# If an immigrant disrepects your flag. **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 31, 2010, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673 "2010-07-31T11:15:48Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2010, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/101 "2010-08-02T13:46:15Z")
I didn’t know [The Black Crowes](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:BlackCrowesAmoricaalbumcover.jpg) were from Elbonia. ---
**Author:** ![madmonk28](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/madmonk28/32/20811_2.png) [@madmonk28](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/madmonk28)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2010, 1:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/102 "2010-08-02T13:48:17Z")
> [@Xan](#): > > > [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > > > _What if_… the Elbonian in the OP took down the American flag, made a loin-cloth out of it, and began wearing it for bbq’s in the yard? > > Didn’t Larry Flint wear an American flag diaper to court once? But he’s not an immigrant. > > That’d be awesome! Someone should make flag loin cloths! Didn’t Larry Flint wear an American flag diaper to court once? But he’s not an immigrant. ---
**Author:** ![6ImpossibleThingsB4Breakfast](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/6/e19adc/32.png) [@6ImpossibleThingsB4Breakfast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/6ImpossibleThingsB4Breakfast)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2010, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/103 "2010-08-02T13:59:47Z")
Thank you al for yor suport and payshens with my engalish. I em prowd of my Elbonian flag and fly it ubuv the US 1 becorz it is a betta cuntree weth betta music and no baseball. Weth my hart sweling and I drink up weth my 2 oyes the fayses of naybers hoo will not liv wen my God is coming. Soon we well hav a bbq. kumbaya El Bonian ---
**Author:** ![Chessic\_Sense](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/7c8e57/32.png) [@Chessic\_Sense](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chessic_Sense)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2010, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/104 "2010-08-02T15:53:10Z")
I’d first try to figure out what message he’s trying to communicate. I’d tell the neighbor “Hey, you know that’s an offensive symbol, right?” and if he goes “We just beat you in the World Cup. Our football team rulez, you da suxxors!” then I’d laugh and just let it go. If he said “Oh, I’m trying to honor both countries” then I’d tell him the correct way to do that. If he says “I’m trying to say that Elbonia is better than the evil USA,” then we’re going to start some hedge wars. > [@Steophan](#): > > What’s with the whole American “respect the flag” thing anyway? I’ve never been able to understand that. > [@Leaffan](#): > > It’s a fucking flag. A piece of cloth. Get over it all ready. It’s not just a piece of cloth, though. It’s a symbol. A communication tool. Right now, I’m communicating my thoughts to you via the use of 26 symbols, in various combinations. It’s not really a “respect the flag” culture as much as it is a “respect our country and the symbol of our country” culture. It’s basic etiquette not to put up offensive symbols, accidentally or otherwise. It’d be like flipping you off and going “Whaaat? It’s just a body part in a certain configuration. Get over it already.” or putting my ankle on my knee in a muslim country and going “Whaaaat? It’s just the bottom of a piece of apparel. Get over it already.” That would make you a social boor. > [@Nava](#): > > OTOH, apparently quite a few Chinese euro-store owners have been surprised that underwear with the Spanish flag isn’t popular here. Would I be offended if a foreigner bought those? No. I’d be surprised if a Spaniard did, but whatever. We only wear the flag to show support for the Spanish national team in sports, and then it tends to be caps or scarves, or the jersey of said team. Cups with the flag are for the tourist trade, whereas in the US and UK I’ve seen locals using them. It’s probably due to the design of the Spanish flag. The Chinese underwear would have a star on the right hip. The Spanish flag would have the crown/coat of arms right over the…:o ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2010, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/105 "2010-08-02T23:52:48Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > _What if_… the Elbonian in the OP took down the American flag, made a loin-cloth out of it, and began wearing it for bbq’s in the yard? Oh, I’d be OK with _that._ It’s not clearly part of a unified message then, it’s more like flying the Elbonian flag alone. Seriously, in case it wasn’t clear, flying the Elbonian flag alone is less “insulting” to my mind than flying the Stars & Stripes under it. Not insulting to me, so much, just possibly insulting to the delicate sensibilities of vexophiles (is that a word?). I am at this point sick of red-white-blue heraldic colors in general. And I’ve seen American flags plastered anywhere someone thought it was appealing. Like as napkins. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2010, 11:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/106 "2010-08-02T23:56:40Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > Nah; there’s a tiny dragon right in the middle of the Cross of St. George. You just can’t see it. You know, because it’s also red. You win the thread. I think. ---
**Author:** ![SanVito](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sanvito/32/2805_2.png) [@SanVito](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SanVito)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2010, 8:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/107 "2010-08-03T08:59:40Z")
> [@toofs](#): > > For a lot of us Yanks, the symbology of the flag is a big deal since a flag is a visual identifier of nation (duh) and culture. By putting your old country’s flag above the flag of the country you moved to you are sending a message that you identify more with the nation you chose to leave. Kind of like a rank thing, where the higher flag among two flown is the higher in status. Some of us see that as insulting. Not a big deal, I won’t get spun up about it, but the tiny little insult is there. Pardon me if I’m misinterpreting your post, but it sounds a bit ‘you’re an immigrant, be grateful you’re here’, because I can’t imagine there’s many Americans (or Brits) who would move to a foreign country and **NOT** ‘_identify more with the nation you chose to leave_’. They are immigrants, we are expats. There seems to be this idea coming across in some posts that if you move to the States, you must want to be American, but there’s a gazillion reasons why people move countries and it doesn’t mean they want to reject their home nation. And why _should_ they? Americans don’t hold a monopoly on patriotism, and there’s a hell of a lot of patriotic Americans not living in the USA. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2010, 9:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/108 "2010-08-03T09:07:44Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > > [@Nava](#): > > > > OTOH, apparently quite a few Chinese euro-store owners have been surprised that underwear with the Spanish flag isn’t popular here. Would I be offended if a foreigner bought those? No. I’d be surprised if a Spaniard did, but whatever. We only wear the flag to show support for the Spanish national team in sports, and then it tends to be caps or scarves, or the jersey of said team. Cups with the flag are for the tourist trade, whereas in the US and UK I’ve seen locals using them. > > It’s probably due to the design of the Spanish flag. The Chinese underwear would have a star on the right hip. The Spanish flag would have the crown/coat of arms right over the…:o Slightly to the side, actually. And if that was the problem, why don’t we do it with, oh, sports teams colors or local flags? I’ve never seen underwear in those, either, and have seen someone get teased because a pack of five boxer shorts in several colors happened to include a red one (“dude, that’s a bit above and beyond for red’n’whites, innit?” “eh? 😕 :eek: smack me and call me a melon…”) ---
**Author:** ![Isosleepy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/isosleepy/32/479_2.png) [@Isosleepy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Isosleepy)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2010, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/109 "2010-08-03T21:41:13Z")
It’s a respect thing. When you are an immigrant, basic polite behaviour dictates you don’t go pissing off the locals, even if you regard the mores you violate as silly. And I believe you should go to some extremes - were I to move to Ireland, I’d probably refrain from wearing my (orange) Dutch national team jersey as daily wear, even though the locals might well not give a shit. As a resident in the US, I have flown the Dutch flag, by itself, and believe that was perfectly fine - but I wouldn’t dream of flying it over the stars and stripes. ---
**Author:** ![Maiira](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f04885/32.png) [@Maiira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Maiira)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2010, 4:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/110 "2010-08-05T04:16:54Z")
Add me to the “would neither notice nor care” crowd because I don’t know much flag etiquette. Now, if he were burning the stars and stripes on my lawn, well, then we’d have a problem. But other than that…your house, your flag, whatev. ---
**Author:** ![gardentraveler](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gardentraveler/32/3576_2.png) [@gardentraveler](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gardentraveler)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2010, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/111 "2010-08-05T05:03:12Z")
American checking in. It wouldn’t register with me. As others have said: it’s just a piece of cloth. ---
**Author:** ![42fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/b487fb/32.png) [@42fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/42fish)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2010, 1:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/112 "2010-08-05T13:07:49Z")
> [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > _What if_… the Elbonian in the OP took down the American flag, made a loin-cloth out of it, and began wearing it for bbq’s in the yard? Is he wearing underwear or going commando? And if he’s wearing underwear, what flag is it made from? ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2010, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/113 "2010-08-05T13:12:47Z")
> [@42fish](#): > > > [@ivan\_astikov](#): > > > > _What if_… the Elbonian in the OP took down the American flag, made a loin-cloth out of it, and began wearing it for bbq’s in the yard? > > Is he wearing underwear or going commando? And if he’s wearing underwear, what flag is it made from? Nope, no underwear. It’s being worn right next to his sweaty knackers. ---
**Author:** ![amarinth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3be4f8/32.png) [@amarinth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amarinth)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2010, 1:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/114 "2010-08-05T13:31:37Z")
It would bother me in the same way and about as much as seeing a fork on the right side of a place setting bothers me. I wouldn’t call it disrespectful, not by a long shot. ---
**Author:** ![ivan\_astikov](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/58f4c7/32.png) [@ivan\_astikov](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ivan_astikov)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2010, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/115 "2010-08-05T13:36:24Z")
Now\* that’d\* drive Adrian Monk up the wall! ---
**Author:** ![Pedro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/919ad9/32.png) [@Pedro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pedro)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2010, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/116 "2010-08-05T13:54:50Z")
> [@madmonk28](#): > > Also, most improper flag flying is usually not intentional (not everyone has a vexologist in the family tree) […] I think you mean _vexillologist_. I had to google that by the way, as I had no idea there was such a thing as flag study, much less a name for it. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2010, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/117 "2010-08-05T15:32:48Z")
What he’s doing is a clear violation of the flag code. I’d likely call the cops on the non-emergency number to report it. If it’s a slow day, they may send an officer over to explain the flag code to the guy. As far as I know, there are no penalties for the violation. ---
**Author:** ![Jack\_Batty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jack_batty/32/3201_2.png) [@Jack\_Batty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jack_Batty)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2010, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/118 "2010-08-05T15:46:06Z")
If the cops showed up for any other reason than to cite you for wasting their time, I’d want some of my tax money back. ---
**Author:** ![Oakminster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/77aa72/32.png) [@Oakminster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oakminster)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2010, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/119 "2010-08-05T16:02:27Z")
> [@Jack\_Batty](#): > > If the cops showed up for any other reason than to cite you for wasting their time, I’d want some of my tax money back. You’d be sadly disappointed. And your tax dollars would be well spent. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [August 5, 2010, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673/120 "2010-08-05T16:09:23Z")
It would not bother me in the least [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-an-immigrant-disrepects-your-flag/548673.md?page=7)