# Idiocracy, It is closer than you think **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 1, 2007, 3:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-it-is-closer-than-you-think/394119 "2007-03-01T03:54:46Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 8\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2007, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-it-is-closer-than-you-think/394119/41 "2007-03-03T01:48:48Z")
> [@Martini Enfield](#): > > […] the US is the only country (that I’m aware of) that uses “Alien” to describe Foreign Nationals living in their country. > > The only context I ever heard the world “Alien” when I was growing up in NZ was referring to either Space Aliens, or actual concepts/ideas (“an alien concept”). The term was never applied to people […] The New Zealand government apparently still [uses the term “alien”](http://www.teara.govt.nz/NewZealanders/NewZealandPeoples/Citizenship/3/en) interchangeably with “non-citizen”: > [@](#): > > Aliens and citizens > > New Zealand’s non-citizens have always had fewer rights than its citizens, especially in wartime. In some respects, however, disadvantages gradually disappeared. The Aliens Acts of 1866 and 1870 permitted the subjects of ‘friendly States’ to hold personal property and real estate under the same conditions as British subjects. Aliens became eligible to vote – but not to stand as candidates – in local body elections in 1926. > > The 1948 Aliens Act > > New Zealand’s last Aliens Act, passed in 1948 just before the introduction of New Zealand citizenship, stipulated that aliens could not own shares in New Zealand-registered ships, hold parliamentary office, or vote in parliamentary elections. They could be deported if convicted of any offence punishable by more than a year’s imprisonment, or if it was ‘not conducive to the public good’ that they remain in the country. Aliens could not be admitted as barristers or solicitors, or as members of some other professional bodies. […] > > During the third quarter of the 20th century, about a third of the aliens naturalised were Dutch; the next largest group, at around 10% of annual totals of 1,000 to 1,500, was the Chinese. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2007, 2:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-it-is-closer-than-you-think/394119/42 "2007-03-03T02:02:05Z")
I’ll concede the term “Alien” has been applied to foreigners in the past, but to the best of my knowledge it’s not in current use, except in reference to legislation last passed in the late 1940s. Secondly: Regardless of what the Government may have officially used, I never heard anyone in New Zealand refer to a Foreigner as an “Alien” in the 18 years that I lived there. Seeing as we’ve had another NZer in the thread here saying much the same thing, I think we can safely assume that, to a number of people both inside and outside the US, “Alien” is not a term usually associated with people from other countries in everyday use. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2007, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-it-is-closer-than-you-think/394119/43 "2007-03-03T02:15:05Z")
> [@Martini Enfield](#): > > but to the best of my knowledge it’s not in current use, except in reference to legislation last passed in the late 1940s. Seems to be still current as a synonym for “non-citizen” in official government information, as in [this immigration webpage at govt.nz](http://glossary.immigration.govt.nz/VisaFreeCountries.htm): > [@](#): > > Visa waiver does not apply to people travelling on alien’s (non-citizen’s) passports issued by these countries. Note also the reference in my previous cite to “aliens” naturalised in the third quarter of the 20th century. > [@Martini Enfield](#): > > Regardless of what the Government may have officially used, I never heard anyone in New Zealand refer to a Foreigner as an “Alien” in the 18 years that I lived there. Granted. I was just questioning your earlier statement that the US is the only country that uses “alien” to refer to non-citizen residents. ---
**Author:** ![Martini\_Enfield](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/martini_enfield/32/11123_2.png) [@Martini\_Enfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Martini_Enfield)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2007, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-it-is-closer-than-you-think/394119/44 "2007-03-03T04:24:01Z")
[QUOTE=Kimstu] Granted. I was just questioning your earlier statement that the US is the only country that uses “alien” to refer to non-citizen residents. [/QUOTE] Sorry, I probably should have been a bit clearer: I meant that the US is the only country in which- as far as I’m aware- the _general populace_ (as opposed to Government Departments) still use “Alien” to refer to Foreigners. My fault for not being clearer there. ---
**Author:** ![asterion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/4da419/32.png) [@asterion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asterion)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2007, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-it-is-closer-than-you-think/394119/45 "2007-03-03T05:01:53Z")
[QUOTE=Martini Enfield] Sorry, I probably should have been a bit clearer: I meant that the US is the only country in which- as far as I’m aware- the _general populace_ (as opposed to Government Departments) still use “Alien” to refer to Foreigners. My fault for not being clearer there. [/QUOTE] Yeah, but that allowed for an amusing joke in _Men In Black_. The opening scene with the border patrol stopping the truck, everything that happens after that, and then K saying “Keep protecting us from dangerous aliens.” ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [March 3, 2007, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-it-is-closer-than-you-think/394119/46 "2007-03-03T05:08:14Z")
In my high school political science class in Canada in the 1970s, we learned and used the term “alien”. We were taught that it was the standard term for people from one country who were living in another country but who hadn’t attained citizenship or similar recognized status. Ed ---
**Author:** ![betenoir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/258eb7/32.png) [@betenoir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/betenoir)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2007, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-it-is-closer-than-you-think/394119/47 "2007-03-04T11:49:34Z")
[QUOTE=Martini Enfield] Yes, but the US is the only country (that I’m aware of) that uses “Alien” to describe Foreign Nationals living in their country. The only context I ever heard the world “Alien” when I was growing up in NZ was referring to either Space Aliens, or actual concepts/ideas (“an alien concept”). The term was _never_ applied to people, and to me it has somewhat negative connotations. [/QUOTE] Yeah but…the US _is_ what we’re talking about here. And that’s how we’ve used the term. Is it negative? Only, as I said, if you think being different (not born here, not English as you first language, eats weird food etc.) is a negative thing. If we think they are, foreigner will become just as a derogatory word. Or we’ll start calling spacing aliens “foreigners”. Which should be and day now. Yeah, right. ---
**Author:** ![Miss\_Purl\_McKnittington](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e9a140/32.png) [@Miss\_Purl\_McKnittington](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miss_Purl_McKnittington)\ **Post date:** [March 4, 2007, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-it-is-closer-than-you-think/394119/48 "2007-03-04T13:04:38Z")
[QUOTE=Charger] _Thank you._ I hate when people say that some horrible grammatical error has been deemed correct because of its wide usage. I hate that. I hate it a…lot. [/QUOTE] Oh, do you? Well, then it might interest you to know that an ellipsis is a series of exactly three periods with a space on either side. This, of course, is contrary to widespread usage on the Internet and I’m sure other media. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/idiocracy-it-is-closer-than-you-think/394119.md?page=2)