# Ian McKellan and Derek Jacobi are Vicious **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 1, 2014, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058 "2014-07-01T01:55:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2014, 1:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/1 "2014-07-01T01:55:12Z")
This is a British comedy that’s airing on PBS on Sunday nights, where McKellan and Jacobi play an aging gay couple who bicker through life. The show also has Iwan Rheon – “Simon” on **Misfits.** The opening episode was hilarious. Not because it was that well written – it’s plot was routine – but because McKallen and Jacobi (and the rest of the cast) effortlessly wrung the maximum humor out of all their lines. Watching two great actors doing a low comedy sitcom was an absolute delight. You can watch it on the [PBS Website](http://video.pbs.org/program/vicious/). ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2014, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/2 "2014-07-01T02:05:04Z")
Derek Jacobi and Ian McKellan read , respectively, the _Iliad_ and the _Odyssey_ from Robert Fagles’ translations on Penguin audio. I’m sure that’s purely coincidental. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_L.A](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_l.a/32/1084_2.png) [@Johnny\_L.A](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_L.A)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2014, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/3 "2014-07-01T03:21:48Z")
Derek Jacobi is also in _Last Tango In Halifax_. I couldn’t believe he was still alive. When I watched _I Claudius_ the first time it was broadcast on PBS, he seemed so _old!_. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2014, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/4 "2014-07-01T03:23:11Z")
Wow! That’s DREADFUL! They have commercials on PBS’s site? Oh, it’s started back. I do like Frances de la Tour. Good thing they have loads of scenery in that flat. Those old guys have new dentures to chew it. Same time next week? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2014, 3:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/5 "2014-07-01T03:35:44Z")
It’s certainly well named. Was it just me, or did anyone else get a strong reminiscence of John Inman in Derek’s performance? ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2014, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/6 "2014-07-01T04:24:12Z")
> [@Johnny\_L.A](#): > > Derek Jacobi is also in _Last Tango In Halifax_. I couldn’t believe he was still alive. When I watched _I Claudius_ the first time it was broadcast on PBS, he seemed so _old!_. He was quite young when he did _I Claudius_ and did a great job with the amazing make-up. Old Jacobi is very much like watching young Jacobi play an old person. But he is even better now. I’ve heard that when McKellen and Jacobi were both a lot younger they were both so discreet about being gay that they had simultaneous crushes on each other and didn’t know how the other felt. ---
**Author:** ![Smeghead](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f1d935/32.png) [@Smeghead](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smeghead)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2014, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/7 "2014-07-01T18:34:05Z")
I watched one episode when it premiered in Britain, and found it embarrassingly bad. Just, really really bad. I can’t believe someone’s brought it over here. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2014, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/8 "2014-07-01T19:02:00Z")
I’m not sure that a show that takes place on one set, with one punchline, and with a limited cast (however brilliant), can maintain interest in the long term. It was funny at times because there were two Shakespearean actors giving it their best, but how-gay-can-you-be (along with how-ethnic-can-you-be) has been done to death as a sitcom meme. My wife found it more amusing than I did, so we’ll see how far we get. ---
**Author:** ![Echo\_Charlie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b5e925/32.png) [@Echo\_Charlie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Echo_Charlie)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2014, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/9 "2014-07-01T20:38:40Z")
I went to one of the live filmings at ITV studios. Much as I adore McKellan, Jacobi and De la Tour, it was TERRIBLE - just embarrassingly retrograde rubbish. We left early. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2014, 8:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/10 "2014-07-01T20:46:58Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > He was quite young when he did _I Claudius_ and did a great job with the amazing make-up. Old Jacobi is very much like watching young Jacobi play an old person. But he is even better now. He was 38. Claudius became emperor at 49 and died at 63 so they did have to age him up at the end but certainly not at the beginning. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 1, 2014, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/11 "2014-07-01T22:23:41Z")
I know McKellen is gay IRL – what about Jacobi? ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/12 "2014-07-02T01:30:38Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > I know McKellen is gay IRL – what about Jacobi? Very. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/13 "2014-07-02T01:57:16Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > I know McKellen is gay IRL – what about Jacobi? I think the technical term is “as gay as a tree full of parrots,” but the interviews I’ve seen show him prissy but not all a-flutter, as he is on this show. Mitchell and Cam on Modern Family are more subtle and far funnier. Once you get past the Shakespearian actors you respect having a romp it deteriorates into Shakespearian actors you used to respect embarrassing themselves terribly. Why would they do this show? It couldn’t be for the pittance the BBC pays them. Maybe it’s an homage to lost friends who were like that. ---
**Author:** ![Sampiro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/2acd7d/32.png) [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 3:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/14 "2014-07-02T03:41:41Z")
> [@Smeghead](#): > > I watched one episode when it premiered in Britain, and found it embarrassingly bad. Just, really really bad. I can’t believe someone’s brought it over here. I wanted to like it, expected to like it, but just couldn’t believe what I was seeing. Jacobi, McKellen, and De LaTour with this absolute dreck was like imagining three master chefs being given a Waffle House, or if Monty Python had reunited for a drag remake of the lamest episodes of _Golden Girls_. Just a total waste of major talent. The amazing thing is how little chemistry McKellen and Jacobi had considering 1- They really have known each other for almost fifty years 2- Each admitted to having a major crush on the other when they were young and more closeted (though they never hooked up) 3- They’re great actors Particularly disappointing having seen Jacobi do great comedy as the hammy queeny has been actor on _Frasier_ and McKellen on several SNL skits as well as in the occasional comedy movie. And this disdain and lack of any future interest in the comes from somebody who is not only a fan of all three of the seniors in the cast but has an embarrassing level of lust in his heart for the oh-so-spankable Iwan Rheon. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/15 "2014-07-02T03:58:28Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > He was 38. Claudius became emperor at 49 and died at 63 so they did have to age him up at the end but certainly not at the beginning. Yes, but _I Claudius_ portrayed the whole life of Claudius, not just from when he became emperor. Jacobi took up the role from when Claudius was in his early twenties. That was in the fourth episode, I believe. First, Claudius wasn’t born yet. In the second, he was just a baby. In the third, he was a twitchy little kid. That was the episode that had the great scene where Augustus uses twitchy little Claudius as an example of the results of “a Roman man and a Roman woman getting into the same bed” to shame some reluctant men into marrying. When the men laugh at twitchy Claudius, Augustus has the great line…“Ooooh, I hear some titters…” Well, I seemed to have gone on longer than I intended about this show. But it was the best I’ve ever seen. Still is. ---
**Author:** ![rowrrbazzle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rowrrbazzle/32/414_2.png) [@rowrrbazzle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rowrrbazzle)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/16 "2014-07-02T06:08:16Z")
> [@Morgyn](#): > > Was it just me, or did anyone else get a strong reminiscence of John Inman in Derek’s performance? I thought of his performance as Jackson Hedley, the Shakespearean actor who Frasier admired so much as a child who turned out to be a really bad ham. ["Frasier" The Show Must Go Off (TV Episode 2001) - Reference View - IMDb](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0582551/combined) ---
**Author:** ![FairyChatMom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fairychatmom/32/21906_2.png) [@FairyChatMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FairyChatMom)\ **Post date:** [July 2, 2014, 10:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/17 "2014-07-02T10:58:58Z")
I don’t think I was able to watch a full 10 minutes. I’m assuming from what I’ve been reading here that it didn’t get any better. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2014, 5:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/18 "2014-07-03T17:58:03Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > Yes, but _I Claudius_ portrayed the whole life of Claudius, not just from when he became emperor. Jacobi took up the role from when Claudius was in his early twenties. That was in the fourth episode, I believe. First, Claudius wasn’t born yet. > In the second, he was just a baby. In the third, he was a twitchy little kid. That was the episode that had the great scene where Augustus uses twitchy little Claudius as an example of the results of “a Roman man and a Roman woman getting into the same bed” to shame some reluctant men into marrying. When the men laugh at twitchy Claudius, Augustus has the great line…“Ooooh, I hear some titters…” > > Well, I seemed to have gone on longer than I intended about this show. But it was the best I’ve ever seen. Still is. I know. I was responding to one poster stated he thought Jacobi was so old in I Claudius that he was surprised he was still alive then another stated he was actually quite young and they aged him. When in reality (as you point out) during the series he played Claudius both much younger than himself and much older. Now can we just sit back and remember how great _I Claudius_ was? What a great cast. ---
**Author:** ![Hypno-Toad](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/b2d939/32.png) [@Hypno-Toad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hypno-Toad)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2014, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/19 "2014-07-03T18:54:16Z")
I was only able to watch _Viscious_ for 3 and half minutes. I could watch \*I, Claudius \*begining to end. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2014, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ian-mckellan-and-derek-jacobi-are-vicious/692058/20 "2014-07-03T20:37:36Z")
> [@Sampiro](#): > > I wanted to like it, expected to like it, but just couldn’t believe what I was seeing. Jacobi, McKellen, and De LaTour with this absolute dreck was like imagining three master chefs being given a Waffle House, or if Monty Python had reunited for a drag remake of the lamest episodes of _Golden Girls_. Just a total waste of major talent. I had a similar reaction. Morgyn mentioned John Inman; while watching Vicious I couldn’t help thinking that there was really nothing either Knight did that Inman couldn’t have done just as well. And well-loved as the late Mr. Inman was in television comedy and panto, he was no Shakespearean-calibre performer. McKellen and Jacobi and de la Tour were very much wasted. I can only assume that they did the show as a favor to some friend or other. (And possibly the Knights enjoyed being able to be just full-out cartoonishly “flouncy” in reaction to decades of pretense?)