# If a commercial jet is re-painted do they strip the old paint or just paint over what is there? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [July 25, 2020, 6:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301 "2020-07-25T06:29:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2020, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/21 "2020-07-27T14:51:15Z")
> [@GaryM](#): > > The other method was using high powered flash tubes to basically thermally shock to paint loose from the substrate. Again, no chemicals to clean up and easy claenup of the paint chips. > > Looks like [Flash Jet](https://boeing.mediaroom.com/1998-06-12-FLASHJET-Paint-Removal-Systems-Completes-Fiftieth-Apache-Fuselage) is working. > > And [here](https://www.robins.af.mil/News/Article-Display/Article/377579/in-a-flash-flashjet-robot-strips-away-paint/) Your description sounds similar to this laser-based rust remover. I wonder if that could find use for stripping paint. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/Q8q3DZB_l6M/maxresdefault.jpg "Laser Cleaning: HIGH POWER 1000W!") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8q3DZB_l6M) ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [July 27, 2020, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/22 "2020-07-27T16:48:59Z")
> [@Limmin](#): > > My dad few for TWA for decades, and pointed out to me one day that less paint = better fuel economy. He said that American Airlines, whose jets had less paint and more aluminum showing, was an example of a company that was benefiting from this. > > (I dunno about long term effects, but let me mention that eventually, TWA was purchased by AA. Which probably means the red and white painted MD-80s my dad flew were stripped of their paint to become AA style.) I was just going to mention that. They were indeed stripped of their paint after AA inherited them. Here’s a photo of a TWA MD-80, registration number N9414W, taken in 1999: [![](https://imgproc.airliners.net/photos/airliners/9/0/3/5752309.jpg?v=v497519f65d7) ](https://imgproc.airliners.net/photos/airliners/9/0/3/5752309.jpg?v=v497519f65d7) And here’s the same plane in 2002: [![](https://imgproc.airliners.net/photos/airliners/1/0/7/0850701.jpg?v=v40) ](https://imgproc.airliners.net/photos/airliners/1/0/7/0850701.jpg?v=v40) As for fuel economy, I seem to recall reading that an unpainted plane does indeed save fuel. However, the tradeoff is that the bare aluminum requires more maintenance to prevent corrosion. When you take the cost of the additional maintenance into account, there’s not much cost savings overall with an unpainted plane. ---
**Author:** ![needscoffee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/needscoffee/32/1076_2.png) [@needscoffee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/needscoffee)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 1:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/23 "2020-07-28T01:48:26Z")
> [@penultima\_thule](#): > > In a conventional white paint, 90% of the pigment by weight is titanium dioxide. White paint is heavy.  Of course 90% of the _pigment_ by weight is titanium dioxide; that’s the main white pigment that’s used (also used in food such as clam chowder, food coloring, etc). Do you mean 90% of the weight of the _paint_ is titanium dioxide? Or am I misreading what you wrote? ---
**Author:** ![Limmin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f04885/32.png) [@Limmin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Limmin)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/24 "2020-07-28T15:19:04Z")
Thanks for the nice pix WildaBeast! I was able to view them on my phone (it pinged me when you replied) but for some reason, they don’t show in my Chrome browser. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/25 "2020-07-28T15:40:08Z")
Likewise. I get Error 1011 messages for both. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/26 "2020-07-28T15:45:15Z")
That website doesn’t like hotlinking. Once enough people request this page they automatically lock down those images at least temporarily. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/27 "2020-07-28T15:53:43Z")
As an aside, why are all modern unpainted aircraft yellow green? As opposed to the silver aluminium they used to be? ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 3:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/28 "2020-07-28T15:57:18Z")
Yeah, apparently [airliners.net](http://airliners.net) doesn’t like hotlinking. Unfortunately it’s too late to go back and edit, but here are the direct links to the pictures. > **[Aviation Photo #5752309: McDonnell Douglas MD-83 (DC-9-83) - Trans World...](https://www.airliners.net/photo/Trans-World-Airlines-TWA/McDonnell-Douglas-MD-83-DC-9-83/5752309?qsp=eJwtjcEKwjAQRP9lz16KRbC3%2BgHqQfC8bIYaiE3YXaGl9N%2BNwdvw5jGzkeTZsfhjLaCBDKzyogMVVn4bDRsppmiu7DHPo%2FiHU%2FWu577rn9WzrH5ZKwnsGEVQHOHPbxqgvwombXKqF10N0HvLdDxVHqKVxG0DzjHRvn8BQeQyDw%3D%3D)** > > Photo taken at Miami - International (Wilcox Field / 36th Street / Pan American Field) (MIA / KMIA) in Florida, USA on February 3, 1999. > **[Aviation Photo #0850701: McDonnell Douglas MD-83 (DC-9-83) - American Airlines](https://www.airliners.net/photo/American-Airlines/McDonnell-Douglas-MD-83-DC-9-83/850701?qsp=eJwtjcEKwjAQRP9lz16KRbC3%2BgHqQfC8bIYaiE3YXaGl9N%2BNwdvw5jGzkeTZsfhjLaCBDKzyogMVVn4bDRsppmiu7DHPo%2FiHU%2FWu577rn9WzrH5ZKwnsGEVQHOHPbxqgvwombXKqF10N0HvLdDxVHqKVxG0DzjHRvn8BQeQyDw%3D%3D)** > > Note TWA service graphic - Photo taken at Richmond - International (Byrd Field) (RIC / KRIC) in Virginia, USA on August 18, 2002. ---
**Author:** ![Dorjan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dorjan/32/12440_2.png) [@Dorjan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dorjan)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/29 "2020-07-28T16:23:20Z")
That was incredibly satisfying to watch. ---
**Author:** ![Limmin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f04885/32.png) [@Limmin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Limmin)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/30 "2020-07-28T17:06:04Z")
Yellow-green…I’m going to guess that is a primer / protectant layer, sprayed over the bare aluminum. They’ve been using stuff like this on aircraft for a long time. In the US, during WWII, we used zinc chromate. They had a different formula in Japan, so the interior surfaces (wings, fuselage, wheel wells) of WWII aircraft like the Zero were a shiny blue color. ---
**Author:** ![Limmin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f04885/32.png) [@Limmin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Limmin)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/31 "2020-07-28T17:11:43Z")
(Would edit, but apparently 5+ minutes is “a long time ago” ETA: This yellow-green shade is no doubt covered up by the final paint layers. For an unpainted look, i.e. silvery metal finish, no doubt they have a transparent primer / final coat they use, we just don’t see it because it’s clear. I can’t imagine them using just bare metal… ---
**Author:** ![Limmin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f04885/32.png) [@Limmin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Limmin)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/32 "2020-07-28T17:15:27Z")
Error 1011? That makes sense, because these planes were not Lockheed L1011’s… ---
**Author:** ![Limmin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f04885/32.png) [@Limmin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Limmin)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/33 "2020-07-28T17:22:18Z")
Imagine using the hand-held device to shave. Alright, I’ve posted enough in this thread for a while… 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [July 28, 2020, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/34 "2020-07-28T19:36:03Z")
> [@Limmin](#): > > Error 1011? That makes sense, because these planes were not Lockheed L1011’s… I kid you not. ---
**Author:** ![am77494](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d2c977/32.png) [@am77494](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/am77494)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2020, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/35 "2020-07-29T00:35:22Z")
> [@Limmin](#): > > In the US, during WWII, we used zinc chromate. They had a different formula in Japan, so the interior surfaces ( “ In the U.S. aircraft industry, zinc chromate was in widespread use by the outbreak of World War II. However, Germany and other “axis powers” didn’t use it at all, relying on _lacquer-based protective coatings. ”_ (Italics mine), From : [https://aerospace.honeywell.com/en/learn/about-us/blogs/2017/04/the-history-of-the-green-aircraft](https://aerospace.honeywell.com/en/learn/about-us/blogs/2017/04/the-history-of-the-green-aircraft) > [@Limmin](#): > > This yellow-green shade is no doubt covered up by the final paint layers. “Surface preparation for painting begins with using an alkaline cleaner _remove the green temporary protective coating fr_om the airplane skin.” (Italics mine). From : [http://www.boeing.com/commercial/aeromagazine/aero\_12/paint\_story.html](http://www.boeing.com/commercial/aeromagazine/aero_12/paint_story.html) ---
**Author:** ![Rocketeer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocketeer/32/4437_2.png) [@Rocketeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rocketeer)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2020, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/36 "2020-07-29T05:07:08Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > > [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > > > What’s an “OD”? > > Old dollar, Rooster Cogburn’s horse. > > But olive drab works. > > It helped the USAAF’s decision to remove the paint in 1944 that they had air superiority over England. No need for camo on the ground. > > The situation led to an interesting case where a creative maintenance crew took two damaged B17s and grafted them together at the midpoint. One of them was bare metal. But for some reason I can’t find a picture of it. Are you thinking of the [“Swoose”](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Swoose)? Actress Swoosie Kurtz was named after it. ---
**Author:** ![Rocketeer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rocketeer/32/4437_2.png) [@Rocketeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rocketeer)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2020, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/37 "2020-07-29T05:08:15Z")
Or it could be [“Half and Half”.](https://www.reddit.com/r/WeirdWings/comments/cgvcf7/boeing_b17_half_and_half_created_by_boltng/) ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2020, 3:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/38 "2020-07-29T15:38:19Z")
> [@Rocketeer](#): > > Are you thinking of the [“Swoose”](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Swoose)? Actress Swoosie Kurtz was named after it. Found it! It was “Little Miss Mischief”, based in England. They grafted the nose from a bare-metal, Vega-built B17 onto the tail of an OD Boeing built bomber. [Little Miss Mischief (painting)](https://aircraft.desktopnexus.com/get/908821/?t=6iuj9h1j4dvms4a2iq01hmbi505f219705e5ccf) [After a hard landing](https://www.worldwarphotos.info/gallery/usa/aircrafts-2-3/b-17/b-17g-91-bomb-group-4/) ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2020, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/39 "2020-07-29T15:41:10Z")
> [@Rocketeer](#): > > Or it could be [“Half and Half”.](https://www.reddit.com/r/WeirdWings/comments/cgvcf7/boeing_b17_half_and_half_created_by_boltng/) Your post wasn’t there when I made mine, even though it was 11 hours before. Hmmm… so much for better board performance. Anyway, yep that’s it! ---
**Author:** ![Limmin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f04885/32.png) [@Limmin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Limmin)\ **Post date:** [July 29, 2020, 3:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301/40 "2020-07-29T15:42:09Z")
Thanks, good info! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-a-commercial-jet-is-re-painted-do-they-strip-the-old-paint-or-just-paint-over-what-is-there/916301.md?page=1)