# Idiocracy - Cecil's favorite movie (or worst nightmare)? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [September 1, 2009, 9:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461 "2009-09-01T09:10:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2009, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/41 "2009-09-01T22:22:09Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > The movie never once suggests that the stupidity is native and genetic, which is the only basis on which your criticism is valid. It does, actually. In the prologue. Stupid people have children they can’t afford, who have more children they can’t afford because they inherited stupidity from their parents. I don’t think the movie suggests this is really the case, it’s just an excuse to get the US to an apocalyptically stupid state so as to examine modern consumerism and anti-intellectualism writ large. Via the mechanism of recliners with built in toilets and new, improved french fries featuring more molecules. Of course. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2009, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/42 "2009-09-01T22:30:36Z")
> [@lissener](#): > > The movie never once suggests that the stupidity is native and genetic, which is the only basis on which your criticism is valid. From the [synopsis](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0387808/synopsis) : > [@](#): > > A narrator explains that natural selection is indifferent to intelligence, so that in a society in which intelligence is systematically debased, **stupid people easily out-breed the intelligent** , creating, over the course of five centuries, an irremediably dysfunctional society. > [@Tahssa](#): > > I must be out of the loop could someone please link to a news story for all these forced mass sterilizations based upon the premise of Idiocracy please because google isn’t bringing anything up. [America indulged in the compulsory sterilization](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compulsory_sterilization#United_States) of those it deemed to be genetically unfit, which conveniently turned out to generally be the poor or racial minorities. Often without being told what it was for; they were told it was for something like appendicitis and had to figure out on their own that they’d been sterilized, many years later. All considered perfectly legal and noble at the time. ---
**Author:** ![NDP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ndp/32/55_2.png) [@NDP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NDP)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2009, 11:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/43 "2009-09-01T23:48:10Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > It does, actually. In the prologue. Stupid people have children they can’t afford, who have more children they can’t afford because they inherited stupidity from their parents. > > I don’t think the movie suggests this is really the case, it’s just an excuse to get the US to an apocalyptically stupid state so as to examine modern consumerism and anti-intellectualism writ large. > > Via the mechanism of recliners with built in toilets and new, improved french fries featuring more molecules. Of course. It’s best not to get too wrapped up in the movie’s explanation of how society got so stupid in 500 years. **Idiocracy** is supposed to be distorted mirror of early 21st century America. Even though some overly serious people may see [unfortunate implications](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/UnfortunateImplications) to the film, it’s not an argument for eugenics. ---
**Author:** ![El\_Kabong](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/el_kabong/32/496_2.png) [@El\_Kabong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/El_Kabong)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 12:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/44 "2009-09-02T00:40:27Z")
> [@NDP](#): > > It’s best not to get too wrapped up in the movie’s explanation of how society got so stupid in 500 years. **Idiocracy** is supposed to be distorted mirror of early 21st century America. Even though some overly serious people may see [unfortunate implications](http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/UnfortunateImplications) to the film, it’s not an argument for eugenics. Of course it isn’t. Hey, I can’t help noticing more than a whiff of Ayn Rand in the film, myself, but for me it seems mainly to be Mike Judge’s lament for the culture of instant and effortless gratification, with a dollop of contempt for the sort of aggressive anti-intellectualism that factually exists in a broad spectrum of Americans. The thing that strikes me the most is just how bitter and depressing much of this ostensible comedy is. Yes, the situation is at root absurd, and the seams certainly show due to the non-existent budget under which it was filmed, but there are numerous brilliant bits and generally wonderful performances in spite of it all. I found it effective enough that by 2/3s in, Luke Wilson’s horrifying predicament was almost unbearable to watch. I’m mighty happy such a scenario is indeed unlikely, because if I were trapped in it, I’d be suicidal within hours. Just my opinion, but one of the more interesting movies of the past few years, regardless of what one thinks of the morality of the premise. ---
**Author:** ![Absconditus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/a88e4f/32.png) [@Absconditus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Absconditus)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/45 "2009-09-02T02:29:33Z")
> [@](#): > > They are addressing the premise of the movie, which you also did in the OP. > [@](#): > > People haven’t used the premise of Spaceballs to engage in forced mass sterilizations; there’s one difference. We must have watched different movies, and entered into this discussion with different objectives. (Peruses OP…funny…cautionary tale…present and future state of human culture and knowledge. Nope, nothing about genocide via forced sterilization being alluded to or encouraged by either the movie or my proposed discussion, from my perspective). Even though I started this thread, I’m gonna stay very far away from it from now on. ---
**Author:** ![lissener](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lissener/32/6139_2.png) [@lissener](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lissener)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/46 "2009-09-02T03:56:49Z")
The fact that anyone can come away from that movie thinking that it suggests a support for eugenics of the poor is astonishing to me. Do you really think that the portrayal of the rich childless couple was sympathetic? If possible they’re made to look even more ridiculous than the overly fertile people. It’s about how our fucked up priorities–across the board, rich and poor (NOT inherently smart and dumb)–the educated classes and the uneducated classes–how our fucked up priorities will lead to our own eventual downfall. To get eugenics out of that is mind boggling to me. ---
**Author:** ![Face\_Intentionally\_Left\_Blank](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/face_intentionally_left_blank/32/288_2.png) [@Face\_Intentionally\_Left\_Blank](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Face_Intentionally_Left_Blank)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/47 "2009-09-02T04:47:25Z")
I really didn’t expect _Idiocracy_, of all movies, to be a Rorschach test in movie form, but we’re getting some really interesting responses here. People who didn’t see the movie probably should refrain from basing a thesis on it, even in their own head, much less in public. I don’t think getting into that habit is something that can help foster rational thought or discussion on any subject. I doubt actually watching the movie would change anyone’s opinion if they go into it with strong preconceived notions. As we see, time and again in many political threads, ppl tend to find whatever truth they’re looking for. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/48 "2009-09-02T13:34:38Z")
> [@myskepticsight](#): > > Who didn’t realize Brawndo wasn’t very healthy, and shouldn’t replace water, and wouldn’t be sufficient hydration to grow plant life? How do you forget about the useful properties of one of the most useful substances on earth? But Brawndo has electrolytes. It’s what plants crave. ---
**Author:** ![mobo85](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mobo85](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mobo85)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/49 "2009-09-02T15:14:07Z")
Is the fact that there is a licensed Brawndo drink (licensed by a company that specializes in licensing real versions of fictional products called Omni Consumer Products, no less) funny or sad? I think it’s amusing myself, but some have commented on the irony of an actual product coming out of what was meant by a satire of consumer culture- one that the studio tried to bury, no less. (Omni also brings us Sex Panther cologne and Tru Blood.) ---
**Author:** ![athelas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5e9695/32.png) [@athelas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/athelas)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/50 "2009-09-02T16:22:06Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Nonsense. Poor people have more children; the whole logic behind such works is that poverty=stupidity, therefore the fact that poor people have more children means that the future will be full of stupid people. That’s what the “idiocracy” scenario has ALWAYS been about. This turns out…not to be the case. During the Middle Ages, the rich reproduced more than the poor, an effect that Greg Cochran convincingly pieced together in [A Farewell to Alms](http://www.amazon.com/Farewell-Alms-Economic-History-Princeton/dp/0691121354). This occurred concurrently with a number of factors pointing to increasing **future time orientation** , including falling interest rates and lower homicide rates. This argues that upper-class values, including future time orientation, diffused downward over the centuries. We are not descended from the entirety of the feudal people, but from the middle and upper class. Don’t believe that genetic change can occur on that small a timescale? Look at [The 10,000 Year Explosion](http://the10000yearexplosion.com/). Meanwhile, there’s solid [evidence](http://www.gnxp.com/blog/2009/06/differences-in-fertility-by-class.php) from throughout the [world](http://www.gnxp.com/blog/2009/06/tfr-by-class-and-nation.php) that the lower classes have more kids than the upper classes. Women who go to college, for example, have on average one fewer child than those who do not, and the perverse incentives for welfare fecundity are well known. ---
**Author:** ![Shot\_From\_Guns](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ccd318/32.png) [@Shot\_From\_Guns](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shot_From_Guns)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/51 "2009-09-02T16:33:55Z")
> [@Absconditus](#): > > Since I was quoting directly from the screenplay, I don’t think I was being ironic in using “who’s” instead of “whose,” which is the correct usage in the referred instance. I was suggesting that it was ironic that you made a basic language error while quoting this particular movie. And I’d love to know who your connection was, that you have your hands on an actual copy of the screenplay. (If you really were copying directly from an official screenplay and you’d noticed the error, wouldn’t you have put \*sic \*after it, anyway?) > [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > Poor people have more children; the whole logic behind such works is that poverty=stupidity, therefore the fact that poor people have more children means that the future will be full of stupid people. Poor people don’t have more children; people who don’t use birth control have more children. Poor people have access to free or seriously discounted birth control; I should know, I was one of them when I was a broke-ass student. So, the people who have lots of children are those who are too stupid or too ignorant to use birth control. Now, “too ignorant” might not be their own fault (thanks, bullshit abstinence-only “sex-ed”), but that doesn’t mean the next generation is going to be any \*\*less \*\*ignorant \*\*if \*\*the education system stays the same. > [@lissener](#): > > The fact that anyone can come away from that movie thinking that it suggests a support for eugenics of the poor is astonishing to me. Do you really think that the portrayal of the rich childless couple was sympathetic? If possible they’re made to look even more ridiculous than the overly fertile people. Not “more,” but certainly “just as.” But I’m guessing \*\*Der Trihs \*\*hasn’t actually \*\*seen \*\*the movie–he just read a summary somewhere and decided to rant about it. ---
**Author:** ![Jamaika\_a\_jamaikaiake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7993a0/32.png) [@Jamaika\_a\_jamaikaiake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jamaika_a_jamaikaiake)\ **Post date:** [September 2, 2009, 5:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/52 "2009-09-02T17:02:40Z")
> [@Jamaika\_a\_jamaikaiake](#): > > The movie Idiocracy takes on an arrogant, self-satisfied, eletist tone. Spaceballs does not. If I may clarify (and quote myself), since this thread seems to have gotten contentious: I thought the movie was fun. “Because you talk like a fag, and your shit’s all retarded.” is _hilarious_. I also think that Mike Judge came across as arrogant. His stuff abut language really made me shudder at his ignorance. I think we should be careful to not think that those who are responding negatively to its overratedness necessary dislike the movie entirely. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2009, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/53 "2009-09-12T13:56:06Z")
:slight resurrection: My wife and I saw it last night. The corporate logos are hilarious and the language was funny, but the movie was almost too long at 85 minutes or so. I liked: Carls Jr.'s logo/motto: Fuck you! I’m eating! Uhmerican Exxxpress: Don’t leave home! ButtFuckers. I just love the slow pan to the children’s party…at Buttfuckers. ---
**Author:** ![mobo85](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b19c9b/32.png) [@mobo85](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mobo85)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2009, 4:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/54 "2009-09-12T16:08:50Z")
> [@Mahaloth](#): > > Carls Jr.'s logo/motto: Fuck you! I’m eating! The Carl’s Jr drive-through voice-over (which I believe is an uncredited Tom Kenny) is one of the funniest performances in the movie. “Would you like to try our new **EXTRA BIG-ASS TACO** , now with more **MOLECULES**?” ---
**Author:** ![Fionn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a587f6/32.png) [@Fionn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fionn)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2009, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/55 "2009-09-12T16:48:17Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > Which made me wonder: who made the microphones? Who made the plane the doctor’s girlfriend flies? Who made the movie and TV cameras to allow “Ow, my balls!” and “Ass” to be filmed. My girlfriend and I speculated that other countries didn’t go through what the US did in the Idiocracy-verse and so the they could have imported stuff in. ---
**Author:** ![TWDuke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e495f1/32.png) [@TWDuke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TWDuke)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2009, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/56 "2009-09-12T16:57:07Z")
A) It’s not a serious attempt to foretell the future. B) It’s possible for people to be technically adept in a specific area and still behave like idiots in general. ---
**Author:** ![EllisDee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ellisdee/32/4531_2.png) [@EllisDee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EllisDee)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2009, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/57 "2009-09-13T00:18:25Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > snotty, self-congratulatory and obnoxious Sounds like much of Cafe Society. ---
**Author:** ![DWMarch](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dwmarch/32/1010_2.png) [@DWMarch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DWMarch)\ **Post date:** [September 13, 2009, 8:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461/58 "2009-09-13T08:35:37Z")
I wonder if the congresscritter from South Carolina who heckled Obama during the health care speech is a fan of this movie…? “I’ve got a solution… you’re a dick! South Carolina, what’s up?” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-cecils-favorite-movie-or-worst-nightmare/508461.md?page=2)