# I was wrong and you were right. \[Trump-related\] **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 2, 2017, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824 "2017-02-02T15:54:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/21 "2017-02-02T17:14:21Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Then report back to us on your newfound political influence. > > Seriously, the absurdity of thinking that paying attention to the news does anything to influence the government is a bit much even for starry-eyed democracy lovers. It’s a shared illusion, but an effective one. If everyone thinks like you, than the public has no influence. But if everyone believes that they have influence, and protests publicly and actually votes, then they do, in fact, have very great influence. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/22 "2017-02-02T17:18:48Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > I don’t want to fluff the OP, nor do I want to run him down. I would just like to comment on the fact that if someone with such strongly held beliefs has turned away from them based on Trump’s actions… then what the hell is taking the rest of the \*\*intelligent \*\*people who still back him? \*\*Congress \*\*I’m looking at you. bolding mine - “Intelligent”? “Congress”? I think I see a problem with your base assumption. ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/23 "2017-02-02T17:22:10Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > Maybe they still back him because they agree with his actions? It is a possibility, you know. > > … Admitting you support Trump is like admitting you have a social disease around these parts. Even CNN mocks the buffoon. Not that we view Trump supporters as “evolutionally challenged,” we’re above that. We blame the lead paint in their school paste. ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/24 "2017-02-02T17:22:29Z")
I know. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/25 "2017-02-02T17:23:07Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Except it is democracy that is the fairy tale we tell children. From knee-high, we bombard them with images and myths of the Great America. Then they grow up to be Donald Trump. Who you promoted the hell out of [in this thread.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=786691) So much for not getting involved in politics. :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/26 "2017-02-02T17:32:04Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Then report back to us on your newfound political influence. > > Seriously, the absurdity of thinking that paying attention to the news does anything to influence the government is a bit much even for starry-eyed democracy lovers. You are simply upset that your very fringe views do not have wide support. Et voila, that is the democracy, it is not a failing of the democracy that a fringe ideological view is not able to impose itself. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/27 "2017-02-02T17:46:07Z")
> [@Idle\_Thoughts](#): > > In the last few days…Trump… > …Did the Muslim Ban thing. > …[Has hung up on the Australian Prime Minister.](http://nypost.com/2017/02/01/trump-blasted-australian-prime-minister-during-worst-call-by-far/) > …[Has gotten the Prime Minister of Canada to accept all refugees.](http://www.cbsnews.com/news/canadian-prime-minister-justin-trudeau-says-canada-welcomes-refugees/) > …[Has threatened Mexico with invasion](http://time.com/4657474/donald-trump-enrique-pena-nieto-mexico-bad-hombres/) > …and I don’t even want to think about what I read happened in Yemen. > [I’m sorry for this topic](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=809946). I was wrong. I was wrong not to vote. I was wrong in thinking it doesn’t matter or that it’s pointless. I very humbly apologize. > I will register to vote and start voting and I will definitely be voting four years from now… that is, if we’re still all alive in four years. Or if we still have the right to vote. I wish I had done it before, in this election. I’m sorry I didn’t. > I was definitely in the wrong and wanted you all to know I admit it and feel bad and sorry over it. > > That’s all. It takes guts to admit you’re wrong, especially about something like this that really matters. Glad your eyes have been opened on this. As others have said, don’t forget the 2018 midterms. Not only is Congress up for grabs in 2018, but Arizona, along with most states, has elections for state legislature that year. And in the meantime, call your Congresscritters about issues that matter to you. Phone calls are the most effective way to let them know how you feel, and a call generally only takes a minute or two. And right now, they’re running scared: they’ve been fantasizing about this moment when they’d drown the government in a bathtub, but we’re ringing their phones off the hook, telling them we actually _like_ having health insurance and national parks and clean water and stuff like that. If we keep the heat on them, we can at least limit the damage they do, because they’ll be too damned scared of us to tear everything down. And with luck, we can retake the House in 2018 and stop the bleeding. But you’re not alone. There are a LOT of apolitical people who’ve suddenly woken up and started paying attention. Every political junkie I know has tales of spouses, friends, loved ones who might’ve voted before, but didn’t really follow politics more than casually, who are now turning into activists. So there’s hope. We’re gonna take our country back, by God. ---
**Author:** ![Dewey\_Finn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dewey_finn/32/4222_2.png) [@Dewey\_Finn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dewey_Finn)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/28 "2017-02-02T17:47:53Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > And in the meantime, call your Congresscritters about issues that matter to you. Here’s a suggestion; try not to call him/her a “congresscritter” when speaking to him/her. In fact, stop using that silly term entirely. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/29 "2017-02-02T17:48:10Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Who you promoted the hell out of [in this thread.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=786691) So much for not getting involved in politics. :rolleyes: That was very early in the contest. I said many times that I favored a Clinton victory. I wouldn’t say I promoted her though. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/30 "2017-02-02T17:48:31Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Except it is democracy that is the fairy tale we tell children. From knee-high, we bombard them with images and myths of the Great America. Then they grow up to be Donald Trump. Shhh. The adults are talking. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/31 "2017-02-02T17:56:12Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > It’s a shared illusion, but an effective one. If everyone thinks like you, than the public has no influence. But if everyone believes that they have influence, and protests publicly and actually votes, then they do, in fact, have very great influence. I agree that it is a shared illusion and an effective one. That is why governments are hard to beat. > [@Ramira](#): > > You are simply upset that your very fringe views do not have wide support. > > Et voila, that is the democracy, it is not a failing of the democracy that a fringe ideological view is not able to impose itself. I don’t seek to impose an ideology, I seek to withdraw from under the boot of yours. Democracy is not effective to that end. It just fools a lot of people into thinking their inconsequential actions determine outcomes. Like the poor OP, he feels responsible for Trump’s insanity. You people are like the guy who wears dirty socks to help his favorite team win the game. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/32 "2017-02-02T17:58:12Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > Shhh. The adults are talking. Is that what you call it when you stand in unison with your hand on your hearts looking up wistfully? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/33 "2017-02-02T18:00:34Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > I agree that it is a shared illusion and an effective one. That is why governments are hard to beat. And it can be used for good or evil. A well informed and well meaning public, accepting this shared illusion, can actually move the government towards accomplishing good things. A poorly informed, or not well-meaning public is useful in being manipulated into supporting the accomplishment of bad things. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/34 "2017-02-02T18:01:07Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Then report back to us on your newfound political influence. > > Seriously, the absurdity of thinking that paying attention to the news does anything to influence the government is a bit much even for starry-eyed democracy lovers. Paying attention to the news does nothing, in and of itself. But it’s the first step. If you’re not informed, then you won’t even know that anything worth calling your Congresscritters about is even happening, until after the fact. And the calls really do make a difference. And showing up at town hall meetings, when they have them, makes even more of an impression. [ETA: link to town-hall spreadsheet removed; seems to be dead] ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/35 "2017-02-02T18:01:12Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > I agree that it is a shared illusion and an effective one. That is why governments are hard to beat. > > I don’t seek to impose an ideology, I seek to withdraw from under the boot of yours. Democracy is not effective to that end. It just fools a lot of people into thinking their inconsequential actions determine outcomes. Like the poor OP, he feels responsible for > Trump’s insanity. You people are like the guy who wears dirty socks to help his favorite team win the game. Yeah, because we read shit like this… \*(WASHINGTON) — President Donald Trump warned in a phone call with his Mexican counterpart that he was ready to send U.S. troops to stop “bad hombres down there” unless the Mexican military does more to control them, according to an excerpt of a transcript of the conversation obtained by The Associated Press. \* and we wonder how a nation could ever get itself into a position where the Idiot-in-Chief would threaten to invade a peaceful foreign country. Does that idiot not know that that’s an act of war? ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/36 "2017-02-02T18:06:04Z")
I move to substitute in “nominated DeVos” in place of Mexico, because it’s looking like the Mexico thing is a hoax. If it turns out to be real, then leave 'em both in. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/37 "2017-02-02T18:11:46Z")
> [@Morgenstern](#): > > Admitting you support Trump is like admitting you have a social disease around these parts. Indeed it is but, although discretion is admittedly the better part of valour, I don’t feel inclined to keep my opinions to myself because they’re unpopular. Besides that what’s the point of a discussion where everyone agrees? Believe it or not, not every Trump supporter is the stereotypical ignorant buffoon, although I will concede that far too many of them are. But that’s true of the left as well. I won’t derail Idle Thoughts’ thread any further although I’m quite amenable to taking the debate up elsewhere should you so desire. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/38 "2017-02-02T18:46:46Z")
> [@Dewey\_Finn](#): > > Here’s a suggestion; try not to call him/her a “congresscritter” when speaking to him/her. In fact, stop using that silly term entirely. Well, ‘Congressperson’ just sounds clunky to me, and I’m not going to use that. Nor am I going to use 'congressman/woman or any similar construction. I will continue using ‘congresscritter’ as a generic term for ‘person serving in the U.S. Senate or House of Representatives.’ And I imagine you will manage to survive the annoyance of having to occasionally see the term. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 6:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/39 "2017-02-02T18:50:50Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > Is that what you call it when you stand in unison with your hand on your hearts looking up wistfully? Looks like someone took an intro philosophy class as an undergrad; so precocious. Anyway, yeah we have an unhinged madman in the whitehouse and we need to take steps to mitigate the problem. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2017, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824/40 "2017-02-02T19:02:30Z")
> [@WillFarnaby](#): > > It’s ok, buddy. What you do politically doesn’t matter. One of the bad things about democracy is that it makes people feel like they are a part of the governing body. They aren’t. The government is a small minority of the shittiest people imaginable. You keep telling yourself that, and you’ll continue to get the government you deserve. But the reality is that if more people bothered to inform themselves – with real information, not garbage posted on Facebook – about what the hell they’re voting on, and then got their asses out to actually vote, the present disaster would not have happened. If you have the ignorant electing an ignoramus, exacerbated by such stunning collective apathy that nearly half the population doesn’t bother to vote at all, you can hardly point to the result as a failure of democracy, because democracy works just fine in most civilized western nations. I may not always agree with my federal or local governments, but I’m basically fairly content with them and certainly don’t consider them to be “the shittiest people imaginable”. Not to digress, but I’m happy to have universal public health care, for instance, and so are the folks in every other civilized nation. If you keep electing the shittiest people imaginable you really need to look a little further to figure out why. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-was-wrong-and-you-were-right-trump-related/778824.md?page=3)