# I support the cause of the pro-Palestinian protestors **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [April 27, 2024, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841 "2024-04-27T14:24:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2024, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/1 "2024-04-27T14:24:26Z")
I do have some caveats. First off, I support putting pressure on Israel to cease fire in Gaza, IMO that is a just cause. That would be primarily for the purpose of providing food and medical aid to Gazans. I have no doubt that Hamas will take advantage of a cease fire for their evil purposes so it can’t be a total cease fire and withdrawal from Gaza, but the current situation is harming far more people than can be justified. I expect Israel to continue to hunt down and kill members of Hamas. So a cease fire will have conditions. And any future chance for a future of peace in the region desperately needs an end to escalation of hostilities there. Second, a major motivating factor behind the protests spreading across college campuses is springtime. College students will go outside and protest anything given a popular motivation. Trying to crack down on such protests is counter-productive. That just provides further motivation as the protestors feel that their right to free speech is under attack. We are talking about young stupid people surging with hormones. They don’t understand that given a choice of liver and onions or lutefisk to eat that chanting “We want a cheesesteak!” is not going to result in a cheesesteak for dinner. The rest of us need to remember that we were once young and stupid too and didn’t know how conceive of productive, realistic compromises that provide solutions. But someone still has to apply the pressure to change the menu to include better choices, otherwise it’s too easy to complacently to sit and hope it gets better. Now I also realize that there are external factors at play. Antisemitic and pro-terrorist influences are at play here. We the adults have allowed severe pollution of public discourse with ‘fake news’. It’s no surprise that it’s more difficult than ever for American youth to work out the nitty gritty details of political issues. The anti-war movement in the 60s included radical groups that didn’t represent the American public at large or in the anti-war movement itself. However, tarring the whole effort with the bad intentions of a minority isn’t going to work any better than arresting protestors. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2024, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/2 "2024-04-27T16:05:38Z")
I ‘support’ the pro-Palestinian protests to some degree as well, but for another reason: I think it’s finally forced both sides of the “free-speech” debate to face up to their hypocrisy: The conservatives who previously agitated for years about how free speech belongs on college campuses, are now hypocritically cracking down on free speech by pro-Palestine protestors. The liberals who previously tried to muzzle free speech on campuses, are now getting a taste of what it’s like to not be allowed to have free speech on campus. And lastly, this war is finally forcing people to stop conflating “anti-Israel-policies” with “anti-Semitism,” an ever-popular tactic. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2024, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/3 "2024-04-27T17:46:58Z")
I don’t support their cause, but I do support their exposing college admins as just another bunch of craven make-line-go-up-no-matter-what capitalist sociopaths. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2024, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/4 "2024-04-28T20:21:28Z")
Here is an interesting article- [https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/27/opinions/yale-student-palestinian-protests-berlin/index.html?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR3NrlRbYKQpm19bDqwPMEuaPI1dGeeLZCu3ScpE1vZO5vcw6oCZ74xJWMM\_aem\_ASbAZL3YTniQZmGlNUlziGXnGix\_x17672WLPKR6W6twWcpveza2yot4EN96MyX3pOUNZdqJKaQPrJMoab0DcRdK](https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/27/opinions/yale-student-palestinian-protests-berlin/index.html?fbclid=IwZXh0bgNhZW0CMTEAAR3NrlRbYKQpm19bDqwPMEuaPI1dGeeLZCu3ScpE1vZO5vcw6oCZ74xJWMM_aem_ASbAZL3YTniQZmGlNUlziGXnGix_x17672WLPKR6W6twWcpveza2yot4EN96MyX3pOUNZdqJKaQPrJMoab0DcRdK) But this is odd- _to demand that Yale divest the portion of its endowment invested in the stocks of [military contractors](https://www.cnn.com/2024/04/22/us/yale-pro-palestinian-protests-arrests/index.html), which make the weapons Israel is currently using in its war with Hamas in Gaza._ Umm, arent those the same companies that make the weapons we send to protect democracy in Ukraine and Taiwan?? ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2024, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/5 "2024-04-28T23:09:19Z")
Quite likely. There are multiple motivations behind the individuals in these protests. Some haven’t thought deeply enough about what they’re doing/protesting/demanding. Others might actually be hoping to influence things to their own ends, which might not be at all in our best interests. It’s complicated. People tend to want simple answers and clear causes but that’s not reality. ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2024, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/6 "2024-04-28T23:32:21Z")
I support their right to protest. I think university administrators calling in the police to arrest anyone not being violent are wrong in what they are doing. On the other hand, I don’t support their cause, because as pointed out, including in your own OP, as well as by Broomstick, it’s a complicated issue. > [@TriPolar](#): > > Now I also realize that there are external factors at play. Antisemitic and pro-terrorist influences are at play here. We the adults have allowed severe pollution of public discourse with ‘fake news’. It’s no surprise that it’s more difficult than ever for American youth to work out the nitty gritty details of political issues. The anti-war movement in the 60s included radical groups that didn’t represent the American public at large or in the anti-war movement itself. However, tarring the whole effort with the bad intentions of a minority isn’t going to work any better than arresting protestors. > [@Broomstick](#): > > There are multiple motivations behind the individuals in these protests. Some haven’t thought deeply enough about what they’re doing/protesting/demanding. Others might actually be hoping to influence things to their own ends, which might not be at all in our best interests. > > It’s complicated. People tend to want simple answers and clear causes but that’s not reality. IMHO complicated issues are poorly served by protests. Sure, it’s easy to say something like “I support getting Israeli forces to stop killing innocent Palestinians”. But that’s obviously not a simple thing given the entire picture. So on the whole, no I don’t support the protesters actual cause, which comes across to me as them taking sides with the Palestinians because the Palestinians are the underdogs. Maybe they’re doing a poor job in communicating what they want, but that’s the point the comes across to me from what I’ve read about the protests. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2024, 3:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/7 "2024-04-29T03:05:10Z")
> [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > IMHO complicated issues are poorly served by protests. Sure, it’s easy to say something like “I support getting Israeli forces to stop killing innocent Palestinians”. But that’s obviously not a simple thing given the entire picture. So on the whole, no I don’t support the protesters actual cause, which comes across to me as them taking sides with the Palestinians because the Palestinians are the underdogs. Yeah, and with more than a tinge of anti-semitism. Anyway, why protest here in America? We cant order the IDF to ceasefire. ---
**Author:** ![flurb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/51bf81/32.png) [@flurb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/flurb)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2024, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/8 "2024-04-29T03:17:47Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > And lastly, this war is finally forcing people to stop conflating “anti-Israel-policies” with “anti-Semitism,” an ever-popular tactic. Buddy, I got some bad news. . . ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2024, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/9 "2024-04-29T03:20:56Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > And lastly, this war is finally forcing people to stop conflating “anti-Israel-policies” with “anti-Semitism,” an ever-popular tactic. True, the two are not the same- I despise Netanyahu- that crook. But much like the “concerned” people over trans athletes there is a lot of bigotry in those protests too. By no means all or even a majority, but still it’s there. ---
**Author:** ![Boudicca90](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boudicca90/32/16818_2.png) [@Boudicca90](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Boudicca90)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2024, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/10 "2024-04-29T03:25:09Z")
I fully support the Palestinian people against the genocide and ethnic cleansing they have been suffering from at the hands of Israel. We need to cut off all aid and military support of Israel immediately, with major sanctions if they don’t adhere to a lasting ceasefire. I am really proud of college students all over the country, and fully support them as well. They deserve to be heard and their freedom of speech and assembly upheld. And they are certainly not stupid, brainwashed, funded by outside sources, or antisemitic. All these false accusations just do nothing but try to diminish the cause we are fighting for, which is the point of these insults. I’ve protested and marched side by side with many students and they are intelligent and well-informed. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2024, 8:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/11 "2024-04-29T08:52:06Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Anyway, why protest here in America? We cant order the IDF to ceasefire. We fund a lot of the Israeli military and send them money and weapons for “defense” that are now being used in an offensive manner. Universities, as well as others, invest in Israeli businesses and industries. We can’t stop the Israeli government or the IDF directly, but we can stop supporting them which will, due to the level of US support, most definitely have an impact. That is one (among many) reasons for the protests, to try to wield US influence to pressure the Israeli government to conduct things in a different manner. > [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > So on the whole, no I don’t support the protesters actual cause, which comes across to me as them taking sides with the Palestinians because the Palestinians are the underdogs. Maybe they’re doing a poor job in communicating what they want, but that’s the point the comes across to me from what I’ve read about the protests. Yes, there’s a certain thing in the US culture that really likes to root for the scrappy, oppressed underdog. The problem is when the “scrappy, oppressed underdog” are awful, nasty people. That’s another factor at work. Yes, there are communication problems. That’s in part because there are multiple motivations and positions. It’s also because a lot of people involved are inexperienced young adults who lack the years of experience in communicating to the public that PR professionals and politicians have. > [@Boudicca90](#): > > And they are certainly not stupid, brainwashed, funded by outside sources, or antisemitic. Please. While the majority of protestors are well-meaning people there are minority elements that are one or several or all of the above. We’re seeing bad behavior on both sides of this issue, as always happens with these situations. And I emphasize _on both sides_. Or all sides might be better but this doesn’t divide as neatly into two sides as some would like. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2024, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/12 "2024-04-29T19:24:56Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > We fund a lot of the Israeli military and send them money and weapons for “defense” that are now being used in an offensive manner. > > We can’t stop the Israeli government or the IDF directly, but we can stop supporting them which will, due to the level of US support, most definitely have an impact. Congress does, not the President. > [@Broomstick](#): > > The problem is when the “scrappy, oppressed underdog” are awful, nasty people. That’s another factor at work. Like terrorists? ---
**Author:** ![RitterSport](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rittersport/32/6326_2.png) [@RitterSport](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RitterSport)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2024, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/13 "2024-04-29T19:30:30Z")
This comic sums it up pretty well (if someone can figure out how to make the link last longer than a week, I’d appreciate it): [https://www.dailykos.com/blog/Tom%20Tomorrow](https://www.dailykos.com/blog/Tom%20Tomorrow) ETA: The one below also addresses the free speech question in hilarious fashion. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/14 "2024-04-30T05:45:40Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Umm, arent those the same companies that make the weapons we send to protect democracy in Ukraine and Taiwan?? They don’t depend on investments from these schools. The investment portfolios of these major schools should be examined, as should their accumulation of funds that aren’t education related. It’s going to have some influence on their institutional status in the future. > [@FlikTheBlue](#): > > On the other hand, I don’t support their cause, because as pointed out, including in your own OP, as well as by Broomstick, it’s a complicated issue. It is very complicated. For one thing the protestors have no clearly defined cause. I don’t believe for a moment that there are 10,000 serious members of Hamas and 2 million totally innocent Palestinians. There will be a gradation of terrorist support radiating form a hardcore terrorist base out to truly innocent people in the widespread population. That still means over 1 million innocent people at a minimum are forced into even worse conditions than they’ve endured in the past. I do believe we should be using our influence with Israel to change this situation. The Israeli position is that the war is justified by the horrific attack by Hamas last year. Their attack on Hamas is a just cause also. But even just causes have to be tempered by just realities. I am happy to see that the protestors right to free speech is being highly considered even by those who disagree with their cause. That’s the most important part to consider here, there may be even greater causes that we need the students of America to stand up for in the future. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/15 "2024-04-30T05:48:12Z")
> [@Boudicca90](#): > > We need to cut off all aid and military support of Israel immediately, with major sanctions if they don’t adhere to a lasting ceasefire. What happens if Hamas doesn’t adhere to lasting cease-fire? Remember, Hamas is an arm of Iran. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/16 "2024-04-30T20:22:22Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > What happens if Hamas doesn’t adhere to lasting cease-fire? Remember, Hamas is an arm of Iran. And what happens if Hamas refuses to release the hostages? Who are apparently being mistreated. Here is my deal- Hamas releases all hostages, along with any man who raped, tortured or beat those hostages. Then there is a cease fire. ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [April 30, 2024, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/17 "2024-04-30T20:36:46Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > Now I also realize that there are external factors at play. Antisemitic and pro-terrorist influences are at play here. Yeah. I have friends who are college students and care passionately about the protests. They are good people. Most of the protestors are good people, even if they may overestimate the value of protesting on an American college campus. But anti-Israeli protests attract antisemites. And for that matter, pro-Israeli activities attract racist assholes who hate brown people. So on the fringes of the protests, we get to see some pretty ugly activities, both antisemitic and generically bigoted. ---
**Author:** ![FinsToTheLeft](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finstotheleft/32/2930_2.png) [@FinsToTheLeft](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinsToTheLeft)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2024, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/18 "2024-05-01T00:49:10Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Here is my deal- Hamas releases all hostages, along with any man who raped, tortured or beat those hostages. Then there is a cease fire. Unfortunately most of them are already dead, so it’s not going to happen. This is one of the many reasons why I disagree with the premise of the OP. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2024, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/19 "2024-05-01T02:36:31Z")
> [@FinsToTheLeft](#): > > Unfortunately most of them are already dead, so it’s not going to happen. Well, at least the living ones. There is a decent peace offer now - [US, UK urge Hamas to accept Israeli truce proposal in war on Gaza | Israel-Palestine conflict News | Al Jazeera](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/4/29/us-uk-urge-hamas-to-accept-israeli-truce-proposal-in-war-on-gaza#:~:text=British%20Foreign%20Secretary%20David%20Cameron%20said%20on%20Monday%20that%20the,release%20of%20some%20Israeli%20captives). [News](https://www.aljazeera.com/news/)|[Israel War on Gaza](https://www.aljazeera.com/tag/israel-palestine-conflict/) # US, UK urge Hamas to accept Israeli truce proposal in war on Gaza _British Foreign Secretary David Cameron says the proposal includes a 40-day truce and the release of captives._ Published On 29 Apr 202429 Apr 2024 _The United States and the United Kingdom have urged Hamas to accept an Israeli proposal for a truce in the Gaza war and the release of some captives held in the besieged territory._ _British Foreign Secretary David Cameron said on Monday that the Israeli proposal delivered to Hamas includes a 40-day truce in the Gaza war and the release of “potentially thousands” of Palestinian prisoners in return for the release of some Israeli captives._.._.Speaking on Monday at a World Economic Forum (WEF) meeting in the capital of Saudi Arabia, Riyadh, Cameron described the offer as “generous”._ But to be honest i do not think Hamas will accept the deal, I do not think they want peace. So the protests are pointless. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [May 1, 2024, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841/20 "2024-05-01T05:19:41Z")
Netanyahu has said that deal or no deal, it’s still on in Rafah: > **[Netanyahu determined on Rafah offensive, with or without hostage deal](https://www.yahoo.com/news/netanyahu-determined-rafah-offensive-without-132955512.html)** > > Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's planned offensive on the southern Gaza Strip city of Rafah will go ahead whether or not a hostage agreement is made with Palestinian Islamist group Hamas, he told a meeting on Tuesday. "We will enter Rafah... Personally I’d be surprised if this doesn’t easily double the amount of civilian casualties. I’d love to be wrong. In the meantime, as regards protesters, I’m certainly supportive of their right to speak on subjects they are passionate about, even if it makes others uncomfortable. But I would hope that these protesters can also recognize when they are achieving diminishing returns. How many Palestinians were saved today by students in the US and Canada throwing their academic careers away? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-support-the-cause-of-the-pro-palestinian-protestors/1000841.md?page=2)