# Ice in soft drinks: Are Europeans right or superstitious? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 12, 2013, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093 "2013-02-12T17:17:15Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/21 "2013-02-12T20:26:20Z")
I tend to like a little bit of pop with my ice… I don’t mind it a little watered down. Too thick and syrupy otherwise. I also don’t like all the carbonation, and pouring it over lots of ice resolves that issue. Your Milage Will Vary. ---
**Author:** ![Duke\_of\_Rat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Duke\_of\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke_of_Rat)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/22 "2013-02-12T20:49:26Z")
Do they have ice water, or just a glass with cold water in it? ---
**Author:** ![busterpickle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/258eb7/32.png) [@busterpickle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/busterpickle)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/23 "2013-02-12T21:17:59Z")
The EU, in my experience, is just used to having everything luke-warm or luke-cold. Probably due to energy conservation. There have been times where the hotel room or restaurant was just absolutely stifling. I have no idea how they survive that. Even other places where you would expect some form of ventillation, air flow, anything at all, don’t have it. Being in a metro in Prague was absolutely incredible. No airflow at all, no deodorant at all (it’s just the way that they are), I thought I was going to pass out. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 9:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/24 "2013-02-12T21:38:47Z")
The lack of ice is not surprising given how insanely expensive soda is in the parts of Europe I’ve been. Beer and wine (depending on the location) are often cheaper where they are far more expensive than soda in the US. Also, flat water is universally free in restaurants. There was a bottled water fad a while back, but it is mostly gone now, except maybe in big cities. I guess we just have more water to spare. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/25 "2013-02-12T21:57:02Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Beer and wine (depending on the location) are often cheaper where they are far more expensive than soda in the US. No joke. I started drinking beer at lunch when I was living and working in Budapest in the late 90s/early 00s because it was cheaper than getting a Coke. I sometimes want to revert to that behavior back here in the US, where it’s not quite as understandable. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Who\_me\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/958977/32.png) [@Who\_me\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Who_me_1)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 10:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/26 "2013-02-12T22:38:05Z")
I don’t over-ice my soft drinks. Since many places now have self serve drinks, I use two or three cubes at most. ---
**Author:** ![DrCube](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a3d4f5/32.png) [@DrCube](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrCube)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/27 "2013-02-12T22:49:13Z")
I drink and eat tons of ice, usually with diet coke. I don’t think there is a health issue there. (I’ve been told eating ice is bad for your teeth, but I usually only eat the crushed kind, and my teeth are still fine.) However, if I didn’t get free refills (or giant cups), I’d reconsider ordering it. Because yeah, you’re getting a bunch of water instead of the soda you paid for. Also, I can’t imagine having ice in my beer or milk, which is 100% cultural. I can see if you’ve been raised differently than me, ice in soda would have the same negative connotations. ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/28 "2013-02-12T23:02:50Z")
> [@Lukeinva](#): > > Order a coke in Paris and usually you’ll get the bottle, and a glass. Ask for ice and what you get will depend on how much ice is available. Some places have small fridges (with small freezers) that run on gas. The gas costs money ergo the ice costs money. So you may only get a couple/few cubes. Here in the US those limitations don’t exist. > > A couple years ago in Barcelona on a really hot July weekend I asked for a large coke and they gave me huge glass jar full of ice and coke! Cost about $12 bucks but it was Summer and in the middle of the Ramblas… no discounts there. This has become extremely common in Peru in all eateries except high-level restaurants and places with machines (KCF, McD, BK). ---
**Author:** ![Michael63129](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3da27b/32.png) [@Michael63129](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael63129)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/29 "2013-02-12T23:18:12Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > However, in the US even with machine soda they cram it full of ice. The first thing my dad told me was “hold the ice”. It’s not only the volume, it’s also that is tiny ice that melts immediately. The size of individual pieces doesn’t really have anything to do with how fast it melts (except initially, when being cooled down), assuming the same overall amount of ice, since whether it is one tiny piece or a glass full of ice, the temperature of the whole glass will stay near freezing until it all melts. That said, I don’t like ice for the same reason **Nava** says - it melts and dilutes the soda, which then doesn’t taste as good, not like it is going to get that warm either in the time it takes to drink it. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 11:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/30 "2013-02-12T23:24:40Z")
> [@Michael63129](#): > > That said, I don’t like ice for the same reason **Nava** says - it melts and dilutes the soda, which then doesn’t taste as good, not like it is going to get that warm either in the time it takes to drink it. I agree. Fountain drinks are plenty cold to begin with. ---
**Author:** ![steviep24](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/5f9b8f/32.png) [@steviep24](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/steviep24)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2013, 11:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/31 "2013-02-12T23:44:59Z")
My dad, who was Hungarian, used to tell us when we were kids that drinking cold liquids while eating a hot meal could crack your teeth. I’ve ignored that logic and usually drink my soda with ice unless I’m drinking it from a can or bottle. ---
**Author:** ![Spud](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spud/32/347_2.png) [@Spud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spud)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/32 "2013-02-13T00:06:17Z")
> [@Malacandra](#): > > When I was on business in Korea, I certainly didn’t sleep with a fan. :dubious: Apparently your business isn’t being a rock star. ---
**Author:** ![Michael63129](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3da27b/32.png) [@Michael63129](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael63129)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/33 "2013-02-13T00:19:51Z")
> [@steviep24](#): > > My dad, who was Hungarian, used to tell us when we were kids that drinking cold liquids while eating a hot meal could crack your teeth. I’ve ignored that logic and usually drink my soda with ice unless I’m drinking it from a can or bottle. Believe it or not, there is actually truth to this, as [this study](http://jdr.sagepub.com/content/51/2/461.full.pdf) (PDF) demonstrates: > [@](#): > > This paper presents the results of experiments conducted with extracted human and bovine teeth. The teeth were subjected to thermal cycling at temperatures between 140 and 90 F. The results offer conclusive evidence that thermal fracture may be induced by the thermal stresses caused by the temperature cycling. Less than 3,000 thermal cycles cause severe cracking or the propagation of cracks previously existing in the teeth, or both. (they used bovine teeth because there weren’t that many human teeth without existing cracks but both showed similar damage; the temperature difference can also be easily exceeded by drinking ice-cold liquid. One caveat is that living teeth can repair themselves to an extent). ---
**Author:** ![rivulus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/839c29/32.png) [@rivulus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rivulus)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 1:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/34 "2013-02-13T01:47:07Z")
> [@Michael63129](#): > > That said, I don’t like ice for the same reason **Nava** says - it melts and dilutes the soda, which then doesn’t taste as good, not like it is going to get that warm either in the time it takes to drink it. I actually like a lot of ice for pretty much the same (opposite?) reason: I hate the overly sweet taste of straight soda. Even worse if it’s luke-warm. I find that when soda is really, really, mind-numbingly cold the flavor doesn’t seem as strong. And then as it warms slightly the melting ice dilutes it nicely. So bring on the ice. 🙂 To each their own. ---
**Author:** ![Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aji_de_gallina/32/260_2.png) [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aji_de_Gallina)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 3:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/35 "2013-02-13T03:11:09Z")
> [@Michael63129](#): > > The size of individual pieces doesn’t really have anything to do with how fast it melts (except initially, when being cooled down), assuming the same overall amount of ice, since whether it is one tiny piece or a glass full of ice, the temperature of the whole glass will stay near freezing until it all melts. > > That said, I don’t like ice for the same reason **Nava** says - it melts and dilutes the soda, which then doesn’t taste as good, not like it is going to get that warm either in the time it takes to drink it. A cube of ice melts much slower than the same volume of ice chips because the area where thermal transfer occurs is much lower. ---
**Author:** ![jabiru](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/bbce88/32.png) [@jabiru](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jabiru)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/36 "2013-02-13T03:17:00Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > It’s not about superstitions, it’s about money. A cup half full of ice is cup half empty of soda. Europeans don’t like getting ripped off. That’s why I don’t have ice in my soft drinks. Besides, if you let it sit for any length of time, the ice melts and the soft drink tastes horrible. ---
**Author:** ![Michael63129](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3da27b/32.png) [@Michael63129](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael63129)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/37 "2013-02-13T03:22:55Z")
> [@Aji\_de\_Gallina](#): > > A cube of ice melts much slower than the same volume of ice chips because the area where thermal transfer occurs is much lower. This is only true, as I said, when the water/soda/etc is above freezing; the temperature will drop to freezing and melting will slow down to what is needed to balance heat input. Try it [yourself](http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/8ed20632-d5a8-11e1-a5f3-00144feabdc0.html#axzz2KkI9qcs8): > [@](#): > > Take a glass of water and add ice. Put the glass in a hot room and the temperature inside the glass will remain relatively constant until virtually all the ice has melted. This is in spite of heat flowing into the glass from its surroundings. (of course, there is some point where the surface area of the ice (and the size of the container) does matter, but for practical purposes it doesn’t matter) ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/38 "2013-02-13T03:37:49Z")
> [@CalMeacham](#): > > The only place in Europe that I got a soft drink with ice in it was a Subway franchise in Dublin, Ireland. Obviously, it was because it was an American chain. Elsewhere, if I wanted ice, I had to ask for it (and might not get it). Nowadays it would be unusual to not get ice somewhere and if you don’t get offered ice you’ll usually get some if you ask for it. Not too long ago though ice was rationed for some reason in most places, maybe to save on costs? I suspect they don’t put as much ice into a soft drink here as Americans are used to for two reasons, a) it never gets all that hot here and b) if you’re drinking out of a glass, how a soft drink will typically be served, a surfeit of ice makes it difficult to drink, unless you’re using a straw. But if you ask for loads of ice you get it. If I’m having a mixed drink in a bar I’ll usually ask for it in a pint glass full to the brim with ice and they usually have no problem providing it. ---
**Author:** ![NADADILEMMA](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/5fc32e/32.png) [@NADADILEMMA](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NADADILEMMA)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 3:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/39 "2013-02-13T03:43:27Z")
> [@littleoctagon](#): > > I have been to a number of eastern European countries (Hungary, Croatia, Slovakia, Ukraine, Serbia) and they don’t seem to like ice in their soft drinks. Also, after having searched the forum threads for “iced drinks” I found one poll-type thread where people were asked whether they liked ice in their drinks or not but did not address the questions I have posted below. And also in this thread, some people also mentioned that this preference for no ice is prevalent in several other western European countries. > > My question for the teeming masses (and Cecil, of course) stems from what these Europeans have told me as to why they don’t like ice. Many of them (if not most) have said that they don’t put ice in their (already cold) beverages because drinking a liquid that is too cold will give you a sore throat. One response in the “iced drinks” thread I mentioned said they heard that it is bad for your stomach as well. To me, this seems ludicrous. I have never gotten a sore throat/sore stomach from drinking a liquid that is too cold and also, when you already have a sore or swollen throat, don’t doctors recommend cold beverages to reduce the swelling and/or reduce the pain? > > So, has my typically American routine of putting ice in my soft drinks caused me develop a tolerance (per se) to the effects of iced drinks or has their typically European routine of NOT putting ice in their soft drinks caused them to develop a sensitivity to the effects of iced drinks? Could this be a case of some sort of psychosomatic response? Could this be a case of some sort of “old wives tale” superstition, not unlike how many eastern Europeans tell you to close windows in the fall and winter or “you’ll catch a draft” and get sick? > > Thanks for your time. :smack: I lived in Karsruhe, Germany for 10 years…from 1980 to 1990. They did not put ice in their beverages then either. But they also drank warm beer, drank beer on their work lunch breaks, the females refused to shave under their arms and they did not use deodorant…anti-perspirant or regular. There are a lot of things they did and still do contrary to what we as Americans do, but a lot of it has nothing to do with medical findings…it is just ancestral ways and traditional followings. The issue with the omission of ice in beverages was told to me by a German friend. Whenever we went out and ordered a drink, I always had to request ice…even if the drink was one that required ice by bartending standards. I asked my German friend, Sabine, why is this? And she said, "In Europe, Mothers do not give their babies cold liquids to drink because of the shock factor to the head…what we call “Brain Freeze.” Because children are not given cold liquids, like anything else, what you are exposed to is what you become accustomed to. Therefore, from childhood, they become accustomed to drinking not cold or room temperature drinks. It is that simple. And that’s the STRAIGHT DOPE! ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2013, 4:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093/40 "2013-02-13T04:02:21Z")
Bear in mind that there’s a historical basis for this stuff, too. Ice used to be a luxury item, but as was far more readily available in North America, which is colder and has more fresh water immediately available to major populatiom centers. At one point, cutting and transporting ice in New England and transporting it around the world was a major industry, but the major markets remained American cities. The northeastern USA is both colder and hotter than much of Europe, and so was an ideal place to harvest ice, store it, and then sell to overheated and thirsty customers. Most of this was passe by 1900, but there already existed by then a different attitude between Americans (and Canadians) and Europeans. The former thought of ice as a common thing; the latter, a luxury. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ice-in-soft-drinks-are-europeans-right-or-superstitious/650093.md?page=3)