# If Babies Babble On Planes, The Terrorists Have Won. Newslink **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [July 12, 2007, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555 "2007-07-12T21:59:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2007, 9:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/1 "2007-07-12T21:59:08Z")
Mother & infant are booted off airplane, in strange city, with no diapers or luggage, because the baby talked too much. Not cried. Not _talked too loud_. Talked\* too much\*. [http://www.wsbtv.com/news/13664685/detail.html](http://www.wsbtv.com/news/13664685/detail.html) > [@](#): > > “As we started taxiing, he started saying ‘Bye, bye plane,’ said Penland. “At the end of her speech, she leaned over the gentleman beside me and said, ‘It’s not funny anymore. You need to shut your baby up.’ > > * * * > > “She then said, ‘You know, it’s called baby Benadryl. And I said, ‘Well, I’m not going to drug my child so you have a pleasant flight.’ > > Penland said when the other passengers began speaking up on her behalf, the flight attendant got angrier and soon announced they were turning around and that Penland and Garren were going to be taken off the plane. > > * * * > > “I was crying, I was upset and I was thinking, ‘What am I going to do? I don’t have anything with me, I don’t have anymore diapers for the baby, no juice, no milk,” said Penland. > > The young mother said she later learned the flight attendant told the pilot that she had threatened her. Penland said that never happened. > > * * * > > A fellow passenger told Channel 2’s Rachel Kim none of the other passengers had problems with Garren and that Penland never threatened the flight attendant. This is insane. Comments? ---
**Author:** ![Sattua](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sattua/32/11906_2.png) [@Sattua](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sattua)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2007, 10:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/2 "2007-07-12T22:06:10Z")
My first thoughts, as always in these cases, is that there must be a lot about what happened that we aren’t being told. Why was her fellow passenger so jumpy, why was the stewardess so jumpy, and what did she really do the stewardess that made her mad enough to tell the pilot to turn around? ---
**Author:** ![pendgwen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3da27b/32.png) [@pendgwen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pendgwen)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2007, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/3 "2007-07-12T22:09:06Z")
If it all went down the way the mother says it did that flight attendant should be fired. ---
**Author:** ![Kalhoun](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3bc359/32.png) [@Kalhoun](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kalhoun)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2007, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/4 "2007-07-12T22:23:51Z")
If she told the pilot she’d been threatened, there’d have been a bigger stink than simply putting her off the plane. She’d be in jail. ---
**Author:** ![Anne\_Neville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Anne\_Neville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anne_Neville)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2007, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/5 "2007-07-12T22:31:08Z")
[QUOTE=pendgwen] If it all went down the way the mother says it did that flight attendant should be fired. [/QUOTE] Yes, but the story as told by the mother doesn’t really make sense. A flight attendant can’t turn a plane around by herself- she needs to be able to convince the pilot to do so. And you’d think the pilot wouldn’t do that just on the word of one flight attendant- wouldn’t he ask other flight attendants or passengers to confirm her story? Turning a plane around or making an unscheduled stop isn’t a minor matter for an airline, after all- it can make passengers miss connecting flights, or mean that crew members or aircraft aren’t available for later flights. And kicking her off without her luggage _really_ doesn’t make sense. On every flight I’ve been on, they’ve waited as long as they needed to to make sure that, if someone isn’t on the plane, their luggage isn’t on the plane either. It’s an elementary security precaution that airlines have been taking since long before 9/11. ---
**Author:** ![Duke\_of\_Rat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Duke\_of\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duke_of_Rat)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2007, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/6 "2007-07-12T23:19:18Z")
Don’t see what giving annoying passengers the boot has to do with terrorists… And no way should they have kicked this woman and her kid off, that’s why they make duct tape. A little dab’ll do ya. ---
**Author:** ![ryobserver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/b2d939/32.png) [@ryobserver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ryobserver)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2007, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/7 "2007-07-12T23:25:55Z")
[QUOTE=Anne Neville] And kicking her off without her luggage _really_ doesn’t make sense. On every flight I’ve been on, they’ve waited as long as they needed to to make sure that, if someone isn’t on the plane, their luggage isn’t on the plane either. It’s an elementary security precaution that airlines have been taking since long before 9/11. [/QUOTE] I’m sure you’re right, but they could take her luggage off the plane without subsequently returning the luggage to her. Mislaying bags isn’t exactly rare. The linked article doesn’t actually mention luggage. The mother complains she had no baby gear with her. Granted Houston to Oklahoma sounds like a short flight, but is it short enough to risk bringing no diapers at all in her carry-on? Certainly they wouldn’t have hustled her off without her carry-on, whatever subsequently became of her checked bags, if any. More information is needed. The flight attendant sounds awfully tetchy, but we have only the mother’s version of events, and not all of her details add up. ---
**Author:** ![Runs\_With\_Scissors](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/278dde/32.png) [@Runs\_With\_Scissors](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Runs_With_Scissors)\ **Post date:** [July 12, 2007, 11:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/8 "2007-07-12T23:29:57Z")
Is threatening a flight attendant a federal offense? A felony? IANAL. If I were a pilot and a flight attendant told me a passenger made a threat, I’d have police waiting after I turned the plane around and dumped the passenger off. There is _obviously_ more to this story. It just doesn’t sound right. ---
**Author:** ![missbunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/76d3ee/32.png) [@missbunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/missbunny)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/9 "2007-07-13T01:53:06Z")
> [@](#): > > “I was crying, I was upset and I was thinking, ‘What am I going to do? I don’t have anything with me, I don’t have anymore diapers for the baby, no juice, no milk,” said Penland. I can see she was upset, I would be too, but I wonder why she didn’t have any diapers … and what’s with the drama over juice? They weren’t dropping her in the middle of the desert; she was at an airline terminal. With every beverage known to man readily available. Or perhaps she could just get in her car and drive home, or to a store? The kid couldn’t last with his juice box for 50 yards to the magazine concession? I guess she could have just been babbling and not really meant she was upset over having to wait 5 minutes to buy a juice, assuming her motormouth kid even wanted one. Edit: I found this quotation from the article very telling: “Penland thinks her 19-month-old son, Garren, has a bubbly personality.” Could this be a mother who thinks her little angel is adorable no matter what he does? “But why should I make him stop saying bye-bye to the plane, he’s just being his l’il ol’ bubbly self!” ---
**Author:** ![kittenblue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ba8739/32.png) [@kittenblue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kittenblue)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/10 "2007-07-13T02:05:20Z")
I believe they said there had already been an 11 hour delay…she was traveling from Atlanta to Oklahoma via Houston, and she had probably used up all the diapers she had carried with her during that 11 hour delay in Houston. And whatever juice she had had with her. Not all of us have lots of money with us when we travel. The last time I flew, I had $60 with me to last my entire trip…no money in the bank, no credit cards, no options. After 11 hours, she may have spent all her ready cash, and not have been able to afford the outrageous prices at airports. And she couldn’t just go to her car and drive home…she’s from Gwinett County, Georgia, right? They put her off in Houston…where she’d been stuck for 11 hours, using up all her diapers. And her luggage may have already gone on to Oklahoma on an earlier flight. ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 2:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/11 "2007-07-13T02:16:43Z")
[QUOTE=missbunny] Edit: I found this quotation from the article very telling: “Penland thinks her 19-month-old son, Garren, has a bubbly personality.” Could this be a mother who thinks her little angel is adorable no matter what he does? “But why should I make him stop saying bye-bye to the plane, he’s just being his l’il ol’ bubbly self!” [/QUOTE] I’m afraid my standards of annoyance from toddlers are very different from yours. Given we’re talking about a woman who’s just had to deal with a toddler for **11 hours** in an airport terminal - if all the kid is doing is saying ‘bye bye plane,’ I’d have counted myself lucky. Note, too, that there’s no claim that the child is screaming this, just saying it. That’s telling, too. After all the frustrations already involved with the trip - I’d be leery of trying to do more than asking the child to quiet down. Compared to screaming, crying tantrum throwing toddlers, having to hear the child saying good bye to the planes on the ground just doesn’t rate more than a “meh.” And, too, I strongly suspect that once the child couldn’t see the other planes, it would have had no more reason to say goodbye to them. i.e. the problem would have self-corrected once the plane was in the air. ---
**Author:** ![missbunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/76d3ee/32.png) [@missbunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/missbunny)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/12 "2007-07-13T02:21:00Z")
I think she probably was just upset and babbling. You’re right; she might have used up all her diapers. Even if a juice was double or triple what it would be in a grocery store, we’re talking $4.00 i_n an emergency_. It’s not like juice costs $40 in the airport. Even if one would never normally spend that much, you’d do it in a serious situation, which I guess a kid’s not having juice for a little while might be. It’s true though that she may not have had once single cent nor any credit cards on her and that’s what made her upset, but it’s a rather puzzling way to travel, your experience aside. ---
**Author:** ![Askance](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/askance/32/8281_2.png) [@Askance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Askance)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/13 "2007-07-13T03:12:18Z")
[QUOTE=Anne Neville] Yes, but the story as told by the mother doesn’t really make sense. A flight attendant can’t turn a plane around by herself- she needs to be able to convince the pilot to do so. And you’d think the pilot wouldn’t do that just on the word of one flight attendant- wouldn’t he ask other flight attendants or passengers to confirm her story? [/QUOTE] No. I would fully expect the pilot to take the unsubstantiated word of any of his crew, as they are trained to do like any other team trained to handle emergencies together. I think the attendant (wrongly, it seems) took the upset passenger’s side and encountering opposition from the mother the attendant escalated rather than backing down. ---
**Author:** ![Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/e480ec/32.png) [@Least\_Original\_User\_Name\_Ever](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Least_Original_User_Name_Ever)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/14 "2007-07-13T03:23:25Z")
I’ll add to the chorus: there’s something we don’t know about going on here. It sounds like the attendant “erred” on the side of caution. Possibly following company protocol in that matter, as well. ---
**Author:** ![kittenblue](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ba8739/32.png) [@kittenblue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kittenblue)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 3:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/15 "2007-07-13T03:34:56Z")
[QUOTE=Askance] I think the attendant (wrongly, it seems) took the upset passenger’s side and encountering opposition from the mother the attendant escalated rather than backing down. [/QUOTE] I think you misread it…there were no “upset passengers”. Only the flight attendant had a problem with the child, who apparently was talking while she made her speech about oxygen masks and seat belts while they were taxiing. The other passengers sort of ganged up on the flight attendant by supporting the mom, and that’s when she went to the pilot. ---
**Author:** ![Rilchiam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/2bfe46/32.png) [@Rilchiam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rilchiam)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 12:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/16 "2007-07-13T12:00:46Z")
[QUOTE=missbunny] I found this quotation from the article very telling: “Penland thinks her 19-month-old son, Garren, has a bubbly personality.” Could this be a mother who thinks her little angel is adorable no matter what he does? “But why should I make him stop saying bye-bye to the plane, he’s just being his l’il ol’ bubbly self!” [/QUOTE] If you’re going to tell the kid to stop saying “bye-bye plane,” I hope you’re also going to tell the girl across the aisle to stop chewing her gum, and all the people with laptops to stop typing on them, and the old guy back there to stop breathing out with his nose making that whistling sound. I love how children are the only people who can be seen as annoying. And if the stew really said “ **It’s called** baby Benadryl,” then I think I know who the bitch is here. ---
**Author:** ![missbunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/76d3ee/32.png) [@missbunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/missbunny)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/17 "2007-07-13T16:57:17Z")
[QUOTE=Rilchiam] If you’re going to tell the kid to stop saying “bye-bye plane,” I hope you’re also going to tell the girl across the aisle to stop chewing her gum, and all the people with laptops to stop typing on them, and the old guy back there to stop breathing out with his nose making that whistling sound. I love how children are the only people who can be seen as annoying. [/QUOTE] I don’t really think she FA should have said anything. I would be _annoyed_ at “bye bye plane,” and I’d fervently wish to myself that the mother would shut that kid up, but I wouldn’t expect anyone to do anything about it unless it got into the 20 minutes nonstop territory. A kid running up and down the aisles or kicking seats, yes, make him stop. A kid singing the Barney song for more than 10 minutes straight, yes, make him stop. An adult singing out loud for more than _one_ minute, make him stop. A baby screaming/crying because he’s hungry or tired or whatever, well I wouldn’t like it but whatcha gonna do? A baby can’t be “made” to stop crying. You can try to soothe him but maybe it doesn’t work. Babies cry. It’s normal behavior. I’d also wish it would stop but I’d never tell a mother to “do it.” A toddler screaming/crying because he can’t have another candy bar, yes, he should be made to stop and if his mother is just ignoring him, she should be asked to please calm her child down. An adult chewing like a cow where it can be heard clearly 3 rows away should be asked politely if she can keep it down. Typing on a laptop doesn’t seem to be of the noise level that requires stopping; it’s generally much quieter than typing on a keyboard. Someone’s whistling nose cannot be helped. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 5:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/18 "2007-07-13T17:35:01Z")
[QUOTE=missbunny] I don’t really think she FA should have said anything. I would be _annoyed_ at “bye bye plane,” and I’d fervently wish to myself that the mother would shut that kid up, but I wouldn’t expect anyone to do anything about it unless it got into the 20 minutes nonstop territory. [/QUOTE] Would you ask an adult passenger to shut up after talking for 20 minutes? ---
**Author:** ![missbunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/76d3ee/32.png) [@missbunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/missbunny)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/19 "2007-07-13T17:59:34Z")
[QUOTE=RickJay] Would you ask an adult passenger to shut up after talking for 20 minutes? [/QUOTE] No, I would not ask anyone to “shut up.” But if an adult repeated the same phrase over and over for 20 minutes, or babbled incoherently like a 2-year-old might do, yes, I’d ask him politely if he could keep it down. If an adult were talking out loud to himself but it was a “conversation” - hmmm, that’s no worse than a cell phone convo, right? Weirder, but no more annoying. If he were not shouting in my ear, then I’d say nothing to him and just live with it. Re a babbler, I might also ask if he was okay. Because babbling is not the generally accepted behavior for adults on a plane. Wandering in the subway, yes. In that location, I’d say nothing. On a plane is different. ---
**Author:** ![Count\_Blucher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/c5a1d2/32.png) [@Count\_Blucher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Count_Blucher)\ **Post date:** [July 13, 2007, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555/20 "2007-07-13T18:13:50Z")
[QUOTE=Rilchiam] If you’re going to tell the kid to stop saying “bye-bye plane,” I hope you’re also going to tell the girl across the aisle to stop chewing her gum, and all the people with laptops to stop typing on them, and the old guy back there to stop breathing out with his nose making that whistling sound. I love how children are the only people who can be seen as annoying. [/QUOTE] Word. [QUOTE=Rilchiam] And if the stew really said “ **It’s called** baby Benadryl,” then I think I know who the bitch is here. [/QUOTE] Stop the fight; that’s the knock-out punch alright. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-babies-babble-on-planes-the-terrorists-have-won-newslink/411555.md?page=2)