# If Alabama is totally intransigent about gay marriage, how do the feds enforce their supremacy? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 18, 2015, 7:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984 "2015-02-18T07:35:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2015, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984/41 "2015-03-07T01:17:38Z")
The President could issue an executive order a la immigration that would have serious consequences for Federal spending in Alabama. I doubt it will come to that, though - **SlackerInc** ’s educated guess seems more likely. Both Ike and JFK were reluctant to send in the troops to enforce Federal court orders, and had considerable back-channel contact with Southern governors at the time in order to work out peaceful resolutions, but when push came to shove, they were willing - and I suspect Obama will be, too. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2015, 2:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984/42 "2015-03-07T02:14:55Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > See, this is why we still have nukes. > > In reality, all it would take is a freeze on Federal funding to anything in Alabama to get the state to fold like a cheap fan. Perhaps, but you say “all it would take” as if that were something that had some realistic probability of happening when the actual probability of that happening is essentially zero. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2015, 3:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984/43 "2015-03-07T03:42:14Z")
I don’t know. The president could do it easily by executive order. But I’d prefer sending in the 101st Airborne, armed to the teeth with orders to shoot anybody who says a thing. ---
**Author:** ![Senegoid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/senegoid/32/6606_2.png) [@Senegoid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Senegoid)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2015, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984/44 "2015-03-07T06:30:33Z")
Or just have the 101st Airborne drop a blizzard of fill-in-the-blank marriage certificates over all the populated areas of the state. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2015, 7:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984/45 "2015-03-07T07:23:55Z")
> [@silenus](#): > > I don’t know. The president could do it easily by executive order. But I’d prefer sending in the 101st Airborne, armed to the teeth with orders to shoot anybody who says a thing. Is that a factual answer to the question? ---
**Author:** ![Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/46a35a/32.png) [@Tim\_T-Bonham.net](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tim_T-Bonham.net)\ **Post date:** [March 7, 2015, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984/46 "2015-03-07T22:06:48Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > Is that a factual answer to the question? Yes, it is factually correct that this what Silenus prefers. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2015, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984/47 "2015-03-09T14:10:49Z")
> [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](#): > > Both Ike and JFK were reluctant to send in the troops to enforce Federal court orders, and had considerable back-channel contact with Southern governors at the time in order to work out peaceful resolutions, but when push came to shove, they were willing - and I suspect Obama will be, too. The problem here is that it’s not the governor who holds the reins here. It’s Roy Moore, since he is the guy at the top of the probate judges’ hierarchy. Moore has already shown he’s willing to lose his job rather than accept the existence of the Supremacy Clause. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2015, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984/48 "2015-03-09T15:05:21Z")
> [@t-bonham@scc.net](#): > > Yes, it is factually correct that this what Silenus prefers. Correction: I would _prefer_ that Alabama stop acting like children and get it through their collective heads that they are trying to live in the 19th century, and the rest of the country won’t let them. And there is not a damn thing they can do about it, in the end, without totally bankrupting their state. No matter what they try, in the end they are going to lose. If it takes sending in troops to show them the error of their ways, so be it. What’s General Sherman been up to lately, anyway? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2015, 6:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984/49 "2015-03-09T18:30:44Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > If they actually \*use \*their “whatever”. Remember, for several months before the Civil War, a bunch of states were in open secession, but the feds didn’t try to bring them back in line by force until the South foolishly bombarded Ft. Sumter. In more recent times, the only real use of Northern force I can think of was the federal troops that enforced desegregation. But even there, who knows what would have happened had the schools refused to operate with black kids in them. > > And then much more recently, we had Rancher Bundy scare off a federal agency with a bunch of gun-toting friends. They haven’t gone back as far as I’ve heard. > > I’m sure if the federal government is determined enough, they will get their way. But if there is enough resistance by the state, I wonder how the logistics of it all would work, and how assiduous the feds would be in doing what needs to be done. It seems to me that most of the time, the Supreme Court issues a ruling, and the states just grumble a bit and go along, making it relatively easy. So this, in modern times, is potentially new terrain. But if the feds had really wanted to “get into it” with rancher Bundy, then they would have had plenty of “ammo” without getting close. Seize his bank accounts, seize his cattle from whoever bought them, etc. They wisely chose that getting into another Waco was not a good idea, (see, even the Federal Government can learn) and decided it wasn’t worth the hassle. But… even a few years of living off the grid would make life difficult for any businessman. Sure, he could have sold his cattle to another rancher for cash. But then the feds would have seized the cattle, tied things up in court for a year or two with the argument that the other fellow was acting as an agent for Bundy, etc. I’m sure they could have made life difficult and discouraged others from doing Bundy favours, and not everyone wants to take on the feds. And unlike a lone rancher (ranger?) a county or state needs bank accounts to pay employees, pay bills for supplies, etc. Just ask anyone who’s tangled with the tax people, it’s no fun when they start seizing bank accounts. ---
**Author:** ![SlackerInc](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slackerinc/32/275_2.png) [@SlackerInc](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SlackerInc)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2015, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984/50 "2015-03-10T01:27:19Z")
But they _didn’t_ do any of that, which logically can only be presumed to embolden others until the feds demonstrate they are willing to put the hammer down. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [March 10, 2015, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984/51 "2015-03-10T04:14:19Z")
> [@SlackerInc](#): > > But they _didn’t_ do any of that, which logically can only be presumed to embolden others until the feds demonstrate they are willing to put the hammer down. That was what I thought. I can see tactically pulling back to avoid another Ruby Ridge-style situation in the short term, but that shouldn’t be the last word. Outright public defiance of lawful Federal authority by anyone is unacceptable, as Washington noted during the Whiskey Rebellion, Jackson in the Nullification Crisis, Lincoln after Ft. Sumter, Eisenhower and Kennedy during the Civil Rights Era, etc. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-alabama-is-totally-intransigent-about-gay-marriage-how-do-the-feds-enforce-their-supremacy/712984.md?page=2)