# I want to confirm whether Gavrilo Princip was or was't an actual member of the Black Hand **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 18, 2017, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-want-to-confirm-whether-gavrilo-princip-was-or-wast-an-actual-member-of-the-black-hand/796641 "2017-09-18T15:32:55Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 3\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![davidmich](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e56c9b/32.png) [@davidmich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidmich)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-want-to-confirm-whether-gavrilo-princip-was-or-wast-an-actual-member-of-the-black-hand/796641/1 "2017-09-18T15:32:55Z")
Hi I’ve read that Gavrilo Princip was a member of the Young Bosnians but not the Black Hand, yet many websites say he was. I look forward to your feedback. > **[Gavrilo Princip](https://webcache.googleusercontent.com/search?q=cache:stkK921sv5sJ:https:%2F%2Fen.wikipedia.org%2Fwiki%2FGavrilo_Princip%2B&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=ph)** > > Gavrilo Princip (Serbian Cyrillic: Гаврило Принцип, pronounced \[ɡǎʋrilo prǐntsip\]; 25 July 1894 – 28 April 1918) was a Bosnian Serb student who assassinated Archduke Franz Ferdinand of Austria and his wife Sophie, Duchess of Hohenberg, in Sarajevo on 28 June 1914. > Princip was born in western Bosnia to a poor Serb family. At the age of 13, he was sent to Sarajevo, the capital of Austrian-occupied Bosnia, to study at the Merchants’ School before transferring to the gymnasium where he became poli... In Belgrade, Princip volunteered to join the Serbian guerrilla bands fighting the Ottoman Turks, under the leadership of Major Vojislav Tankosić.[16] Tankosić was a member of the Black Hand, the foremost conspiratorial society in Serbia at the time.[13] ---
**Author:** ![Isilder](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/cc9497/32.png) [@Isilder](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isilder)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2017, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-want-to-confirm-whether-gavrilo-princip-was-or-wast-an-actual-member-of-the-black-hand/796641/2 "2017-09-18T22:40:57Z")
> [@davidmich](#): > > Hi > > I’ve read that Gavrilo Princip was a member of the Young Bosnians but not the Black Hand, Its in between. Black Hand was a group with power in Belgrade. While the Vladimir Gaćinović , the leader of the Young Bosnians, was a member of the Black Hand, Vladimir was also a SERB. Many of the other Young Bosnians were not serbs. While Gaćinović sent his Young Bosnians to Serbia (to the Black Hand) for training, it seems he did not support the assassination of the Arch Duke. This would be because the Arch Duke was actually sympathetic to Bosnia , Croatia, Albanians and Macedonians… and the other slav countries … The Archduke wanted to keep the countries small … so that they wouldn’t form a large country in the area. The Black Hand didn’t want multiple yugoslavian countries, power was in forming one large Serbia… Yugoslavia as one country… (and the minorities would suffer…) … So they didnt mind scapegoating Bosnia in the struggle to free Serbia… They’d discourage the Austrians from meddling in the yugoslav areas, and everyone could say that the Bosnians would even assassinate the Arch Duke. Blame the Bosnians not the Serbs ,let the Serbs rule… So it makes sense that Gaćinović didn’t actually want to make his Young Bosnia members of black death… they only went to Serbia for training and to fetch weapons. As Gaćinović is Bosnian and Serbian, Gaćinović did not support Serbian take over of the other 'slav (yugoslav ) areas. However the Young Bosnians who went to Serbia for training were convinced by the Black Hand to assassinate the Arch Duke. On that basis, its possible and perhaps clarifying to say that the assassins were carrying out the Black Hands wishes, and in fact in contradiction to Gaćinović’s , Young Bosnian, wishes. The assassins probably revealed the Black Hand’s involvement when they realised that they had acted contrary to the Young Bosnians ideals of a Bosnia independent of Serbia, having been mislead by the Black Death as to what the Arch Duke was about. The wikipedia pages references the following book to support the claim that the assassins were not literal Black Hand members. The Balkans: Nationalism, War, and the Great Powers, 1804-2012: New and Updated . By Misha Glenny > **[The Balkans: Nationalism, War, and the Great Powers, 1804-2012](https://books.google.com.au/books?id=LJqYbknmxjYC&pg=PT244&redir_esc=y)** > > From the bestselling author of McMafia and DarkMarket comes this unique and lively history of Balkan geopolitics since the early nineteenth century which gives readers the essential historical background to more than one hundred years of events in... ---
**Author:** ![davidmich](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e56c9b/32.png) [@davidmich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidmich)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2017, 5:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-want-to-confirm-whether-gavrilo-princip-was-or-wast-an-actual-member-of-the-black-hand/796641/3 "2017-09-19T05:38:40Z")
> [@Isilder](#): > > Its in between. > > Black Hand was a group with power in Belgrade. > > While the Vladimir Gaćinović , the leader of the Young Bosnians, was a member of the Black Hand, Vladimir was also a SERB. Many of the other Young Bosnians were not serbs. > > While Gaćinović sent his Young Bosnians to Serbia (to the Black Hand) for training, it seems he did not support the assassination of the Arch Duke. This would be because the Arch Duke was actually sympathetic to Bosnia , Croatia, Albanians and Macedonians… and the other slav countries … The Archduke wanted to keep the countries small … so that they wouldn’t form a large country in the area. The Black Hand didn’t want multiple yugoslavian countries, power was in forming one large Serbia… Yugoslavia as one country… (and the minorities would suffer…) … So they didnt mind scapegoating Bosnia in the struggle to free Serbia… They’d discourage the Austrians from meddling in the yugoslav areas, and everyone could say that the Bosnians would even assassinate the Arch Duke. Blame the Bosnians not the Serbs ,let the Serbs rule… > So it makes sense that Gaćinović didn’t actually want to make his Young Bosnia members of black death… they only went to Serbia for training and to fetch weapons. > As Gaćinović is Bosnian and Serbian, Gaćinović did not support Serbian take over of the other 'slav (yugoslav ) areas. > However the Young Bosnians who went to Serbia for training were convinced by the Black Hand to assassinate the Arch Duke. On that basis, its possible and perhaps clarifying to say that the assassins were carrying out the Black Hands wishes, and in fact in contradiction to Gaćinović’s , Young Bosnian, wishes. The assassins probably revealed the Black Hand’s involvement when they realised that they had acted contrary to the Young Bosnians ideals of a Bosnia independent of Serbia, having been mislead by the Black Death as to what the Arch Duke was about. > > The wikipedia pages references the following book to support the claim that the assassins were not literal Black Hand members. > The Balkans: Nationalism, War, and the Great Powers, 1804-2012: New and Updated > . By Misha Glenny > [The Balkans: Nationalism, War, and the Great Powers, 1804-2012: New and Updated - Misha Glenny - Google Books](https://books.google.com.au/books?id=LJqYbknmxjYC&pg=PT244&redir_esc=y) Thanks Isilder. Very helpful.