# If all the illegal workers up and left the US what would really happen? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 30, 2006, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800 "2006-04-30T02:00:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2006, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/21 "2006-05-04T14:43:12Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > There is a difference between “strong” language and ethnic slurs. “Spic” is an ethnic slur. “Wetback” is not – it is a derogatory term designating illegal immigrant status. (Not too well-thought-out, either – as I understand it, most of the year you can cross the Rio Grande without wetting your **feet.)** ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2006, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/22 "2006-05-04T15:00:00Z")
> [@Happy Wanderer](#): > > I would trade those costs for solvent local and state governments, decent wages for citizens, reduced crime, enough jail beds to keep serious offenders in jail for the full term, solvent emergency rooms and trauma centers where you could get in to see a doctor in less than nine hours, a halt to the re-emergence of such diseases as tuburculosis and hepatitis, and an end to the underground economy that makes everyone that plays by the rules a bankrupted chump. So, getting rid of illegal immigrants will make everything all better? Sign me up! -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f07891/32.png) [@Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Plastic_Ninja)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2006, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/23 "2006-05-04T19:20:10Z")
Speaking from personal experience, at least one individual using a false SSN just claimed a crapload of deductions so that almost no income taxes were withheld from their paycheck whatsoever. Naturally, they did not file in April, so I was left with a bill of over $1000, when I was in college and had made barely that amount in the entire year. When I finally got it sorted out through the IRS, the individual I spoke to said “Oh yes, someone should have noticed this. Taking out numerous deductions is a red flag for identity theft, because they get to keep almost all of their paycheck and nobody will ever come after them.” YMMV, perhaps. And perhaps I am overly conservative or shortsighted or ignorant, but I don’t understand why undocumented immigrants ought to be given government-funded benefits. “Because they want them” and “Because it’s HARD to emigrate to the US” are not, in my mind, compelling reasons. Their kids are US citizens, and that’s different. And while I think everyone in the world deserves the chance to have food, clothing, shelter, and reasonable medical care, I don’t think that individuals who crossed over illegally and are living in this country, working without permits, and generally falling into the category of “illegal alien” should receive the same benefits as citizens. I also don’t think that countries that rail against us for being evil or who threaten us and or allies with violence should expect money and food and resources and trade. If I invite someone to dinner and they complain about my food, call me a bitch, and throw beer bottles at my next door neighbor, they won’t be invited back. Guess my heart stopped bleeding. ☹ :smack: ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [May 4, 2006, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/24 "2006-05-04T20:02:08Z")
So if a pedestrian gets hit by a car in a hit-and-run accident, we have to check her citizenship papers before deciding whether to call for the ambulance or to leave her dying in the streets? ---
**Author:** ![Oy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bc8723/32.png) [@Oy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oy)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2006, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/25 "2006-05-05T01:11:52Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > So if a pedestrian gets hit by a car in a hit-and-run accident, we have to check her citizenship papers before deciding whether to call for the ambulance or to leave her dying in the streets? It’s called “compassionate conservatism.” ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f07891/32.png) [@Little\_Plastic\_Ninja](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Plastic_Ninja)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2006, 2:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/26 "2006-05-05T14:10:42Z")
There aren’t enough :rolleyes: in the world to fill THAT strawman, because you know as well as I do that it’s legally required for anyone in danger of dying to receive medical treatment. But if a person is in the US working illegally, they have very likely committed at least one crime – identity theft. As a victim of it, I know very well just the sort of havoc it can wreak on a person’s life. It took me YEARS just to get my income taxes back on track, and I’m still finding credit cards and unpaid phone bills in my name in cities and states I never lived in. So yes, a person who gets run over in the street and needs medical attention should get it, regardless of their citizenship. (Granted, I also believe in socialized medicine, which makes me the odd sort of conservative. What’s it called? Moderate? Liberal?) But I remember the furor over undocumented immigrants being unable to receive driver’s licenses. Inalienable human rights include life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, but not necessarily a car. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2006, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/27 "2006-05-05T15:53:48Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > There is a difference between “strong” language and ethnic slurs. Partricularly in **Great Debates** , refrain from using the latter which do nothing to promote discussion and everything to inflame passions. > > [/Moderating] I assume that this is not a “warning”? Just “moderating”, right? ---
**Author:** ![Antinor01](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ecae2f/32.png) [@Antinor01](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Antinor01)\ **Post date:** [May 5, 2006, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/28 "2006-05-05T16:02:23Z")
> [@Little Plastic Ninja](#): > > There aren’t enough :rolleyes: in the world to fill THAT strawman, because you know as well as I do that it’s legally required for anyone in danger of dying to receive medical treatment. > > But if a person is in the US working illegally, they have very likely committed at least one crime – identity theft. As a victim of it, I know very well just the sort of havoc it can wreak on a person’s life. It took me YEARS just to get my income taxes back on track, and I’m still finding credit cards and unpaid phone bills in my name in cities and states I never lived in. > > So yes, a person who gets run over in the street and needs medical attention should get it, regardless of their citizenship. (Granted, I also believe in socialized medicine, which makes me the odd sort of conservative. What’s it called? Moderate? Liberal?) But I remember the furor over undocumented immigrants being unable to receive driver’s licenses. Inalienable human rights include life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness, but not necessarily a car. Yes, give them medical treatment. Then check their status and if they are here illegally, deport them. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2006, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/29 "2006-05-08T15:16:03Z")
> [@astro](#): > > On the downside you’d essentially be removing a layer of low cost, relatively efficient labor that the economy in many sectors has grown to heavily depend on, on the positive you’d be removing whatever tax drain it costs to provide social services to the population of illegal workers and their families, and (I’m assuming) reduce whatever portion of crime they are responsible for. Would the economy get better or worse if they all left? Would things cost more or less overall? Who would do the backbreaking scutwork and menial jobs they do… at any price? IMNSHO, we would be better off. The strain on our social services, such as medical care and schools, would be reduced and the crime rate would go down greatly. Win-Win situation, AFAICS. ---
**Author:** ![Alien](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/57b2e6/32.png) [@Alien](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alien)\ **Post date:** [May 8, 2006, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/30 "2006-05-08T20:38:15Z")
I don’t know what to think of this. But the entire Western world seems to be having the same discussion. Interestingly, WP has a [nice article](http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/12680173/) today: > [@](#): > > The bitter arguments of the past echo loudly these days as Congress debates toughening the nation’s immigration laws and immigrants from Latin America and Asia swell the streets of U.S. cities in protest. Most of the concerns voiced today – that too many immigrants seek economic advantage and fail to understand democracy, that they refuse to learn English, overcrowd homes and overwhelm public services – were heard a century ago. And there was a nub of truth to some complaints, not least that the vast influx of immigrants drove down working-class wages. > > Yet historians and demographers are clear about the bottom line: In the long run, New York City – and the United States – owes much of its economic resilience to replenishing waves of immigrants. The descendants of those Italians, Jews, Irish and Germans have assimilated. Manhattan’s Little Italy is vestigial – no more than a shrinking collection of restaurants. > > Now another wave washes over. Fully 38 percent of New York’s 8 million residents are foreign-born, nearly the same percentage as a century ago. > > “It would be easy to say the short-run costs of immigration outweighed the benefits,” said Joe Salvo, a director at New York’s city planning department. “But the benefits are longer term. We wouldn’t be the superpower we are if we hadn’t let them in.” One question though: If immigrants benefit the economy, why isn’t some of the money routed back into social services under strain? Alternatively, if they left, wouldn’t there be less money to pay for social services? It seems to me that this is a zero-sum game. ---
**Author:** ![rwong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e9bcb4/32.png) [@rwong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rwong)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2006, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/31 "2006-05-18T21:25:31Z")
[QUOTE=DrDeth] I have met and worked with many illegals. They- in general- have my sincere admiration. They come here to WORK, and work they do- hard, at jobs Americans generally don’t want (although that’s changing). [/QUOTE] Nobody doubts their sincerity to want to a better life, and contribute to our society. The argument is - **They cheated and cut in front of everyone else waiting in line legally and living on stolen SSN to apply for welfare.** That alone have lost my admiration. Being a hardworker doesn’t make it okay to cut in line of other hardworkers. Then they start breeding children that are legal citizens by birth that we can’t kick out. All the illegal aliens that protested in L.A. Monday cut my drive time in half. and I was able to work, shop, and play with less stress. They should protest over there everyday and still be able to collect welfare. At least Cal-Trans won’t need to request a bigger budget to expand our roads that way. Survival of the fittest should only apply to animal, not people. Wait in line like everyone else! I attribute alot of this to business moguls who aren’t willing to pay legal imigrants $6.75/hour I believe most Americans are willing to do almost any jobs out there. The people in china are paid as low as 20 cents an hour to make toys for Mattel. Although, I think Santa does it for free, compete with that Mattel. My garbageman gets paid over $20.00 an hour to dump basura! **American’s not willing to do certain jobs are lies.** I would become a bus boy if they offered me $20.00 an hour. I’m willing to cut sugar canes in florida if they were willing to pay more than $3.00 an hour with benefits. Let’s not distort the issue with who’s hardworking and who’s lazy. The **Illegal** Immigrants \*\*CHEATED and are STEALING \*\* welfare from legitimate people ---
**Author:** ![rwong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e9bcb4/32.png) [@rwong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rwong)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2006, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/32 "2006-05-18T21:35:00Z")
Stop skirting the problem about ILLEGAL immigration with those who did it the right way! This isn’t about immigrants. This is about **ILLEGAL** immigrants!!! If you understand english, look up the definition of **ILLEGAL**!! ---
**Author:** ![rwong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e9bcb4/32.png) [@rwong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rwong)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2006, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/33 "2006-05-18T22:08:36Z")
[QUOTE=jake1964] Does anyone have any information on the amount of money that illegal immigrants actually pay in to the system, i.e. income tax and social security, by using counterfeit social security cards. Most of them that do this don’t get anything back in the way of refunds or social security benefits. Do they? [/QUOTE] Whoever loaned the number out will get the refund, if it doesn’t take them over their tax bracket. Most of the cards are actually used to collect welfare. If your paid under the table, employers don’t require SSN or CA DL. Employers don’t pay into welfare that way and we who have legal SSN or CA DL do. plus we will pay EXTRA for: Food stamps, job training, public schooling, roadway maintenance and expansion, community hospitals, trauma centers, ambulance service, Medi-Cal, in-home supportive services, Fire, Police, Military, border patrols, prisons, life guards and rangers, parks, clean beaches, the list goes on and my hand is cramping..LOL ---
**Author:** ![Burrido](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/3be4f8/32.png) [@Burrido](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Burrido)\ **Post date:** [May 18, 2006, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/34 "2006-05-18T22:19:25Z")
Things would cost more overall. But then maybe it needs to be. Maybe they would have to actually pay a liveable wage. It would force Mexico (using them as an example because they are the most outspoken and visible) to actually solve their problems rather than running away from it. Look at India, they are solving their problems and growing. Mexico has given up, “Ah fuck it, let’s go north”. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2006, 3:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/35 "2006-05-19T03:32:16Z")
[QUOTE=Clothahump] IMNSHO, we would be better off. The strain on our social services, such as medical care and schools, would be reduced and the crime rate would go down greatly. [/QUOTE] Cite? For the assumption that immigrants, legal or illegal, are any more prone to crime than native-born citizens. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2006, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/36 "2006-05-19T03:33:56Z")
[QUOTE=rwong] The **Illegal** Immigrants \*\*CHEATED and are STEALING \*\* welfare from legitimate people [/QUOTE] :dubious: And who exactly are **il** legitimate people? Because that phrase does **not** apply to illegal immigrants! ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2006, 4:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/37 "2006-05-19T04:21:27Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] Cite? For the assumption that immigrants, legal or illegal, are any more prone to crime than native-born citizens. [/QUOTE] Well, the Illegals _do_ start their life here by commiting a crime. But after that, they are no more prone to crime than any other poor minority, AFAIK. ---
**Author:** ![rwong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e9bcb4/32.png) [@rwong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rwong)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2006, 8:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/38 "2006-05-19T08:32:37Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] :dubious: And who exactly are **il** legitimate people? Because that phrase does **not** apply to illegal immigrants! [/QUOTE] Call me ignorant, but I guess the one following the rules or already citizens following the rules. Don’t get me wrong, we still have citizens ripping off the govt by pretending they can’t find jobs or they have 10 babies and can’t look for work, but we don’t need the additional burden. ---
**Author:** ![rwong](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e9bcb4/32.png) [@rwong](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rwong)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2006, 8:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/39 "2006-05-19T08:36:04Z")
[QUOTE=rwong] Call me ignorant, but I guess the ones not following the rules. Don’t get me wrong, we still have citizens ripping off the govt by pretending they can’t find jobs or they have 10 babies and can’t look for work, but we don’t need the additional burden. [/QUOTE] Correction ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2006, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800/40 "2006-05-19T19:59:24Z")
[QUOTE=rwong] All the illegal aliens that protested in L.A. Monday cut my drive time in half. [/quote] I’m curious – do you mean that everyone who protested was an illegal alien? Or that you’re only pissed off at the ones who were? And how _did_ you identify the illegals out of all the legal residents and citizens who were protesting out of solidarity? [QUOTE=rwong] I attribute alot of this to business moguls who aren’t willing to pay legal imigrants $6.75/hour [/quote] And yet you didn’t bother to target your ire at them. Interesting. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-all-the-illegal-workers-up-and-left-the-us-what-would-really-happen/354800.md?page=3)