# I think Scott Walker lives here... Pay to Protest?! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [December 14, 2011, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205 "2011-12-14T18:05:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 6:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/1 "2011-12-14T18:05:15Z")
[http://dissenter.firedoglake.com/2011/12/03/occupy-and-gov-scott-walkers-proposed-pay-to-play-protesting-policy/](http://dissenter.firedoglake.com/2011/12/03/occupy-and-gov-scott-walkers-proposed-pay-to-play-protesting-policy/) > [@](#): > > Republican Governor Scott Walker has proposed a new policy “to require future protesters to pay in advance to stage an event, at a cost of $50 per hour, per Capitol Police officer.” Not only would protesters be on the hook for that, but they would also possibly have to pay for liability insurance or bond and even the cost of cleanup following the protest, according to the Milwaukee Journal Sentinel. > > […] > > The policy would require that any group of four or more people get a permit. Any group of more than 100 Wisconsinites would need to apply for a permit 72 hours in advance. …Yes, because Poll Taxes were also oh so constitutional. :rolleyes: Jesus christ, does this man know the meaning of the fucking first amendment? ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Lendervedder](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_lendervedder/32/8488_2.png) [@Happy\_Lendervedder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Lendervedder)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/2 "2011-12-14T18:39:15Z")
Wow. This guy is \*ridiculously \*tone deaf. There’s an active and extremely fired-up recall campaign aimed squarely at his dumb ass, and now he passes a policy that has “First Amendment violation” written all over it? Even if it passes a legal challenge, does he really want this kind of press leading up to a recall election? Too stupid to breathe. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/3 "2011-12-14T20:40:20Z")
Maybe I am wrong, but aren’t there places where if you schedule your march / demonstration you might have to pay a fee? There was the Tea Party rally with Trump: [http://www.postonpolitics.com/2011/06/tea-party-bailout-trump-to-pay-local-groups-disputed-6000-bill-for-boca-raton-rally-he-headlined/](http://www.postonpolitics.com/2011/06/tea-party-bailout-trump-to-pay-local-groups-disputed-6000-bill-for-boca-raton-rally-he-headlined/) If you have a rally or march that results in the need for cops, porta-potties, etc. - who is supposed to pay for it all? ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/happy_fun_ball/32/17664_2.png) [@Happy\_Fun\_Ball](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Fun_Ball)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/4 "2011-12-14T21:22:06Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > Maybe I am wrong, but aren’t there places where if you schedule your march / demonstration you might have to pay a fee? Yeah, maybe. But the first amendment does not state: > [@Walker's Constitution](#): > > Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble if they have several thousand dollars to pay for porta-potties and police, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances. ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/5 "2011-12-14T21:22:13Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > If you have a rally or march that results in the need for cops, porta-potties, etc. - who is supposed to pay for it all? Part of me agrees with that sentiment, but I think the proposal goes beyond that. This is the part that really sends red flags up for me: > [@linked article in OP](#): > > The policy would require that any group of four or more people get a permit. That’s absurd. Conceivably, even if the group doesn’t even require porta potties and the like, the state can fine a group of four people just for being near a state building. ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/6 "2011-12-14T21:38:48Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > Maybe I am wrong, but aren’t there places where if you schedule your march / demonstration you might have to pay a fee? There is a difference between a planned even (where you now have the right to sole use of the facility) and a protest. Protests are kind of an impromtu event and are disruptive by definition. This is a transparent attempt end protests. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/7 "2011-12-14T22:06:21Z")
> [@spooje](#): > > There is a difference between a planned even (where you now have the right to sole use of the facility) and a protest. > > Protests are kind of an impromtu event and are disruptive by definition. This is a transparent attempt end protests. Sure, but with modern tech, some “impromptu” protests like OWS are also partially planned. If you put 500 people in the park overnight in a protest, and the city has to bring in porta-potties and pay cops overtime - at what point does the city have the right to ask for a fee in compensation? I looked up what the City of LA requires: (PDF): [http://www.lapdonline.org/assets/pdf/New%20SEPU%20Application%2010-11-07.pdf](http://www.lapdonline.org/assets/pdf/New%20SEPU%20Application%2010-11-07.pdf) The only fee they discuss is for cleanup: > [@](#): > > ``` > Proof of payment of the clean up deposit paid to the Department of Public Works, Bureau of Street Services (if the event involves large animals, the sale of food/beverages or the erection of any structure) > > ``` ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/8 "2011-12-14T22:46:17Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > Sure, but with modern tech, some “impromptu” protests like OWS are also partially planned. If you put 500 people in the park overnight in a protest, and the city has to bring in porta-potties and pay cops overtime - at what point does the city have the right to ask for a fee in compensation? When it is an event and not an occupation. If you have to ask permission and apply for permit, _you are no longer protesting_. Protests HAVE to ruffle feathers, they HAVE to fly in the face of the powers that be. Protests, by their very nature, are disruptive. The point though, is that Walker’s plan is for a group to apply, _then be denied_. They are outlaws as soon as they show up. Which gives munincipalities all the cover they need to have the police crack down on them. ---
**Author:** ![Algher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Algher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Algher)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2011, 11:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/9 "2011-12-14T23:09:56Z")
> [@spooje](#): > > When it is an event and not an occupation. If you have to ask permission and apply for permit, _you are no longer protesting_. Protests HAVE to ruffle feathers, they HAVE to fly in the face of the powers that be. Protests, by their very nature, are disruptive. > > The point though, is that Walker’s plan is for a group to apply, _then be denied_. They are outlaws as soon as they show up. Which gives munincipalities all the cover they need to have the police crack down on them. My point is that municipalities already have a lot of that power. If 100 people show up to protest and block the street without a permit, they can be arrested. If they file their permit, they are not. This is already going on. We now have the “free speech zones” at large events like the the political national conventions. We have had parade permits for a long time. The occupy movement has shown that you can’t just wait for a protest to stop, sometimes they never stop. Where I live, they arrested a group of students protesting the Israeli ambassadors speech after proving that they students collaborated to disrupt (emails were collected as part of a search warrant). The students could not claim spontaneous protest when it was obvious that is was all pre-organized. Not defending any of this, but someone please tell me what ADDITIONAL restrictions Walker is throwing down that aren’t already in play across the US. If not, I will happily join in a debate regarding what are reasonable restrictions when the Nazis want to march in Illinois. We have to let them march, but does there come a point when we say either “no” or “only if you cover the costs of the cops.” ---
**Author:** ![armedmonkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@armedmonkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/armedmonkey)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/10 "2011-12-15T00:02:32Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > Not defending any of this, but someone please tell me what ADDITIONAL restrictions Walker is throwing down that aren’t already in play across the US. Well, he did define a protest as _four_ people. That’s a kinda laughable restriction, don’t you think? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/11 "2011-12-15T00:28:05Z")
The “$50 per cop per hour” thing caught my attention. Seems that might be a way to price permits out of the range of protestors. “You’re going to have about twenty protestors in front of the state house between two and three o’clock? Okay, we’re going to need 100 cops providing cover during that period, plus a two hour period both before and after the protest, for security reasons. Will you be paying that $25,000 in cash, or do you have a check?” ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/12 "2011-12-15T00:52:14Z")
Vladimir Putin says: " I strong endorse this law." I can hardly think of a better use of my tax money than to preserve our first amendment right to protest - and that strongly includes the right of people I disagree with to protest also. Apparently though we can’t afford liberty any more because it might mean rich people might have to pay more. I have an idea. Since newspapers and magazines are a major source of litter, and the government pays to clean it up, and the government can’t afford to do this any more, why not force publishers to get a stamp to help pay for cleanup. After all, this idea has a nice long [history.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stamp_Act_1765) ---
**Author:** ![Typo\_Negative](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/typo_negative/32/484_2.png) [@Typo\_Negative](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Typo_Negative)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/13 "2011-12-15T02:05:20Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > MyWe now have the “free speech zones” at large events like the the political national conventions. ." Do you know where the ‘free speech zones’ are? Out of the way, where no one attending can be bothered by them. Which makes any kind of protest there moot. Might as well stay home and suck it. Which was the point of ‘free speech zones’, to nullify any protests. That’s why we put the term in quotation marks. ---
**Author:** ![Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ccd318/32.png) [@Paul\_in\_Qatar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paul_in_Qatar)\ **Post date:** [December 15, 2011, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/14 "2011-12-15T02:24:50Z")
Gatherings the government likes will pay little or nothing. Gatherings the government do not like will be taxed into oblivion. Seems fairly obvious. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [December 18, 2011, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/15 "2011-12-18T02:16:26Z")
> [@Algher](#): > > The students could not claim spontaneous protest when it was obvious that is was all pre-organized. Why should a non-spontaneous protest be discriminated against? How bizarre! > [@](#): > > Not defending any of this, but someone please tell me what ADDITIONAL restrictions Walker is throwing down that aren’t already in play across the US. If not, I will happily join in a debate regarding what are reasonable restrictions when the Nazis want to march in Illinois. We have to let them march, but does there come a point when we say either “no” or “only if you cover the costs of the cops.” No, I don’t think so. ---
**Author:** ![Gedd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gedd/32/4938_2.png) [@Gedd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gedd)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/16 "2011-12-19T14:21:53Z")
So if you had a few thousand in the bank and wanted to protest the Gov S.W. himself just be sure you only have 99 people in your group. If a few dozen-dozen other groups of 99 people happen to show up at the same time, it’s not your fault! (Be sure all your planning is done via snail mail that you burn after reading and disposable cell phones). ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 19, 2011, 2:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/17 "2011-12-19T14:41:30Z")
I don’t really have a problem with any of it except the “security charge”. I’m pretty sure the government is _already_ paying people to keep the capitol building and its grounds secure. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [December 20, 2011, 9:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-think-scott-walker-lives-here-pay-to-protest/606205/18 "2011-12-20T09:12:30Z")
> [@Gedd](#): > > So if you had a few thousand in the bank and wanted to protest the Gov S.W. himself just be sure you only have 99 people in your group. If a few dozen-dozen other groups of 99 people happen to show up at the same time, it’s not your fault! (Be sure all your planning is done via snail mail that you burn after reading and disposable cell phones). Except you’ll never get the permit in the first place.