# I took a breathalyzer and got fired even though I clinically passed (legal question) **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [March 19, 2015, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406 "2015-03-19T18:28:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/41 "2015-03-20T15:04:36Z")
> [@TroutMan](#): > > Any reason as long as it’s not because they are part of a protected class. I don’t think buzzed or hungover is a protected class in any state. Actually, when I worked for a company that was headquartered in California, our HR Director told us that being an alcoholic was considered a “protected class”. I mean you can’t just show up drunk, run to HR yelling “SANCTUAAARY!!!” There is presumably some process where you need to make a declaration to HR and demonstrate that you are getting treatment. I don’t know the details. > [@Freddy\_the\_Pig](#): > > Why would anyone come into work “smelling like a brewery”? Is it that hard to take a shower, change your clothes, and swirl some mouthwash around in your mouth? I believe if you drank a lot, it can actually come out of your pores. > [@stillownedbysetters](#): > > The days of the 3-martini lunch and its cousins are over forever. With the increased emphasis on safety in the workplace, both for the employee and those who work around the employee, most companies in a right-to-work state, which Indiana is, would have let you go. I think this is a bit of a class indicator in modern society. If you work a blue collar job, chances are your company may have a zero tolerance policy regarding alcohol in the workplace which could result in immediate dismissal. However at pretty much any tech firm I’ve worked at, drinking is often actively encouraged in the form of after work happy hours or alcohol served towards the end of a workday on a Friday or before a company meeting. And if I walk into a Capital Grille in New York around lunch time, I see a lot of guys in suits with drinks. Now some of it is based on safety, as blue collar workers tend to work with machines and dangerous equipment. But in my observations, it seems consistent that the less money you make, the more controlling and intolerant employers tend to be of their employees. ---
**Author:** ![lorene](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/65b543/32.png) [@lorene](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lorene)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/42 "2015-03-20T15:13:59Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Now some of it is based on safety, as blue collar workers tend to work with machines and dangerous equipment. But in my observations, it seems consistent that the less money you make, the more controlling and intolerant employers tend to be of their employees. Mmmm, except for, say, Surgeons and Anesthesiologists and a whole lot of other high-paid professions where you still can’t drink during work. ---
**Author:** ![MrSquishy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b9e5f3/32.png) [@MrSquishy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrSquishy)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/43 "2015-03-20T15:20:35Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > If you still have .019 after several hours sleep, you are an alcoholic and you are going to be a problem down the road for any employer. Holy shit! This is the dumbest thing I’ve read here so far today. ---
**Author:** ![fachverwirrt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/94ad74/32.png) [@fachverwirrt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fachverwirrt)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/44 "2015-03-20T15:25:56Z")
> [@stillownedbysetters](#): > > The days of the 3-martini lunch and its cousins are over forever. With the increased emphasis on safety in the workplace, both for the employee and those who work around the employee, most companies in a right-to-work state, which Indiana is, would have let you go. Indiana is a right-to-work state. But that’s not what you mean. (Right-to-work and at-will are not the same.) ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/45 "2015-03-20T15:35:03Z")
> [@Captain\_Gutgore\_Blooddrink](#): > > I blew a .019. I dunno, if you showed up SMELLING like you were drunk off your ass, I’d question your intelligence and your hygiene… and probably fire you. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/46 "2015-03-20T15:39:24Z")
> [@Captain\_Gutgore\_Blooddrink](#): > > Indiana :smack: You’re effed. They have every right to fire you at any time for any reason outside of “protected class”. Doesn’t matter if you’re sober or drunk. They’re using the fact you were hung over as an excuse, but really, you have no recourse. I’m sorry. Worse yet, I seriously doubt you will be able to collect unemployment. By all means, make the attempt, but don’t be surprised if “any alcohol at all in system” is sufficient reason to deny you the UI. Find a new job. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/47 "2015-03-20T15:40:36Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > If you still have .019 after several hours sleep, you are an alcoholic Nonsense. You don’t need to be an alcoholic to have alcohol in your blood. You just need to drink alcohol. There’s a large difference between drinking alcohol (even a lot of it) and being an alcoholic. As long as you aren’t dependant, you aren’t an alcoholic. ---
**Author:** ![Trom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/958977/32.png) [@Trom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trom)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/48 "2015-03-20T15:43:12Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > … > I think this is a bit of a class indicator in modern society. If you work a blue collar job, chances are your company may have a zero tolerance policy regarding alcohol in the workplace which could result in immediate dismissal. However at pretty much any tech firm I’ve worked at, drinking is often actively encouraged in the form of after work happy hours or alcohol served towards the end of a workday on a Friday or before a company meeting. And if I walk into a Capital Grille in New York around lunch time, I see a lot of guys in suits with drinks. > > Now some of it is based on safety, as blue collar workers tend to work with machines and dangerous equipment. But in my observations, it seems consistent that the less money you make, the more controlling and intolerant employers tend to be of their employees. Yep, there is an established positive correlation with income level and alcohol consumption. [http://www2.potsdam.edu/alcohol/Controversies/Drinking-Alcohol-and-Income-Education-and-Social-Class-or-Status.html#.VQw-XI6jN8E](http://www2.potsdam.edu/alcohol/Controversies/Drinking-Alcohol-and-Income-Education-and-Social-Class-or-Status.html#.VQw-XI6jN8E) ---
**Author:** ![OneCentStamp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@OneCentStamp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OneCentStamp)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/49 "2015-03-20T15:44:50Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > Nonsense. You don’t need to be an alcoholic to have alcohol in your blood. You just need to drink alcohol. There’s a large difference between drinking alcohol (even a lot of it) and being an alcoholic. As long as you aren’t dependant, you aren’t an alcoholic. Right. I’d say if anything in the OP is a sign of possible alcoholism, it’s getting that trashed on a work night. Drinking interfering with work or other responsibilities is always among the top questions in any assessment test. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/50 "2015-03-20T15:47:15Z")
While this incident unquestionably interfered with work, the next question should be if “interferes with work” is a one-time thing or a regular pattern. It’s a very rare person who has NEVER screwed up at least once. The real problem is the people who are chronic screw-ups. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/51 "2015-03-20T15:48:37Z")
> [@OneCentStamp](#): > > Right. I’d say if anything in the OP is a sign of possible alcoholism, it’s getting that trashed on a work night. Drinking interfering with work or other responsibilities is always among the top questions in any assessment test. True, but we don’t know if this is a one time thing or a pattern. I have to admit to a similar experience the morning after my 30th birthday. 23 years later, and it’s never happened again. I didn’t get fired. And, in fact, just left early and went back to bed. ETA: Ninja’d by **Broomstick** ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/52 "2015-03-20T15:52:24Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > It’s a very rare person who has NEVER screwed up at least once. Fortunately we have so many of those rare people posting here sharing their world view for the edification of we the less gifted! 😃 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/53 "2015-03-20T16:09:47Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > Nonsense. You don’t need to be an alcoholic to have alcohol in your blood. You just need to drink alcohol. There’s a large difference between drinking alcohol (even a lot of it) and being an alcoholic. As long as you aren’t dependant, you aren’t an alcoholic. If you get so plowed \*on a night before work \*that you blow a .019 when you finally get to the hospital at roughly 10:00 a.m., and you pass it off as just “being hungover”, there is a pretty strong chance that you are an alcoholic. And a very small chance you are not. If you lose your job because you stink of alcohol and are hungover, there is a strong chance you are an alcoholic. You guys aren’t doing the OP any favors by helping him rationalize. He’s doing that plenty well by himself. He needs to stop losing his job(s) by showing up shit-faced. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/54 "2015-03-20T16:15:48Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > If you get so plowed \*on a night before work \*that you blow a .019 when you finally get to the hospital at roughly 10:00 a.m., and you pass it off as just “being hungover”, there is a pretty strong chance that you are an alcoholic. And a very small chance you are not. > > If you lose your job because you stink of alcohol and are hungover, there is a strong chance you are an alcoholic. > > You guys aren’t doing the OP any favors by helping him rationalize. He’s doing that plenty well by himself. He needs to stop losing his job(s) by showing up shit-faced. I agree somewhat. 1) he doesn’t seem to realize he was out of line, 2) the employer didn’t cut him any slack, which makes me wonder if there are ongoing issues, and 3) assuming he stopped drinking at 2:00 a.m., he must have had a pretty high BAC. However, as posted above, I wouldn’t conclude he is an alcoholic just from what we know. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/55 "2015-03-20T16:25:49Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > However, as posted above, I wouldn’t conclude he is an alcoholic just from what we know. That kind of attitude will get your Internet Judgy McJudgester license revoked. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/56 "2015-03-20T16:26:58Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > You guys aren’t doing the OP any favors by helping him rationalize. He’s doing that plenty well by himself. He needs to stop losing his job(s) by showing up shit-faced. You’re _assuming_ this is a recurring problem when, based on the information given, we have zero way of knowing that. If it happens once the person should learn from the experience and not repeat it. If it happens on a regular basis that’s a different story. Frankly, I don’t see anyone “helping” him “rationalize” this. It’s been made pretty clear he has no legal recourse. Several people have told him he should have called in sick rather than shown up hung over. A couple of us have pointed out that if this is more than a one-time occurrence that is a sign of a problem. None of that strikes me as overly sympathetic. ---
**Author:** ![stillownedbysetters](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/41988e/32.png) [@stillownedbysetters](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/stillownedbysetters)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/57 "2015-03-20T16:36:40Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > While this incident unquestionably interfered with work, the next question should be if “interferes with work” is a one-time thing or a regular pattern. > > It’s a very rare person who has NEVER screwed up at least once. The real problem is the people who are chronic screw-ups. 15-20 years ago, that is the way we would have handled it. We would have done a workplace intervention, essentially, with the employee and his or her supervisor. We would have allowed them to continue working, but they’d have been put on probation until they completed a anti-alcohol program. Then, if they kept their nose clean going foreward, it would never have been mentioned again. But a few years back, the responsibility to address alcohol issues was put back on the shoulders of the employee. Employers started offering EAPs (Employee Assistance Programs), which an employee is supposed to contact if they have any personal issues impacting their job performance. A kind-hearted supervisor can quietly send an employee home, if it’s a valued employee with a one-time issue, but once an incident is reported to management, we have to uphold the zero tolerance policy and let the employee go. Aside from it being ‘the right thing to do’ keeping controlled substances out of the workplace, zero tolerance has a very pragmatic side. Your insurance rates skyrocket if a workplace incident is determined to have been caused by an employee impaired by alcohol or street drugs. And sadly, concern for the bottom line will outweigh concern for an employee every time. And to the poster above who called me on the right-to-work and at-will distinction, you got me. I called someone out last week for that very mistake. Karma is a bitch. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/58 "2015-03-20T16:38:10Z")
You need to move to a country with better labor laws. Failing that, no I don’t think you have any recourse. Sorry. ---
**Author:** ![Hector\_St\_Clare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b5ac83/32.png) [@Hector\_St\_Clare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hector_St_Clare)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/59 "2015-03-20T16:39:40Z")
I think that the class distinction other people have been noting definitely exists. ---
**Author:** ![friedo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/8edcca/32.png) [@friedo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/friedo)\ **Post date:** [March 20, 2015, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406/60 "2015-03-20T16:44:40Z")
> [@Hector\_St\_Clare](#): > > You need to move to a country with better labor laws. Countries with better labor laws aren’t any more tolerant of intoxicated workers in potentially dangerous manufacturing environments. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-took-a-breathalyzer-and-got-fired-even-though-i-clinically-passed-legal-question/715406.md?page=4)