# Ich bin ein Berliner... **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 20, 2013, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460 "2013-06-20T13:58:25Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 12\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2013, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/21 "2013-06-20T19:59:45Z")
> [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](#): > > The major source of the “jelly doughnut” interpretations comes from the inspired standup comedy of Eddie Izzard. This seems unlikely to me. Snopes cites an article from the [New York Times](http://www.nytimes.com/1988/04/30/opinion/i-am-a-jelly-filled-doughnut.html)from 1988 in which William J. Miller, chief editorial writer for The New York Herald Tribune from 1957 to 1959, makes the doughnut claim. Izzard was barely known at the time. A column in the Times is far more likely a source for Izzard than the other way round. ---
**Author:** ![Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/prof.pepperwinkle/32/13627_2.png) [@Prof.Pepperwinkle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Prof.Pepperwinkle)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2013, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/22 "2013-06-20T20:01:19Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > This seems unlikely to me. Snopes cites an article from the [New York Times](http://www.nytimes.com/1988/04/30/opinion/i-am-a-jelly-filled-doughnut.html)from 1988 in which William J. Miller, chief editorial writer for The New York Herald Tribune from 1957 to 1959, makes the doughnut claim. Izzard was barely known at the time. > > A column in the Times is far more likely a source for Izzard than the other way round. I stand corrected. ---
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2013, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/23 "2013-06-20T20:03:50Z")
> [@crowmanyclouds](#): > > It’s silly to think that anyone would think JFK was a jelly doughnut . . . clearly he was a Boston cream! > > CMC fnord! Well played. Well played. ---
**Author:** ![JSexton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@JSexton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JSexton)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2013, 8:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/24 "2013-06-20T20:20:12Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > This seems unlikely to me. Snopes cites an article from the [New York Times](http://www.nytimes.com/1988/04/30/opinion/i-am-a-jelly-filled-doughnut.html)from 1988 in which William J. Miller, chief editorial writer for The New York Herald Tribune from 1957 to 1959, makes the doughnut claim. Izzard was barely known at the time. > > A column in the Times is far more likely a source for Izzard than the other way round. Well, it could certainly be true that the major source for people repeating it today is Eddie Izzard, not an article in the Tribune from 1988. Although FWIW, I remember hearing and repeating this tale in high school in the late 80s, early 90s, so it was certainly circulating as an urban legend then. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [June 20, 2013, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/25 "2013-06-20T22:14:48Z")
I had always heard the explanation that Kennedy should have said “Ich bin (ein) \*\*Berlinisch.” \*\*I’ve never taken any German and never known anyone who spoke German that fluently to explain to me what exactly the difference between the two words is, but over the years I’ve inferred that “Berliner” was always the more correct term anyway. ---
**Author:** ![Mr\_Downtown](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Mr\_Downtown](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Downtown)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2013, 5:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/26 "2013-06-21T05:43:24Z")
[The translator’s first-person account.](http://www.americanheritage.com/content/teaching-berliner?page=show) ---
**Author:** ![Pitchmeister](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pitchmeister/32/3459_2.png) [@Pitchmeister](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pitchmeister)\ **Post date:** [June 21, 2013, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/27 "2013-06-21T06:30:07Z")
> [@kunilou](#): > > I had always heard the explanation that Kennedy should have said “Ich bin (ein) \*\*Berlinisch.” \*\*I’ve never taken any German and never known anyone who spoke German that fluently to explain to me what exactly the difference between the two words is, but over the years I’ve inferred that “Berliner” was always the more correct term anyway. “Berlinisch” is a very awkward adjective. You would recognize it as a word, but there is no situation where “Berliner” would not be the more appropriate adjective. For instance, there is a famous song about the “Berliner Luft” (Berlin air), it would sound very weird with the title “Berlinische Luft”. “Ich bin ein Berlinisch” is right out, that’s not correct German syntax (grammatically equivalent to something like “I am a happy”). ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2013, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/28 "2013-06-22T00:52:14Z")
> [@Mr\_Downtown](#): > > [The translator’s first-person account.](http://www.americanheritage.com/content/teaching-berliner?page=show) Great find - thanks! Interesting to see the reference in that to President Carter’s attempt to speak German. He got into trouble in 1977 when he tried Polish: [Jimmy Carter REALLY likes Poland... | Lost in Dictation](http://lost-in-dictation.blogspot.com/2012/08/jimmy-carter-really-likes-poland.html) ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2013, 1:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/29 "2013-06-22T01:31:27Z")
Read more carefully. It wasn’t Carter who was speaking in Polish. It was his translator who was speaking and who messed up. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2013, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/30 "2013-06-22T01:39:29Z")
But it was Carter who was ridiculed. ---
**Author:** ![Floater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/dc4da7/32.png) [@Floater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Floater)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 9:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/31 "2013-06-24T09:52:53Z")
Somewhere in the back of my mind I have a recollection that he did not say “Ich bin ein Berliner” but “Ich bin auch ein Berliner”. Anyway, I read in a notice in a Swedish newspaper that Obama was going to talk to the people of Berlin in the same spot that JFK had held his speech. Unfortunately for the ignorant who wrote it Obama appeared on Pariser Platz in the East of the Brandenburger Tor and JFK was outside the city hall in Schöneberg, which is not even in the neighbourhood of it. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [June 24, 2013, 12:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460/32 "2013-06-24T12:29:32Z")
He didn’t include the word “auch”. It’s twenty seconds into this video: [![]( " - YouTube") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hH6nQhss4Yc) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ich-bin-ein-berliner/661460.md?page=1)