# Iain M Banks - Culture novels
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079
**Category:** Cafe Society
**Created:** [June 8, 2009, 9:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079 "2009-06-08T09:02:18Z")
**Posts on this page:** 13
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@Future\_Londonite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Future_Londonite)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2009, 9:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/1 "2009-06-08T09:02:18Z")
So recently I discovered Iain Banks by picking up The Wasp Factory…now I have always seen Iain M Banks among the SciFi books but never made the connection - call me blond.
Are his ‘Culture’ novels any good? Which one should I start with?
Thx
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### Author:  [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2009, 9:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/2 "2009-06-08T09:15:07Z")
Are they good? Yes. But the sci-fi stuff is quite different from his other writing. Still high quality though.
I’ll leave it to other, more knowledgeable people, to suggest a reading order, however I started with Consider Phlebas and then read all the others in any order I found them and it didn’t interfere with my enjoyment of any of them.
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### Author:  [@Ferris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ferris)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2009, 10:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/3 "2009-06-08T10:23:16Z")
I could pretty much say exactly the same as **Isamu** did - Consider Phlebas is a good start, but the order doesn’t matter very much.
There are a lot of very imaginative ideas about the technology, which is _very_ high-level (such as AI, travel, etc) but Banks mostly describes things in an incidental way to the main plot - which I like.
A recurring theme/plot device is to have a Culture Agent sent to a more backward planet to influence a society’s development. This is always done according to very strict rules regarding keeping such influence subtle, low-key and allowing others to make their own choices.
‘The Player of Games’ might be a good second choice, but I’ve not had a bad experience from Banks yet in either genre. If you don’t like reading text written as if in a broad accent (“Ahm gunnae keel ye”) then both ‘The Bridge’ (non-SF) and ‘Feersum Enjinn’ (SF) contain characters who narrate their own stories within the book and are written that way. Can be annoying to some, I reckon.
Other than that, I reckon you should enjoy a lot of his work. And if you haven’t got to it yet, ‘The Crow Road’ is my favourite.
Have fun!
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### Author:  [@Future\_Londonite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Future_Londonite)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2009, 10:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/4 "2009-06-08T10:50:12Z")
Thanks for the advice guys…I just ordered ‘The Crow Road’ as well as ‘Espedair Street’ and ‘Complicity’
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### Author:  [@Isamu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isamu)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2009, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/5 "2009-06-08T11:09:01Z")
> [@Future\_Londonite](#):
>
> Thanks for the advice guys…I just ordered ‘The Crow Road’ as well as ‘Espedair Street’ and ‘Complicity’
If you like ‘Espedair Street’ you’ll probably like ‘The Business’ too.
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### Author:  [@hammos1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hammos1)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2009, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/6 "2009-06-08T14:49:42Z")
The first one I read was _The Player of Games_ which I enjoyed immensely. I think it’s a little easier going as an intro to the Culture than _Consider Phlebas_.
_Look to Windward_ and _Excession_ are good as well. _Matter_ and _Use of Weapons_ are OK. I haven’t read _Inversions_ but I get the impression it’s not the best-liked of the series.
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### Author:  [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2009, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/7 "2009-06-08T17:01:15Z")
> [@hammos1](#):
>
> _Use of Weapons_ [is] OK.
Hey! Wait just a doggone minute here…
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### Author:  [@Gethsemane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gethsemane)
#### Post date: [June 8, 2009, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/8 "2009-06-08T20:38:25Z")
I’ve read Consider, Matter, and Use of Weapons and consider the latter to be the best by far.
Consider Phlebas is worth reading first just as I found it to detail a bit more about the Culture, and other background info that sheds more light on the other books.
Zakalwe…thats a nice chair you’re sitting on…ivory?
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### Author:  [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)
#### Post date: [June 9, 2009, 7:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/9 "2009-06-09T07:48:33Z")
I’ve read them all. I recommend _Player of Games_ as a good start. Then _Excession_, because it is very, very good as a Culture overview compared to the more single-issue-focused other books (_Phlebas, Windward, Weapons,Matter_.)
_Feersum Endjin_, _Against A Dark Background_ and _The Algebraist_ are not Culture novels.
Don’t forget _State of the Art_, which is a short story collection. Quite good.
\*Inversions \*is…a special case.
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### Author:  [@Future\_Londonite](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Future_Londonite)
#### Post date: [June 9, 2009, 7:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/10 "2009-06-09T07:57:58Z")
Thanks for all the advice guys…I think some/all of the Iain M Banks are on the 3-for-2 sale at Waterstone’s so I’ll stop by this weekend and see what I can get
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### Author:  [@Walker\_in\_Eternity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walker_in_Eternity)
#### Post date: [June 9, 2009, 8:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/11 "2009-06-09T08:13:37Z")
_Excession_ is IMHO his best book to date, mainly because as well as having an excellent plot it also has some extremely funny (to me) moments.
Of the others _Consider Phelbas_ and _Use of Weapons_ are also good.
I didn’t like _Matter_, it felt like a poor mixture of ideas and to be honest was a depressing read.
I seem to be one of the few who thinks that _Inversions_ was a good book.
As far as other work goes, I would suggest that you read _Walking on Glass_, although it was written as Iain Banks it has a definite SF theme.
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### Author:  [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)
#### Post date: [June 9, 2009, 8:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/12 "2009-06-09T08:19:42Z")
> [@Walker\_in\_Eternity](#):
>
> I seem to be one of the few who thinks that _Inversions_ was a good book.
I liked it a lot - enough to re-read every other year or so.
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### Author:  [@Elvis\_Chimney](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elvis_Chimney)
#### Post date: [June 9, 2009, 9:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/iain-m-banks-culture-novels/499079/13 "2009-06-09T09:44:43Z")
Consider Phlebas, Use Of Weapons and The Player Of Games are all excellent places to start. I think Use of Weapons is the best of the Culture novels.
I used to be a huge fan of all his books, but I gave up reading the Iain Banks stuff after A Song Of Stone and gave up on the Iain M Banks after Excession which I found a bit dull - but I’ve heard good things about his more recent work so I may have to give him another chance.