# If Apple has sued Apple, why hasn't RCA sued Sirius? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [April 4, 2006, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266 "2006-04-04T15:32:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/1 "2006-04-04T15:32:21Z")
Many of us are familiar with the long-lived legal wranglings between [Apple Records and the Apple Computer company](http://www.legalzoom.com/articles/article_content/article11325.html). With this in mind, I am surprised that the R.C.A. folks has not sued Sirius Radio for a similar kind of infringement. R.C.A. of course is the Radio Corporation of America- surely a company dedicated to delivering radio broadcasts. Sirius Radio is a satellite-based radio delivery service. Why do I even ask this? Because Sirius uses a dog as a company icon, and so does R.C.A. It’s interesting to me that such a parallel situation exists and yet we’ve never heard boo from R.C.A. about a trademark infringement on the use of a dog image by a deliverer of radio broadcasts. Why? In the case of Apple v.s. Apple, it’s about content delivery and exclusive rights therein using the name Apple, but both of these radio companies are using identical ( well, nearly identical but surely the same IDEA ) icons. Cartooniverse ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/2 "2006-04-04T16:09:47Z")
First, Apple Computer had a contract with Apple Records saying they wouldn’t get into the music business: that’s the basis for the suit. RCA has no such contract with Sirius. Second, there is no RCA anymore; it was bought up by General Electric years ago. Third, the RCA trademark isn’t a dog: it’s Nipper the Dog. Sirius uses a dog, but that’s obviously a reference to the dog star. Also the dog is not shown listening to a gramophone, as the RCA logo does. RCA can’t stop people from using dogs as their logo; they can only sue if the logo can be confused with theirs. Fourth, RCA never did radio broadcasts; they sold radios and records. It was their subsidiary, NBC, that did the broadcasting. The Nipper logo was never used for broadcasting: it was used for radios and recordings. Since the Sirius and RCA logos were for different products, much like Apple Computers and Apple Records were different products. There’s not much of a case for infringement. ---
**Author:** ![pizzabrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e9c0ed/32.png) [@pizzabrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pizzabrat)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 4:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/3 "2006-04-04T16:14:46Z")
Sirius dog is the dog of the constellatin “Sirius”, and is drawn that way; RCA’s dog is a photographed pet beagle who mistakes the sound coming from a victrola for being his master, and has recently been joined by a puppy. RCA and Sirius are spelled and pronounced differently, while “Apple” and “Apple” aren’t. There’s no concievable chance that the two trademarks can be confused. ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 5:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/4 "2006-04-04T17:37:09Z")
Well, the original Apple trademark suit decision was (IMHO) pretty much a travesty. After all, there was really no way to confuse a Granny Smith apple with a rainbow colored apple with a bite out of it. And Apple Computers was clearly different from Apple Corp. Records. ---
**Author:** ![h.sapiens](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e0b2c6/32.png) [@h.sapiens](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/h.sapiens)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 6:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/5 "2006-04-04T18:01:49Z")
> [@pizzabrat](#): > > Sirius dog is the dog of the constellatin “Sirius”, and is drawn that way; RCA’s dog is a photographed pet beagle who mistakes the sound coming from a victrola for being his master, and has recently been joined by a puppy. RCA and Sirius are spelled and pronounced differently, while “Apple” and “Apple” aren’t. There’s no concievable chance that the two trademarks can be confused. \Actually, Sirius is the name of a star in the constellation Canis Major. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 6:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/6 "2006-04-04T18:04:19Z")
Once again: Apple Computer _signed a contract_ saying they’d refrain from entering the music business; that’s the basis for the suit. Second, the logos are _not_ the issue. It was the use of the word “Apple” in both company names. Apple Records had no issue with Apple making computers at all and agreed with your point about them being different at the time. But that’s not relevant. Apple computer is being sued because they _are_ going into the music business, despite promising (via an enforceable contracts) they would not. Apple Computer signed an agreement. They are supposed to abide by it. Or can anyone just tear up a contract because situations change? ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/7 "2006-04-04T18:48:55Z")
Oh no, **RealityChuck**. I agree, one can NOT just tear up a contract, and I’m a big fan of Apple computer products. I was referring more to trademarked imagery than the music infringement issues. A dog is a dog is a dog. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Finagle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b19c9b/32.png) [@Finagle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Finagle)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/8 "2006-04-04T19:03:43Z")
> [@RealityChuck](#): > > Once again: Apple Computer _signed a contract_ saying they’d refrain from entering the music business; that’s the basis for the suit. I was referring to the original decision, way back whenever. That was a travesty. The current case hinges on whether distributing music falls into the allowed activities of their contract or not. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/9 "2006-04-04T19:11:24Z")
> [@pizzabrat](#): > > RCA’s dog is a photographed pet beagle who mistakes the sound coming from a victrola for being his master… [nitpick] The model for the original painting of [Nipper, the RCA dog, was a mixed breed](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nipper): > [@](#): > > Nipper was born in 1884 in Bristol, England, and died in September 1895. He was a mixed-breed dog, part Bull Terrier with a trace of Fox Terrier. It has also been claimed in various sources that he was a Fox Terrier, a Rat Terrier, or an American Pit Bull Terrier (unlikely, since he was not an American dog). He was named Nipper because he tried to bite visitors in the leg. No beagle. Carry on. [/nitpick] ---
**Author:** ![pizzabrat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e9c0ed/32.png) [@pizzabrat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pizzabrat)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/10 "2006-04-04T19:45:20Z")
That’s what I get for trying to act like I knew something about dogs. Or constellations. ---
**Author:** ![Menocchio](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de053/32.png) [@Menocchio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Menocchio)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/11 "2006-04-04T19:50:23Z")
> [@Finagle](#): > > I was referring to the original decision, way back whenever. That was a travesty. > > The current case hinges on whether distributing music falls into the allowed activities of their contract or not. There was no decision. They settled out of court, because Apple Records agreed that despite the blatant and openly admitted trademark violation, nobody would confuse a computer company for a music label. So Apple Computer signed a contract that they’d never go into the music buisness, so that the two Apples could never be in conflict. They went into the music buisness, and broke the contract. At the very least, Apple Computer owes Apple Music whatever they would have gotten had they gone to court, plus interest. ---
**Author:** ![N9IWP](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/n9iwp/32/3154_2.png) [@N9IWP](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/N9IWP)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 8:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/12 "2006-04-04T20:27:37Z")
The 1991 agreement said that Apple computer couldn’t distribute music media, but specifically allowed data transfer. The question is whether .aac files are music media or data transfer. > **[A tale of two Apples... and three lawsuits](https://arstechnica.com/uncategorized/2006/03/6467-2/)** > > Apple Corps' lawsuit against Apple Computer goes to the UK High Court this … I’ve read in multiple places the logo IS part of the issue > **[British Court Hears Apple v. Apple and 'Le Freak' (Published 2006)](https://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/30/technology/british-court-hears-apple-v-apple-and-le-freak.html)** > > The High Court of Britain, accustomed to the sounds of bewigged barristers parsing the fine points of the law, was treated Wednesday to a funky playback of the disco anthem ''Le Freak'' as a lawyer for the Beatles' record company argued that Apple... “In the suit, Apple Corps is seeking an injunction requiring Apple Computer to remove the bitten-apple logo from iTunes.” > **[Apple Defends Its Use of Logo on iTunes Store (Published 2006)](https://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/31/technology/apple-defends-its-use-of-logo-on-itunes-store.html)** > > Apple Computer lawyer Anthony Grabiner, in High Court of Britain, rejects Apple Corps record label claim that iTunes Music Store violated 1991 agreement that ended more than decade of legal wrangling over logos; contends distribution of digital... “Mr. Vos argued on Wednesday that although services like iTunes were permissible, Apple Computer should stay out of the music business if it uses the logo, a cartoonish apple with a neat bite out of its side. Apple Corps’ logo is a green Granny Smith apple.” Brian ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [April 4, 2006, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/13 "2006-04-04T23:18:55Z")
Well, hey, if two companies using dogs in their logos is an issue, how about all of the companies which have people in their logos? Any two people will look a lot more alike than two dogs of different breeds, or the Sirius and RCA dogs. Incidentally, I’m not sure how one can get that the Sirius logo is modelled on the constellation of Canis Major, since the CMa dog is facing right and jumping, while the Sirius dog is facing left and sitting. ---
**Author:** ![Salquod](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/df705f/32.png) [@Salquod](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Salquod)\ **Post date:** [February 3, 2026, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/14 "2026-02-03T03:20:20Z")
RCA has been defunct since 1987, it was absorbed by General Electric which broke it up and sold off the various divisions. Talisman Brands currently licenses the RCA and Nipper/His Master’s Voice trademarks. Any new products you see today with the RCA logo were manufactured by several other companies that licenses the RCA name, including RCA Records which today is owned by Sony Music Entertainment. ---
**Author:** ![Deanna81](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a9adbd/32.png) [@Deanna81](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Deanna81)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2026, 9:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/15 "2026-02-07T09:13:06Z")
To begin with, RCA was purchased by GE in 1986 and no longer exists as a corporation. The RCA logos and the Nipper the dog trademark are owned by Talisman Brands which licenses them to different companies including Voxx International and Curtis International for several RCA branded products. Naxa Electronics licenses the Nipper image for Victor audio products. Sony Music Entertainment which has owned RCA Records since 2008, has a perpetual license to use the RCA and Nipper trademarks indefinitely. ---
**Author:** ![griffin1977](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@griffin1977](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/griffin1977)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2026, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/16 "2026-02-07T20:21:39Z")
> [@Cartooniverse](#): > > nearly identical but surely the same IDEA I would not call them nearly identical… [https://cdn.worldvectorlogo.com/logos/rca-2.svg](https://cdn.worldvectorlogo.com/logos/rca-2.svg) And this [https://variety.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/SiriusXM\_Refresh\_Stella-B\_W.gif?w=1024](https://variety.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/SiriusXM_Refresh_Stella-B_W.gif?w=1024) Are not identical The apple vs apple case was about the term “apple”, which is something that can be protected by trademark laws. AFAIK back in the day when Apple Music was a massive record company and Apple Computers were some nerds in a California basement, Apple Records agreed to let them use the name in the understanding that their businesses would never overlap. Many years later in the days of ipods and iTunes there businesses absolutely did overlap, hence the lawsuit. ---
**Author:** ![markn\_1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@markn\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/markn_1)\ **Post date:** [February 7, 2026, 10:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/17 "2026-02-07T22:53:44Z")
Apparently in some cases it’s not necessary for a logo to look at all similar to another for a jury to find that one infringes on the other. > **[One Is a Beaver, the Other Is an Alligator](https://www.loweringthebar.net/2018/05/one-is-a-beaver-the-other-is-an-alligator.html)** > > And consumers would likely confuse the two, a Texas jury somehow found. ---
**Author:** ![Cartooniverse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cartooniverse/32/3084_2.png) [@Cartooniverse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cartooniverse)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2026, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/18 "2026-05-02T15:24:45Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > > [@Cartooniverse](#): > > > > nearly identical but surely the same IDEA > > I would not call them nearly identical… > > [https://cdn.worldvectorlogo.com/logos/rca-2.svg](https://cdn.worldvectorlogo.com/logos/rca-2.svg) > > And this > > [https://variety.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/SiriusXM\_Refresh\_Stella-B\_W.gif?w=1024](https://variety.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/11/SiriusXM_Refresh_Stella-B_W.gif?w=1024) > > Are not identical > > The apple vs apple case was about the term “apple”, which is something that can be protected by trademark laws. AFAIK back in the day when Apple Music was a massive record company and Apple Computers were some nerds in a California basement, Apple Records agreed to let them use the name in the understanding that their businesses would never overlap. Many years later in the days of ipods and iTunes there businesses absolutely did overlap, hence the lawsuit. That’s fair ~! ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2026, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/19 "2026-05-02T15:43:31Z")
> [@markn\_1](#): > > Apparently in some cases it’s not necessary for a logo to look at all similar to another for a jury to find that one infringes on the other. Buc-ee’s Ltd is a large corporation that was filing a lawsuit against a very small business. (Choke Canyon Travel Center is a one-location business.) A small business is probably going to cave in to pressure. SiriusXM Holdings Inc is a large corporation. If General Electric or Sony Music Entertainment tried to sue Sirius, they would expect to fight an actual court case. (I mentioned Sony because when GE bought RCA, they apparently sold the trademark rights to Sony and a French corporation Vantiva SA.) ---
**Author:** ![Reply](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/reply/32/15952_2.png) [@Reply](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Reply)\ **Post date:** [May 2, 2026, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266/20 "2026-05-02T16:03:35Z")
Have you been keenly watching these developments for the last 20 years..? [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-apple-has-sued-apple-why-hasnt-rca-sued-sirius/351266.md?page=2)