# I watched two people die this morning and then my dog peed on the memorial **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [December 12, 2007, 1:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692 "2007-12-12T01:58:53Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Argent\_Towers](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e8c25b/32.png) [@Argent\_Towers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Argent_Towers)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 8:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/21 "2007-12-12T08:49:01Z")
[QUOTE=silenus] I am in complete agreement with **Argent Towers**. Sorta. I would condemn the miscreants to Life at Hard Labor, so they can ruminate on their sins for a nice, long time. [/QUOTE] Well then you’re not in agreement with me - having people put away for a “nice long time” is meaningless and wastes taxpayer dollars besides. I truly believe that only the threat of death can deter young thugs who think they’re immune to the justice system and that they’re the biggest badasses of all time. And I mean the threat of immediate death - not 10 years on death row, a bullet to the head, as soon as the trial is over. ---
**Author:** ![lobstermobster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobstermobster/32/10033_2.png) [@lobstermobster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lobstermobster)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/22 "2007-12-12T15:11:15Z")
Even after seeing the bodily damage I don’t know what I feel is an appropriate charge/punishment for the driver of the stolen vehicle. What about for the passenger of the stolen vehicle? Would his crime be considered different? They are so young. At the same time they are so young and already have a ridiculous rap sheet according to the news. Do any of the legal beagles want to chime in? What does this sound like? What does this sound like but usually plays out being? Manslaughter? Vehicular manslaughter? Grand theft auto certainly and evading arrest. Did it say the race of the guys driving the stolen car? I’m not being you-know-what, but I think we can all agree that in a court of law, there might as well be different set of books for black people. BTW, did anyone see that stuff on CNN about how selling 5 grams of crack-cocaine can land you the same sentence as selling 500 grams of powder? What a mess. ---
**Author:** ![muldoonthief](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/muldoonthief/32/3188_2.png) [@muldoonthief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/muldoonthief)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/23 "2007-12-12T15:19:51Z")
You have to love the quote from the driver’s attorney: ““My impression is that he was a decent enough chap who had problems - I’m stunned that this has happened,” said his attorney, Paul Dennison.” This after 4 convictions for theft or burglary, several stints in jail, and arrests for making terroristic threats. I know every one is entitled to a lawyer, but do defense attorneys really think this way? I thought most of them knew many of their clients were vile irredeemable scum. ---
**Author:** ![TheLoadedDog](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/35a633/32.png) [@TheLoadedDog](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheLoadedDog)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/24 "2007-12-12T15:32:19Z")
There are, of course, the _other_ testosterone-fueled young male drivers as well - the police officers. Now I have a lot of time for the cops generally, but I think we need to seriously look at alternatives to these high speed chases. Innocent people are dying because of dickheads running from relatively minor crimes. I’m all for some sort of remote ignition cut-off on all cars, and civil liberties be damned (what about the rights of the people in the red car not to be killed?). ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 3:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/25 "2007-12-12T15:33:58Z")
> [@](#): > > I also learned from the news that one passenger died immediately and the other died after being taken to the hospital. So it sounds like you didn’t actually watch _anyone_ die. What a fucking liar! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/26 "2007-12-12T15:48:41Z")
[QUOTE=lobstermobster] I motion for him to knock it off. I know that the little boy that lives inside every man’s mind was innocently thinking “Cars! Smashy smashy!!” [/QUOTE] This is the line that I liked most in your account. That really is a shame. I’m glad that you don’t seem to be suffering any ill effects from seeing the aftermath. I agree that your dog was just expressing his faith that life goes on. (“Damn, some putz just put his new stink on **my** corner. Gotta let him know who’s boss.”) ---
**Author:** ![Soapbox\_Monkey](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Soapbox\_Monkey](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soapbox_Monkey)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/27 "2007-12-12T17:10:29Z")
[QUOTE=Argent Towers] Well then you’re not in agreement with me - having people put away for a “nice long time” is meaningless and wastes taxpayer dollars besides. I truly believe that only the threat of death can deter young thugs who think they’re immune to the justice system and that they’re the biggest badasses of all time. And I mean the threat of immediate death - not 10 years on death row, a bullet to the head, as soon as the trial is over. [/QUOTE] Dude, we’re on the same wavelength. Of course, if the penalty for burglary was also death (a crime which both of the killers in this accident were convicted of in the past) they wouldn’t have been on the street that night in the first place, plus it would serve as a huge deterent from robbing people, which I’m all for. ---
**Author:** ![Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troy_mcclure_sf/32/4150_2.png) [@Troy\_McClure\_SF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Troy_McClure_SF)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/28 "2007-12-12T17:14:54Z")
[QUOTE=lobstermobster] I know that the little boy that lives inside every man’s mind was innocently thinking “Cars! Smashy smashy!!” [/QUOTE] Yeah, that’s probably what I would have done. I usually take Scott to work, but it was moving slow so I went over to Broderick and saw all the commotion. My friend used to live above the produce market on that corner (and I love The Page), so I was especially interested. Glad you hadn’t decided to get an early cuppa joe yesterday morning. ---
**Author:** ![lobstermobster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobstermobster/32/10033_2.png) [@lobstermobster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lobstermobster)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 5:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/29 "2007-12-12T17:34:01Z")
[QUOTE=Troy McClure SF] Yeah, that’s probably what I would have done. I usually take Scott to work, but it was moving slow so I went over to Broderick and saw all the commotion. My friend used to live above the produce market on that corner (and I love The Page), so I was especially interested. Glad you hadn’t decided to get an early cuppa joe yesterday morning. [/QUOTE] I am not speaking to you, Non-yelp party going and PM responding turncoat. ---
**Author:** ![Zebra](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/c0e974/32.png) [@Zebra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zebra)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/30 "2007-12-12T17:40:35Z")
No drawing? ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/31 "2007-12-12T17:50:36Z")
[QUOTE=muldoonthief] You have to love the quote from the driver’s attorney: ““My impression is that he was a decent enough chap who had problems - I’m stunned that this has happened,” said his attorney, Paul Dennison.” This after 4 convictions for theft or burglary, several stints in jail, and arrests for making terroristic threats. I know every one is entitled to a lawyer, but do defense attorneys really think this way? I thought most of them knew many of their clients were vile irredeemable scum. [/QUOTE] Uh, he’s the guy’s defence attorney. What do you _expect_ him to say about his client? His job is to put the best face possible on the defendent, no matter how big a scum bag they may be. ---
**Author:** ![Waenara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/50afbb/32.png) [@Waenara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Waenara)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/32 "2007-12-12T18:33:08Z")
[QUOTE=TheLoadedDog] There are, of course, the _other_ testosterone-fueled young male drivers as well - the police officers. Now I have a lot of time for the cops generally, but I think we need to seriously look at alternatives to these high speed chases. Innocent people are dying because of dickheads running from relatively minor crimes. I’m all for some sort of remote ignition cut-off on all cars, and civil liberties be damned (what about the rights of the people in the red car not to be killed?). [/QUOTE] Normally I’d be right on board with criticizing the police for overly dangerous and prolonged high-speed chases, but according to the article I read ([here](http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2007/12/12/BAO9TS5GK.DTL)), the “chase” hadn’t even barely started yet. > [@](#): > > Police Capt. John Ehrlich said the Saturn was driving east on Page at Broderick Street when officers in a cruiser checked its license plate and realized it was stolen. > > The officers turned on their lights and tried to pull over the Saturn, which accelerated down the hill and through a red light at Divisadero, a block away, and broadsided the Cavalier, Ehrlich said. ---
**Author:** ![Hostile\_Dialect](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e495f1/32.png) [@Hostile\_Dialect](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hostile_Dialect)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2007, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/33 "2007-12-12T19:40:12Z")
> [@muldoonthief](#): > > You have to love the quote from the driver’s attorney: > > ““My impression is that he was a decent enough chap who had problems - I’m stunned that this has happened,” said his attorney, Paul Dennison.” > > This after 4 convictions for theft or burglary, several stints in jail, and arrests for making terroristic threats. I know every one is entitled to a lawyer, but do defense attorneys really think this way? I thought most of them knew many of their clients were vile irredeemable scum. I’m sure he’s just playing the only card he has. As for your question, though, the defense attorney I know\* says he can look himself in the mirror every day because: 1. When he started out in the 60s, smoking a joint in California could get you locked up for years, so he feels good about having done his part to balance out the scales of justice and 2. 95% of the time, the defendant, his attorney, and the prosecutor all know he’s guilty, and they’re just trying to strike a fair deal so the guy can do his time without going through a trial. He figures he’s just doing right by his client while saving the state a little money too. - No, not professionally, although frankly I’m almost as surprised as you are. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2007, 3:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/34 "2007-12-13T03:09:09Z")
After a high-speed chase that cost a young police officer his life in Calgary a few years ago, I believe the Calgary police have been directed not to continue a high-speed chase if it doesn’t resolve quickly. The police helicopter is also used for this. It’s no good to catch car thieves if you kill innocent people on the road doing it. ---
**Author:** ![Morbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morbo/32/389_2.png) [@Morbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morbo)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2007, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/35 "2007-12-13T03:35:03Z")
[QUOTE=Troy McClure SF] My friend used to live above the produce market on that corner (and I love The Page), so I was especially interested. [/QUOTE] Not to detract from the levity here, but my friend owns The Page (as of a couple years ago - his first order of business was to hold the “change the name” contest). I am now utterly convinced we’ve been in the same bar at the same time. (And not just Lucky 13). ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2007, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692/36 "2007-12-14T23:49:22Z")
Slight return: I heard about Benjamin Bratt’s nephew being killed in a bad car crash on the entertainment news this morning. Surreal, man. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/i-watched-two-people-die-this-morning-and-then-my-dog-peed-on-the-memorial/429692.md?page=1)