# Idealistic arrogance... a product of hot weather and no school? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [July 16, 2013, 4:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679 "2013-07-16T16:28:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![elbows](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/b3f665/32.png) [@elbows](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elbows)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 10:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/21 "2013-07-19T10:41:51Z")
Really the most irritating thing about them, what’s really pushing your buttons, I think, is they remind you of how full of yourself and your intellect and your arrogance you were at that age. Otherwise I can think of no reason for this to get under your skin so effectively. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/22 "2013-07-19T13:27:33Z")
And what’s wrong with idealism? That’s where any kind of change starts. Eventually you run up against the world’s realities and have to inject a little pragmatism into that idealism, but this kind of single-minded passion is the fuel for the fire of social change. I’d hate to live in a world where people didn’t have visions for the future. Society needs dreamers. Even if that means we have to put up with objectivists. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/23 "2013-07-19T13:59:58Z")
The thing that’s wrong with idealism is that it sometimes leads to extremism. Some people read Rand/Marx/whathaveyou and think…hmmm… some interesting ideas but I have some concerns. Others drink the entire jug of cool-aid in one breathless gulp and pass on their ice cream headache. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/24 "2013-07-19T14:07:12Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > The thing that’s wrong with idealism is that it sometimes leads to extremism. Some people read Rand/Marx/whathaveyou and think…hmmm… some interesting ideas but I have some concerns. Others drink the entire jug of cool-aid in one breathless gulp and pass on their ice cream headache. Well put. I’m happy to listen to even the most extreme and radical ideas if the proponent seems to have a sense of how they fit into the real world. I get tired ears very quickly when the assumption is that a radical rebuild of society, culture, economics and politics can be installed in a down weekend. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 2:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/25 "2013-07-19T14:38:28Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > And what’s wrong with idealism? When the ideal is considered _so important_ that the consequences to people of implementing it are ignored, that’s very unethical and destructive. And when the idealist refuses to compromise their ideals with the real world, that’s also unethical and destructive. Ideological purity is a terrible way to run a society. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/26 "2013-07-19T15:05:21Z")
> [@zoid](#): > > I miss rape month. Yeah, at least it’s something everyone can get behind. ---
**Author:** ![Spice\_Weasel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/spice_weasel/32/5435_2.png) [@Spice\_Weasel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spice_Weasel)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/27 "2013-07-19T15:49:53Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > When the ideal is considered _so important_ that the consequences to people of implementing it are ignored, that’s very unethical and destructive. And when the idealist refuses to compromise their ideals with the real world, that’s also unethical and destructive. Ideological purity is a terrible way to run a society. Well, that’s an altogether reasonable point. I’d appreciate some examples from the OP. So we can point and laugh. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/28 "2013-07-19T16:29:56Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > I’d appreciate some examples from the OP. So we can point and laugh. You must be a very selective reader here. The threads are tailing out now but should provide adequate entertainment, but look for the one on Ayn Rand and objectivism and the one on “profits are a tax on labor” to start with. Someone who’s better versed at posting thread links is welcome to jump in with a few. ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/29 "2013-07-19T16:31:38Z")
> [@Askance](#): > > Have you even thought of turning professional? (Just saw this post, belatedly) I am a professional. If you want to be more specific, go right ahead. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [July 19, 2013, 8:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/30 "2013-07-19T20:28:19Z")
> [@Askance](#): > > And, as we all know practice makes perfect. Was he a perfect Jew yet? Already? Well, of course, as we all know, **perfected** Jews worship Jesus. ---
**Author:** ![panaccione](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/94ad74/32.png) [@panaccione](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panaccione)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/31 "2013-07-20T01:49:08Z")
Seriously though, the “non-aggression” principle. What a fucking joke! ---
**Author:** ![Askance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askance/32/8281_2.png) [@Askance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askance)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/32 "2013-07-20T11:26:35Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > I am a professional. If you want to be more specific, go right ahead. Looks at post. Looks at username. Looks at post. Shakes head, goes home. ---
**Author:** ![Bozuit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/edb3f5/32.png) [@Bozuit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bozuit)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/33 "2013-07-20T12:08:25Z")
> [@Spice\_Weasel](#): > > And what’s wrong with idealism? That’s where any kind of change starts. Eventually you run up against the world’s realities and have to inject a little pragmatism into that idealism, but this kind of single-minded passion is the fuel for the fire of social change. I’d hate to live in a world where people didn’t have visions for the future. Society needs dreamers. Even if that means we have to put up with objectivists. Mostly agreed. It might be idealistic arrogance, but it’s not met with humility. It’s met with another kind of arrogance, where the culprit insists that, with their extra decade or two of experience, _they_ truly understand the world, and through their understanding they have discerned that it’s not worth doing anything about. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/34 "2013-07-20T12:18:03Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > Yeah, at least it’s something everyone can get behind. I thought that was sodomy month? ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/35 "2013-07-20T13:19:06Z")
> [@Askance](#): > > Looks at post. Looks at username. Looks at post. Shakes head, goes home. Okay, whoosh. I don’t think of my username as post content. I’d be happy to go all professional barbarian on these wet-behind-the-ears, empty-between-the-ears and wax-plugged-ear jeenyusses. ---
**Author:** ![Zakalwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zakalwe/32/270_2.png) [@Zakalwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zakalwe)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 1:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/36 "2013-07-20T13:26:35Z")
Apparently at least one of the mods is ahead of you since our latest little screed seems to have been disappeared. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/37 "2013-07-20T13:34:02Z")
> [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > Dunno what it is with the influx of square-jawed, steely-eyed idealists this week, but I think if I read one more unprocessed Randian, Marxist, Libertarian or anarchist transcription of How The World Should Be written by someone who cannot be told the sky really is blue, I’m-a gonna scream. > > I wouldn’t mind as much if any of these posters seemed to have exercised a few of their own synapses before dumping dogmatic dippiness on us. But arguing raw and largely misunderstood dialectic with people who aren’t quite sure how things work in the real world (or at least the present day)… tiresome. Enough. Think a while before posting any more of this, you sophomores on summer break. You did NOT discover the One Truth by reading that one optional poli sci book. This song keeps running through my head \*\*MY BACK PAGES \*\*by _Bob Dylan_ Crimson flames tied through my ears Rollin’ high and mighty traps Pounced with fire on flaming roads Using ideas as my maps “We’ll meet on edges, soon,” said I Proud ’neath heated brow Ah, but I was so much older then I’m younger than that now Half-wracked prejudice leaped forth “Rip down all hate,” I screamed Lies that life is black and white Spoke from my skull. I dreamed Romantic facts of musketeers Foundationed deep, somehow Ah, but I was so much older then I’m younger than that now Girls’ faces formed the forward path From phony jealousy To memorizing politics Of ancient history Flung down by corpse evangelists Unthought of, though, somehow Ah, but I was so much older then I’m younger than that now A self-ordained professor’s tongue Too serious to fool Spouted out that liberty Is just equality in school “Equality,” I spoke the word As if a wedding vow Ah, but I was so much older then I’m younger than that now In a soldier’s stance, I aimed my hand At the mongrel dogs who teach Fearing not that I’d become my enemy In the instant that I preach My pathway led by confusion boats Mutiny from stern to bow Ah, but I was so much older then I’m younger than that now Yes, my guard stood hard when abstract threats Too noble to neglect Deceived me into thinking I had something to protect Good and bad, I define these terms Quite clear, no doubt, somehow Ah, but I was so much older then I’m younger than that now Copyright © 1964 by Warner Bros. Inc.; renewed 1992 by Special Rider Music Read more: [http://www.bobdylan.com/us/songs/my-back-pages#ixzz2Zamj6eeW](http://www.bobdylan.com/us/songs/my-back-pages#ixzz2Zamj6eeW) ---
**Author:** ![Amateur\_Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/59ef9b/32.png) [@Amateur\_Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amateur_Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [July 20, 2013, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/38 "2013-07-20T13:41:19Z")
A motion for Dylan is always in order. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![the\_diego](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7bcc69/32.png) [@the\_diego](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/the_diego)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2013, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/39 "2013-07-21T23:30:33Z")
> [@woodstockbirdybird](#): > > Dear God, you really are the dumbest piece of shit on the boards (for which you should thank the mods - you were in the #2 position until the **Lonesome Polecat** banning). Mountain Jew then. Is that dumb? ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [July 23, 2013, 9:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679/40 "2013-07-23T09:37:58Z")
It’s times like these that I wish we had a single-click ignore function that I could use right from a post. Having to click on the user name too is just too much when it’s so hot and there are so many idiots to ignore. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idealistic-arrogance-a-product-of-hot-weather-and-no-school/663679.md?page=1)