has her hair brushed straight but had it braided during a family holiday. Three guesses where the teenager had a vacation at? Perhaps somewhere where Afro-Caribbean culture is dominant? She had her hair braided, lying on the beach or something; happens everyday. The mistake the school made, was linking the braids to “street” culture. I wouldn’t be surprised if one of the black kids complained about the girls braids. Either because she stepped on their toes, or because they weren’t allowed to have “street culture braids” either, because they weren’t culturally allowed to either, despite their blackness. If the school **only** allows those 2 Afro-Caribbean students wear braids and not any other student regardless of the color of their skin, then this is the usual knee-jerk reverse racism crap we always see. A white person appears to be denied a ‘right’, that a non-white person appears to be enjoying…unaware that other non-white people aren’t getting ‘special’ treatment either. Try this, the school has a dress code and girl’s dresses can’t be above the shin. I walk in wearing my Kilt which is above the knee; being a Scott, I am allowed to wear my cultural garment. You not a Scott or a Celt and walk in tomorrow wearing a kilt, and are sent home because it’s above the knee. Are you being discriminated against? ---
**Author:** ![Contrapuntal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e274bd/32.png) [@Contrapuntal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Contrapuntal)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/23 "2005-04-18T17:55:14Z")
[QUOTE] > [@\*\*Happy Scrappy Hero Pup\*\*](#): > > I base it on this. > The rule is: no hairstyle extremes. > The exception is: unless it’s cultural. Fine, but where do you see that they \*petitioned for and were granted \* an exception? ---
**Author:** ![kezami](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eb8c5e/32.png) [@kezami](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kezami)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/24 "2005-04-18T18:07:10Z")
Her family went on a beach vacation, probably to the caribbean, and the girl got her hair beaded. What’s the big freakin’ deal. My 12-year-old has gotten it done on a couple vacations. It’s a nice souvenir for as long as it lasts, which is a couple weeks or so. She’s attending the wrong school, I guess. What is the school’s policy for hairstyles anyway? It’s definitely neat and tidy. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ea5d25/32.png) [@Happy\_Scrappy\_Hero\_Pup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Scrappy_Hero_Pup)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/25 "2005-04-18T18:10:23Z")
My apologies. Looking back, I realize that it’s easy to pass of my deduction as fact. Allow me to amend to “I’m willing to bet that” the students who are permittied these braids had to be exempted from a no-braid policy. I’d love to know for sure, though. Can we get a rulebook from the school? ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/26 "2005-04-18T19:50:01Z")
If someone wanted to show up for school in a Kilt, I wouldn’t care. If they showed up with no underwear, I might. 🙂 But cornrows are just another hairstyle and not a aprticularly odd one at that. If the school is getting so anal retentive that it starts regulating how students may decorate themselves that chosely, it’s gone way too far. ---
**Author:** ![GorillaMan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/50afbb/32.png) [@GorillaMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GorillaMan)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/27 "2005-04-18T19:58:14Z")
> [@Happy Scrappy Hero Pup](#): > > Can we get a rulebook from the school? I just went googling to see if the school had a website, and couldn’t find one…but I did find [this](http://www.standards.dfes.gov.uk/genderandachievement/goodpractice/secondarycs/secondarycs1/?version=1) unrelated piece, which is about the school in question, and includes this from the head: > [@](#): > > School uniform, worn correctly, is also vital as minor variations are used by students to identify ‘gangs’ and bring ‘street culture’ and intimidation into school. I wonder if there’s more to the braids than the news stories are saying? ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 8:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/28 "2005-04-18T20:18:45Z")
> [@GorillaMan](#): > > [this](http://www.standards.dfes.gov.uk/genderandachievement/goodpractice/secondarycs/secondarycs1/?version=1) unrelated piece, which is about the school in question, and includes this from the head: > > > [@](#): > > > > School uniform, worn correctly, is also vital as minor variations are used by students to identify ‘gangs’ and bring ‘street culture’ and intimidation into school. > > I wonder if there’s more to the braids than the news stories are saying? Yes. The secret is out. It’s the Lady Kung Fu Gang. They whip their heads about until the beads become lethal weapons moving faster than the speed of light. Or maybe the secret is that the black girls get to be in a high achieving school _and_ a gang and the white girls do not. Or maybe the headteacher has the biggest stick imaginable stuck up his or her butt and it is poking him/her in the brain and stirring up stupid sentiments. Sentiments like cornrows are an extreme hairdo from the culture of the street. ---
**Author:** ![holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e95f7d/32.png) [@holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/holmes)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/29 "2005-04-18T20:35:21Z")
> [@](#): > > Middleton Technology School has 1,073 pupils and numbers have risen in recent years. There are more boys than girls in all years. Pupils are mainly of white United Kingdom background and there are small numbers of pupils of black Caribbean, black African, Asian, Chinese pupils and white European backgrounds. A small number of pupils have English as an additional language, but none are in the early stages of English language acquisition. A very > small number of pupils are from refugee and traveller families. The proportion of pupils entitled to free school meals is broadly average and it is falling. The school is in a socially deprived area and one in which levels of unemployment are high. The percentage of pupils with statements of special educational needs is close to average and is rising slowly. The percentage on the school’s register of special educational needs is below average. The areas of pupils needs are mainly for dyslexia, moderate learning difficulties and emotional and behavioural difficulties. Attainment on entry to the school is below average, but it is rising. Pupils’ literacy skills are below average and the proportion of higher attaining pupils entering the school is below average. The attainment on entry of the year group of pupils who took their GCSE examinations in 2002 was well below average Okay so assuming that they have more than just the 2 African-Caribbean students, who most likely had to request an ‘pass’ on the extreme hair rules…I don’t see as a ‘pick on the white girl’ issue. I would imagine the same thing would happen if an African-Caribbean student walked in with a blonde process. Secondly cornrows aren’t just a hairstyle, they have a history West Africa and are used to confer everything from a social event to social standing. It’s more just a hair style to some people, the same way that side payot are more than long curly sideburns to some Chassidic Jews. ---
**Author:** ![holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e95f7d/32.png) [@holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/holmes)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/30 "2005-04-18T20:36:51Z")
Forgot the cite[School](http://64.233.179.104/search?q=cache:Vl8UOCerumEJ:www.ofsted.gov.uk/reports/105/105842.pdf+Middleton+Technology+School+school+size&hl=en) ---
**Author:** ![zagloba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/977dab/32.png) [@zagloba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zagloba)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/31 "2005-04-18T22:33:25Z")
This [BBC Article](http://newswww.bbc.net.uk/1/low/education/4361791.stm) quotes the schools rule as “cannot have their head shaved or wear extreme hair fashions of any sort.” The school spokesman says, “The school has firm and clear rules about what hairstyles are acceptable, which are communicated to all pupils and parents.” I’d like to see the actual wording of the rule – “no extreme hair fashions” is not sufficiently clear and specific. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 11:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/32 "2005-04-18T23:26:21Z")
I see dread people. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Carrot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f0a364/32.png) [@Captain\_Carrot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Carrot)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/33 "2005-04-18T23:35:32Z")
Oww! That was horrible! ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2005, 11:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/34 "2005-04-18T23:39:26Z")
> [@zagloba](#): > > This [BBC Article](http://newswww.bbc.net.uk/1/low/education/4361791.stm) quotes the schools rule as “cannot have their head shaved or wear extreme hair fashions of any sort.” The school spokesman says, “The school has firm and clear rules about what hairstyles are acceptable, which are communicated to all pupils and parents.” I’d like to see the actual wording of the rule – “no extreme hair fashions” is not sufficiently clear and specific. Because cornrows are NOT “extreme hair fashions”. Unless in England cornrows and mohawks are somehow equivalent in extremness. Are afros allowed or do white people need a dispensation to wear that too? ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 12:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/35 "2005-04-19T00:08:30Z")
When I was in high school, my orchestra had a strict dress code. Braids were allowed (would have been damn near impossible to ban, seeing as how many of the students were black). But cornrows were a big no-no, for both black and white students. I don’t know why. They aren’t that much different than regular braids. ---
**Author:** ![Biggirl](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/biggirl/32/3294_2.png) [@Biggirl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Biggirl)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/36 "2005-04-19T00:15:19Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > When I was in high school, my orchestra had a strict dress code. Braids were allowed (would have been damn near impossible to ban, seeing as how many of the students were black). But cornrows were a big no-no, for both black and white students. > > I don’t know why. They aren’t that much different than regular braids. Because braids are regular while cornrows are black. Black people have cornrows and thats baaaaaaad. ---
**Author:** ![Cervaise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cervaise/32/16693_2.png) [@Cervaise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cervaise)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 1:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/37 "2005-04-19T01:24:35Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > Are afros allowed or do white people need a dispensation to wear that too? What about Isros? ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/38 "2005-04-19T01:56:23Z")
What’s the difference between braids and cornrows? (Aren’t cornrows usually beaded?) ---
**Author:** ![zagloba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/977dab/32.png) [@zagloba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/zagloba)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/39 "2005-04-19T01:58:25Z")
> [@Biggirl](#): > > Because cornrows are NOT “extreme hair fashions”. Unless in England cornrows and mohawks are somehow equivalent in extremness. Are afros allowed or do white people need a dispensation to wear that too? I agree with you. Sorry, I can see how my post was ambiguous. I meant that the rule was too vague to interpret it as prohibiting cornrows. I like how she looks with the braids – though that’s irrelevant to her right to wear them. ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [April 19, 2005, 2:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878/40 "2005-04-19T02:09:27Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > What’s the difference between braids and cornrows? (Aren’t cornrows usually beaded?) Cornrows are a style of braiding. Instead of long braids coming directly out of the scalp, they’re braided against the scalp, like lots and lots of tiny french braids. Personally, I think cornrows are a very attractive hairstyle. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-see-we-are-not-the-only-country-with-our-race-relations-askew/299878.md?page=3)