# I support our troops **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 11, 2004, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308 "2004-12-11T13:21:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![chula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a4c791/32.png) [@chula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chula)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 10:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/21 "2004-12-11T22:57:04Z")
> [@furt](#): > > Not quite; she was pointing out that the desire was the same: silencing dissent. Once again, expressing a desire to silence opposing viewpoints is not at all the same as acting on that desire by using violence. > [@](#): > > I dispute it. I’ve known plenty of people who think of themselves as tolerant and open minded who aren’t at all, and can indeed get physically angry. All tolerant and open-minded people are non-violent hippies in your book? Find me someone who describes herself as a “non-violent hippie” and who engages in physical violence and I’ll agree that that person is a hypocrite. There is no evidence that **Razishlyat** falls in that category. ---
**Author:** ![chula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a4c791/32.png) [@chula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chula)\ **Post date:** [December 11, 2004, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/22 "2004-12-11T23:10:01Z")
> [@Bob55](#): > > Unless like me you work in a research lab, in which case you are more likely to be attacked by the left-wing radical groups [ALF or ELF](http://www.furcommission.com/attack/) Your point is that some people who consider themselves left-wing condone violence? Do you think that this differs from what I said? ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/23 "2004-12-12T01:47:07Z")
> [@furt](#): > > Great username. I love Red Meat. > > Sad that you’re not capable of intelligent and reasoned discourse. Milkman Dan, I recommend you try to engage in a more “grown-up” style of discussion if you intend to cough up the fifteen bucks to stay here. We don’t really go in for loud, unreasoned yelling. ---
**Author:** ![Mississippienne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d2c977/32.png) [@Mississippienne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mississippienne)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 3:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/24 "2004-12-12T03:15:41Z")
> [@chula](#): > > Once again, expressing a desire to silence opposing viewpoints is not at all the same as acting on that desire by using violence. I don’t see how this makes **Razishlyat** morally superior to the people with “SOT” stickers. So far as I can tell, they’ve done no physical harm to him/her or his/her property. They’re expressing their opinions. We’re allowed to do that, you know. But why is it okay for \*\*Razishlyat \*\* to think they’re so awful for it and it’s okay for him to wish to silence them, but it’s not okay for them to (hypothetically) think the same way about **Razishlyat** ’s opinions and wish to silence them. I’m an atheist. I’m very passionate about my rights in a largely-religious country. But that doesn’t mean I want to see harm come to Christian churches. I don’t want to burn their Bibles. When I see someone with a Jesus Saves bumper-sticker, I don’t wish to rip it off, even though I may find it personally offensive. That’s something that person believes. Who am I to judge? Remember now, no one has actually ever torn any stickers off **Razishlyat** ’s car. Someone might, someone might not. But he/she is angry about something that may happen, not something that has. \*\*Razishlyat \*\* is upset about the possibility of his opinions being destroyed. But then he turns around and expresses a wish to deface the opinions of others. I don’t understand why this is okay. ---
**Author:** ![Roland\_Orzabal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c2a13f/32.png) [@Roland\_Orzabal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roland_Orzabal)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/25 "2004-12-12T03:32:49Z")
I personally support the troops by not wanting them to go die for no reason. Apparently, from what I’ve been hearing from the morons at work, my position does not qualify as “support”, and is in fact the opposite. I am therefore left to conclude that “I support our troops” is a code phrase among these people that means “I want our troops to go die in pointless wars”. I find that a touch unsettling. I hope none of these folks ever decide to “support” me. For what it’s worth, the one guy who vociferously defended me in that little debate was a National Guardsman who’d returned three months ago from service in Iraq. He didn’t seem to want that kind of “support” either. Just my own two cents. ---
**Author:** ![Bob55](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Bob55](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bob55)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 7:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/26 "2004-12-12T07:56:00Z")
> [@chula](#): > > Your point is that some people who consider themselves left-wing condone violence? Do you think that this differs from what I said? My point was that some of us (researchers, SUV drivers, non-vegans, logging companies) are more likely to be attacked by left-wing radicals. Your post implies that only right-wing radicals do the killing in this country and I was just offering examples of where this isn’t true. ---
**Author:** ![Largo62](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/45deac/32.png) [@Largo62](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Largo62)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 8:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/27 "2004-12-12T08:22:15Z")
> [@Agrippina](#): > > Well the “flag” fad is generally over (although I still sometimes see trucks covered with American flags). Now something else must come along. After 9/11 everybody had flags everywhere, but as soon as something else comes along it’s time to take those flags off/down and replace it with the newest fad (in this case, yellow ribbons and/or those ‘W’ Bush stickers). I still have a discreet little flag in the rear window of my car. In the area where I live, where every other car is a truck and most have BUSH/CHENEY bumper stickers (the permanent ones) it was as much a matter of self preservsation as patriotism. I do have a patriotic feeling for my country, but I haven’t been happy with its leadership for some time. Nevertheless the flag stays. My tires are still inflated, thank you. ---
**Author:** ![chula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a4c791/32.png) [@chula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chula)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 9:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/28 "2004-12-12T09:13:55Z")
> [@Bob55](#): > > My point was that some of us (researchers, SUV drivers, non-vegans, logging companies) are more likely to be attacked by left-wing radicals. Your post implies that only right-wing radicals do the killing in this country and I was just offering examples of where this isn’t true. Killing? I wasn’t talking about murder, but now that you mention it, right-wing radicals have been responsible for many deaths in this country (abortion clinics, Oklahoma City, the death penalty, etc.), whereas left-wing radicals committing murder is something we haven’t experienced in a very long time. My post in no way implies what you said, since I explicitly stated that there are left-wing groups that believe that violence is a legitimate means of effecting social change. If you are too stupid to read the posts you respond to you have no business posting here. For the record, I do not consider animal rights to be a left-wing cause at all. As a progressive, I am offended by the way animal rights activists try to latch on to progressive movements. If they ever gain enough power where they threaten my right to eat meat I will go after them. I wish they weren’t giving us real leftists a bad name. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 9:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/29 "2004-12-12T09:32:53Z")
**furt** , this is the Pit. Calling for cites really isn’t that clever. > [@](#): > > Putting a fucking magnet on your car has got to be the most passive “support” I’ve ever seen. It’s a magnet! It doesn’t even have the permanence of an actual bumper sticker. You’ve paid your dollar and slapped a ribbon on your car’s butt and now you not only have a clear conscience but the moral highground? Nicely put. Not that going whole hog and putting a real sticker on there does anything either. I do often think people do this just so they can lecture others about patriotism whenever the opportunity presents itself. ---
**Author:** ![Bob55](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e9c0ed/32.png) [@Bob55](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bob55)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2004, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/30 "2004-12-12T21:47:54Z")
> [@chula](#): > > If you are too stupid to read the posts you respond to you have no business posting here. I’ve never seen anyone get so angry for absolutley no reason, I thought we were discussing something and then _BAM_ out of the blue you attack me. A true sign of a weak mind. Please, stay out of the other forums, you’re a BBQ Pit type of guy. Reread your quote or is your head too thick to understand something you yourself wrote? > [@](#): > > Since I know of no right-wing pacifists, it’s safe to say that you are more likely to be victim of a violent attack from a right-wing person than a left-wing person. Can’t get more straight-forward to that. Good day. ---
**Author:** ![WeRSauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f19dbf/32.png) [@WeRSauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WeRSauron)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2004, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/31 "2004-12-13T05:54:56Z")
That’s funny: I’ve never heard of anyone’s propety being vandalized because of leftist propaganda thereon. Is there a _rational_ reason to fear right-wing reaction? Where I live, there are tons of yellow ribbon bumper stickers. There are also cars with anti-war slogans, anti-Bush slogans, Kerry/Edwards stickers, etc. I’ve even seen anti-Israel stickers. Everyone lives in peace - although they may not agree. Bush cars drive alonside Kerry cars. This characterization of rightists by leftists as prone to violence bothers me. Last time I checked, it was leftists (of whatever intensity) who has violent, crass, rude, and offensive demonstrations. WRS ---
**Author:** ![kka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/54ee81/32.png) [@kka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kka)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2004, 6:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/32 "2004-12-13T06:09:19Z")
> [@Bad News Baboon](#): > > It said something sarcastic along these lines: > “I support our troops, but only as long as it doesn’t actually damage my car”. I would **so** buy this bumper sticker! ---
**Author:** ![Excalibre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/898d66/32.png) [@Excalibre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Excalibre)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2004, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/33 "2004-12-13T13:00:10Z")
> [@WeRSauron](#): > > This characterization of rightists by leftists as prone to violence bothers me. Last time I checked, it was leftists (of whatever intensity) who has violent, crass, rude, and offensive demonstrations. > > WRS Uh, what? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2004, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/34 "2004-12-13T14:17:21Z")
> [@WeRSauron](#): > > This characterization of rightists by leftists as prone to violence bothers me. Last time I checked, it was leftists (of whatever intensity) who has violent, crass, rude, and offensive demonstrations. Yeah, those demonstrations are every bit the moral equivalent of an unprovoked, unnecessary war. Lordy, lordy, how many tens of thousands of innocent people have been killed in anti-war demonstrations? When will the carnage end? ---
**Author:** ![Debaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/3da27b/32.png) [@Debaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Debaser)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2004, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/35 "2004-12-13T22:00:39Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Yeah, those demonstrations are every bit the moral equivalent of an unprovoked, unnecessary war. This is great. To all those on the loony left: Please continue to use the fact that you don’t like the war to justify acting like spoiled children having a temper tantrum. Make sure lots of people see you doing it. Get on the news. Do it more when there’s an election near. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2004, 10:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/36 "2004-12-13T22:25:35Z")
And to those on the bloodthirsty right, you have your own opportunity to get your view across. Join [www.protestwarrior.com](http://www.protestwarrior.com) and show the world that we are, in fact, a nation of trigger-happy yahoos! ---
**Author:** ![PinkMarabou](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ec9cab/32.png) [@PinkMarabou](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PinkMarabou)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2004, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/37 "2004-12-13T22:48:23Z")
> [@Roland Orzabal](#): > > I personally support the troops by not wanting them to go die for no reason. Apparently, from what I’ve been hearing from the morons at work, my position does not qualify as “support”, and is in fact the opposite. I am therefore left to conclude that “I support our troops” is a code phrase among these people that means “I want our troops to go die in pointless wars”. I agree with you 100% on this. “Support Our Troops” has basically been equated to “Support Bush & His War Games”. There is a certain smugness with this whole yellow-ribbon craze. My message to them, why are you sitting in your safe homes and cars and not over there risking YOUR lives to fight in this war you “support”? If that’s what you mean by “support”, go enlist - they’re begging for people right now. With all the people who “support” (by the flooding of these yellow ribbon magnets), there should be no issues with shortages of soldiers. These people fall in one of two (or both) categories: - Johnny-Come-Latelies - Hypocrites :mad: ---
**Author:** ![Bad\_News\_Baboon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5fc32e/32.png) [@Bad\_News\_Baboon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bad_News_Baboon)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2004, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/38 "2004-12-13T23:24:24Z")
> [@kka](#): > > I would **so** buy this bumper sticker! yeah, me too.! Well, except it might, you know, ruin my paint job or something. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![MLS](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/919ad9/32.png) [@MLS](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MLS)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2004, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/39 "2004-12-13T23:52:43Z")
> [@PinkMarabou](#): > > My message to them, why are you sitting in your safe homes and cars and not over there risking YOUR lives to fight in this war you “support”? If that’s what you mean by “support”, go enlist - they’re begging for people right now. With all the people who “support” (by the flooding of these yellow ribbon magnets), there should be no issues with shortages of soldiers. > > These people fall in one of two (or both) categories: > > - Johnny-Come-Latelies > - Hypocrites > > :mad: Yeah, well, there is not too much call for people of my age, gender and state of physical (dis)ability. So I just support groups that provide material things of aid and comfort to our people over there. And I work and pay my taxes. That o.k. with you? Or am I still a hypocrite? BTW, I don’t have a mag ribbon on my car, I have a bumper sticker for [AnySoldier.com](http://anysoldier.com) ---
**Author:** ![MXR90](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c0e974/32.png) [@MXR90](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MXR90)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2004, 3:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308/40 "2004-12-14T03:38:00Z")
> [@Mississippienne](#): > > Okay, I’m confused here. The OP complains about being afraid of harrassment if he(she?) expresses his/her opinion in bumpersticker form. But then the OP expresses a wish to destroy the bumperstickers of other people because they express an opinion he/she does not agree with. > > Why doesn’t it work both ways, **Razishlyat**? If people want to put “I Support the Troops” or “Bush 4Evah” or “I (Fellate) Rumsfeld” stickers on their car, that’s their right to personal expression. They don’t need your permission to do so. But why is it okay for you to detest their opinion and wish to see their stickers destroyed, but it’s not okay for them to feel the same way about your opinion and stickers? > > Even if you are, as you say, a non-violent hippie, the urge is still there. What makes it okay for you to want to suppress their mode of expression but not okay for them to do the same to you? Would it not be better to understand that other people feel differantly from you and they, too, wish to express their feelings (in what sounds like a pretty harmless manner). Now you’re confusing things with logic, and you know that will never do! 😛 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-our-troops/279308.md?page=3)