# If God proved that God existed , then what? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 22, 2013, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659 "2013-03-22T17:57:58Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Learjeff](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/94ad74/32.png) [@Learjeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Learjeff)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/81 "2013-03-24T14:15:50Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > It’s not that God differs at all. Perceptions about the Deity vary and cause the splintering. Sometimes people are able to see a little past the difference in perceptions. You can say that all faiths worship the same God, but most people in most of those faiths vehemently disagree. In any case, the perception is what he was talking about. Each faith worships a God with a different nature or different attributes. Each division was strong enough for people to part ways, and not gently. Furthermore, the differences in many cases are substantial. The monotheism of the religions from Abraham is incompatible with the polytheism of Hunduism or the essential atheism of Buddhism. ---
**Author:** ![MuleSkinner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/779978/32.png) [@MuleSkinner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MuleSkinner)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 2:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/82 "2013-03-24T14:18:16Z")
> [@cosmosdan](#): > > If you don’t believe in God then you don’t believe anyone’s experience is real correct? Belief in God is already incredibly dominant in mankind. The vast majority of believers I’ve talked to about the subject believe yet don’t claimed to have experienced God. That’s why they admit to having faith or scriptural evidence that they don’t understand isn’t a reasonable amount of evidence. > [@](#): > > To be clear, I’m only supposing here. I am an agnostic who used to be a believer. Then you are an agnostic atheist and I don’t understand why you would ask the above question. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/83 "2013-03-24T16:16:06Z")
> [@Trinopus](#): > > There is an excellent (and very depressing) story exploring this idea; by Poul Anderson, it’s called “The Day The Sun Stood Still.” A young man asks God for a miracle…and, sure enough, the sun stands still for a day. > > At first, everyone believes. But, over time, people begin to doubt again. Ultimately, nothing is settled. Everyone interprets it the way they want to. > > I agree with those who say that the first thing to do is to ask a lot of questions. And, yes, we get to judge the answers. “Because I am the measure of good” is not an answer. “Because I wanted to forge you in the fires of adversity” is an answer, although a stinky one. > > Ultimately, I can’t see any way to be anything other than inimical to this God. If he doesn’t grant wishes, he’s good for nothing…and if he does grant wishes, he weakens us and makes us dependent. Do we really have the wisdom to ask only for those things that would make us better people? Alas, I fear not. > > One nice thing, though: it would mean the end of organized religion, as God would be accessible to everyone, and there would be no need for priests to intercede. I’ll have to look for that movie. I mentioned “The Voice You are About to Hear” earlier. Starring James Whitmore. In that one God spoke to everyone on the planet for a short period. I doubt a world wide miricle would mean the end of organized religion. ---
**Author:** ![rikules](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c5a1d2/32.png) [@rikules](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rikules)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/84 "2013-03-24T16:23:58Z")
“If God proved that God existed , then what?” "let’s say God as a matter of policy and practice did appear in a vision to THOSE WHO PRAYED “Here I am God sincerely wanting to know if you really exist” God appears and says , “here I am I really exist, I created everything, Try to treat each other and the planet you share with some respect and consideration. Love, would be great.” ahh… I see. In your scenario he PROVES? it to someone who already believes it and may be self deluded… but he does NOT bother to prove it to me? In that case I would continue to disbelieve. ## all PROOF must be presented to ME! else I refuse to consider it PROOF! “If God proved that God existed , then what?” Let’s assume this god PROVES IT to me! Now the question becomes “Which GOd” the god you present “here I am I really exist, I created everything, Try to treat each other and the planet you share with some respect and consideration. Love, would be great.” sounds much better than the god that ann coulter and rush limbaugh prefer. I would NEVER worship the god(devil) that right wing evangelicals worship. He is just too mean and rotten for me. But your god sounds like a decent guy! I do have some issues with him, though… I would like to ask him some questions… "If you are all powerful and can do anything then; “1. why did you foil all those assassination attempts on hitler?” “2. why did you allow the holocaust?” “3. why didn’t you stop 9/11?” “4. is big foot real?” “5. can’t you do something about mosquitoes and black flies?” “6. is helping athletes to win big games a form of cheating?” ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/85 "2013-03-24T16:39:56Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > It’s not that God differs at all. Perceptions about the Deity vary and cause the splintering. Sometimes people are able to see a little past the difference in perceptions. > > I’ve attended a lot of different churches (including Catholic and Protestant) and haven’t seen that much difference in their overall understandings of God. The greatest differences that I have seen are among the Protestant churches themselves. Some see God as an angry and vengeful God and others believe in a loving and sustaining God. But it’s not that they are worshipping different Gods. They have differing perceptions of the true nature of God. **cosmodan** wrote that: > [@cosmodan](#): > > I think whatever insight and knowledge that is available is available to anyone who seeks it. Then we get to choose what to do with it, or what it means to us personally. There is no ego invvloved, no need to be worshipped. If this were true, then we would not observe the splintering of religions on doctrinal lines, and wide variance of belief. The most obvious case is the case of monotheism vs. polytheism that **Learjeff** pointed out. But, even within Christianity, there are a multitude of incompatible beliefs. Take a concept as fundamental as salvation. Calvinists believe that God chose who would be saved before he created the world, based on God’s mercy. Nothing any human does or believes affects whether they will be saved. The Church of Christ believes that salvation comes from “obedience to the proclaimed facts of the gospel”, meaning that after death (unless that death is before the age of 13) God will judge whether a person obeyed the commands of the New Testament. No salvation occurs until death. Southern Baptists believe that salvation comes solely from faith in Christ, and occurs in life when one repents of one’s sins and accepts Christ. And, Catholics believe in mortal sins, which prevent salvation regardless of faith. All of these beliefs are the result of sincere attempts to understand God. They can’t all be right. This implies that there is not, in fact, a Godly source that provides insight and knowledge to anyone who seeks it. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/86 "2013-03-24T16:44:44Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > **Cosmosdan** , I do believe there will always be skeptics. It’s not that I believe that God _couldn’t_ convince everyone, but for some reason God the Father seems to prefer faith as the source of belief. > > I also don’t think that a person has to be a believer before she can experience a more personal revelation or understanding. Saul, a non-believer, had a life changing experience on the road to Damascus before becoming known as Paul or St. Paul. > > One of my favorite quotes is from him: “I believe, Lord. Help Thou my unbelief.” If God holds faith to be necessary, then he shouldn’t reveal himself to _anyone_. Believing in what you **know** to be true is not faith. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/87 "2013-03-24T16:46:45Z")
> [@Learjeff](#): > > If it was universal, they’d be either a small minority of skeptics, or they’d one of the bunch with no moral compass – we always have those, regardless of religious norms. I apoligize for my previous answers. I was short on time and looking at them now they appear abrubt and dismmissive which was not my intention. I agree that some worldwide miraculous event amounting to “I am God, and I really exist” would have a profound impact and a lot of people would believe. My suggestion is that it would fade in a relatively short time unless that proof was asserted over and over again > [@](#): > > If God provided us all with direct evidence that he existed (rather than providing some sort of writings to a minority of the people in the world – a rather sloppy way to spread the Truth), the vast majority of people would believe Him and try to follow His word. His word being what exactly? I’m not proposeing Gid says “The BIble is true , those others aren’t” I’m only saying he demonstrates his existence. That still leaves us with the decision of what to do with that knowledge. > [@](#): > > There would still be various kinds of skeptics. For one, the “strong” agnostic, who claims (with good arguments) that we can never tell a true God from a very advanced impostor. But, if this being routinely provided us with miracles such as healing our illnesses and providing us with necessities when we can’t get them through our own means, most people would be content to follow along in any case. How do you tell what is a miraculous healing and what might be remission? I suppose if all cripples were to walk, all blind made to see, etc. that sure would do it but this all goes to what I’m hinting at. That ultimately there may not be some middle ground between the God that is imagined now , that believers struggle to understand , and a God who simply takes over compeltely and says, I’m here and running the show from now on, which IMO would effectively end free will. > [@](#): > > There would also be those who feel that even if God exists, created the universe, and gives us a clear description of right versus wrong, that we still have to decide for ourselves. If we disagree, we can either assume God is smarter and follow along anyway, or we can decide that we have to be true to our own conclusions. If this God not only provides miracles but also smites those who disagree, this would be a noble but hazardous (and arguably foolish) course. Some would take it in any case, of course. Some would say we already have a fairly clear idea of right and worng, we just fail to choose right consistently. So can individuals petition God with every choice they have to make about which is right and which is wrong? What does that do for the learning process? > [@](#): > > The question raised here is one I like to raise for any seriously contentious topic: what evidence, if any, is there that would convince you that you’re wrong? wrong about what? > [@](#): > > As mentioned above, there are cases where no evidence is possible. I tend to agree with **Spiritus Mundi** > [@](#): > > It isnt possible from within this Universe to demonstrate incontrovertably that a specific being from beyond its bounds created it all. ``` but what I was getting at is my theory that if God met the demands of those who required proof , it would lead to the end of free will and ultimately defeat the purpose of creation. ``` ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/88 "2013-03-24T16:57:29Z")
> [@cosmosdan](#): > > His word being what exactly? I’m not proposeing Gid says “The BIble is true , those others aren’t” I’m only saying he demonstrates his existence. That still leaves us with the decision of what to do with that knowledge. But once this entity shows that it exists, the _only_ actual knowledge we have to work with is that this being exists. You keep saying “God” as if we all know what you mean, but we don’t. We need to know fact from fiction when it comes to what this god did, what this god can do, and what the future plans of this god are before we can decide whether or not to listen to what it has to say. If this god that is wanting peace, love and understanding has any connection to the god of the Old Testament there are questions that have to be answered, or as far as I’m concerned that well is too far poisoned to drink from. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/89 "2013-03-24T17:13:23Z")
> [@cosmosdan](#): > > I agree that some worldwide miraculous event amounting to “I am God, and I really exist” would have a profound impact and a lot of people would believe. My suggestion is that it would fade in a relatively short time unless that proof was asserted over and over again Depends on the documentation, and the form the proof took. We don’t doubt that George Washington existed, despite the passage of time. > [@cosmosdan](#): > > His word being what exactly? I’m not proposeing Gid says “The BIble is true , those others aren’t” I’m only saying he demonstrates his existence. That still leaves us with the decision of what to do with that knowledge. > [@cosmosdan](#): > > That ultimately there may not be some middle ground between the God that is imagined now , that believers struggle to understand , and a God who simply takes over compeltely and says, I’m here and running the show from now on, which IMO would effectively end free will. Isn’t the middle ground exactly what you wrote above, a God that positively exists but makes no proclamations beyond that? > [@cosmosdan](#): > > but what I was getting at is my theory that if God met the demands of those who required proof , it would lead to the end of free will and ultimately defeat the purpose of creation. How so? How is free will negated by knowing that God exists? ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/90 "2013-03-24T17:15:33Z")
> [@colonial](#): > > OP’s first question was “how” a God might prove His existence, and I was giving an > example of how, namely, by a miracle so big that no one could miss it. > > The structure and behavior of all substance would be an omnipotent God’s to do with as He pleased, it is a defining aspect of omnipotence itself. So if your premise is that God’s omnipotence is a bar to proof, then logically there is no such thing as proof. > However, the premise is not obviously correct (some might think it silly) and it requires more explanation than, say, the premise that Socrates was a man. I was kidding because it wasn’t clear what I meant by taking over. I didn’t mean taking over in any sense of physical laws, which such a God already controls, but in the event of global proof of existence, either eventually fading and a return to where we are now, or , God’s intervention is complete and mankind has to obey, which essentially abolishes free will. > [@](#): > > I have a feeling it would change a lot of things, including me. I might start going to church again. I would certainly start praying again! I’m sure many people would react that way, but I think if it was a singular one time global miricle that change would be tempoary for mankind in general. In time, people would rationalize and justify so they could pursue their own agenda, just as they always have whether in or out of religion. It’s mankind’s nature. > [@](#): > > Numerous miracles attested only by ancient scripture are considered proof to hundreds > of millions of people, sustaining their faith and justifying their compliance with > scriptural law. If a 2,000 year old miracle can “matter” so much then it is unreasonable > to stipulate as you do that a new, modern miracle could matter less. I’m not saying it would natter less AT ALL. Belief in God is incredibly fractured and believers use thier beliefs to justify all kinds of BS. I’m saying a world wide miricle would eventually come back to the same place we are now because of the nature of mankind. > [@](#): > > Again, you need to do more than just throw out a premise. I agree, but part of the reason I started this thread was to help me clarify the premise rattling around in my head so bare with me. Starting from " God needs to prove he exists" and assuming an implied “to me” I asked how. so are we talking individual visions and miracles for those who sincerely pray for an event of proof. That’s where I started but let’s accept that that would be to close to what is claimed now. So we’ll say one singular world wide event occurs in which God wants all mankind to know he exists and the stars are rearranged to spell out “I Am God , I exist” And for an added bonus, everyone sees it in their own language , and illiterates have angels to read it for them" Then what? IMO such an event would certainly mean some changes for people. The fundamentalists would be elated. “IN YOUR FACE ATHEISTS!!” but I suggest that with no further involvement , in time mankind would drift back to where we are now. People disagreeing on what the event meant and how we should respond, and people rationalizng it away and saying it doesn’t matter, or just people realizing that they can still do bad shit and no lightning strikes them so who cares about the event. > [@](#): > > If free will is an illusion then merit and guilt are illusions, except when applied to an omnipotent God who would be the only character enjoying true freedom of any kind. I’m not interested in a discussion of whether free will is an illusion or not. Real or illusion , my suggestion is that God proving his exostence wouldn’t really change anything , and further continued intervention would lead to the abolition of free will, and IMO and my theory, defeat the purpose of creation. > [@](#): > > The logical sequence: > > (premise): creator and creation exist > (conclusion): then this world of apparent duality, good, evil, pleasure and pain, choice and cinsequence is part of the point. The exoerience of choice, and discovery. > > Is unsound because the conclusion is not a necessary consequence of the premise; it is > a _non sequitur_. what you present as a conclusion is not the conclusion. > [@](#): > > Furthermore, an omnipotent God ought to be able to create a world without evil and pain. Of course . The actual question is why create at all? and then. why duality? ---
**Author:** ![Trinopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/2bfe46/32.png) [@Trinopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trinopus)\ **Post date:** [March 24, 2013, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/91 "2013-03-24T23:21:58Z")
> [@Learjeff](#): > > . . . The Bible essentially says “open your mind to God and you’ll find him.” . . . I have not found this to be true, despite a concerted, protracted, and earnest attempt. I was not testing God, I was looking to find Him. In my heart of hearts, I found nothing. After a while, I came to terms with that. . . . And you are far, far, far from being alone in this. Many an atheist has, usually in their youth, begged, prayed, humbled themselves, and otherwise, in all modesty of spirit, besought God’s wisdom. To be fair, a decent many believe they have been answered. I’ve talked to many people who honestly believe that God answers them, as individuals. Most of us, alas, only heard the universal silence, or the staticky kind of noise one hears when one listens to the roar of the surf for a while. One almost senses a kind of message behind it… But never anything quite intelligible. Your point, however, is very valid: the fact that many of us have not heard does not mean that we were not listening. > [@cosmosdan](#): > > I’ll have to look for that movie. I mentioned “The Voice You are About to Hear” earlier. Starring James Whitmore. In that one God spoke to everyone on the planet for a short period. > > I doubt a world wide miricle would mean the end of organized religion. Oops, I was unclear; the Poul Anderson story was in print, in a book. The book of the same title (“The Day The Sun Stood Still”) containing that and other stories is in print at Amazon. (Scroll down a little for the cheaper copies; don’t buy the $60 collectible versions! The story is good, but not that good!) I think that a miracle of the sort described in the OP, where God reveals himself directly to everyone, and where God answers prayers and grants miracles – heals anyone of any injury, consoles anyone of any woe – would mean the end of organized religion. Why should anyone pay a priest to intercede, when God himself is standing right there? What purpose does the priest have in such a world? > [@cosmosdan](#): > > . . . I agree that some worldwide miraculous event amounting to “I am God, and I really exist” would have a profound impact and a lot of people would believe. My suggestion is that it would fade in a relatively short time unless that proof was asserted over and over again . . . I think the OP intends that the proof is reasserted over and over again. We would get to test it every day. If I drop a hammer on my foot, I pray, and God heals my injury. I do agree that, humans being what we are, we would soon become inured to the wonder of it all. We’d treat healing prayer the same way we treat a doctor visit today. “Hey, Al, how’s it going today?” “Oh, same old, same old. I got a piece of steel rebar jammed through my chest. Hurt like hell. But God fixed it right up.” “Yeah, I know, I’ve had days like that too…” Indeed, I don’t doubt that some few die-hards would continue to deny the evidence of God’s existence, no matter how obviously manifest it might be. But the big shift in public opinion would be vast and permanent. Atheists, in that world, would be as ridiculous as communists are today (after the fall of the USSR, there just isn’t any real spirit left in communism!) Hell, we atheists would be the “flat-earthers” and “creationists” of the era! We’d be the ones hysterically denying the reality that everyone else can see with their own eyes! If the miracle is not re-asserted, then I somewhat agree with you. The belief would gradually fade. However, it would still have a massive social effect, and this effect would long outlive the actual witnesses to the event. Great-grandsons would still tell of the day that their great-grandfathers saw the Face of God. The residual effects of faith could last a millennium or more. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 12:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/92 "2013-03-25T00:35:37Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > But once this entity shows that it exists, the _only_ actual knowledge we have to work with is that this being exists. You keep saying “God” as if we all know what you mean, but we don’t. We need to know fact from fiction when it comes to what this god did, what this god can do, and what the future plans of this god are before we can decide whether or not to listen to what it has to say. If this god that is wanting peace, love and understanding has any connection to the god of the Old Testament there are questions that have to be answered, or as far as I’m concerned that well is too far poisoned to drink from. I think the OP is enough. "“here I am I really exist, I created everything, Try to treat each other and the planet you share with some respect and consideration. Love, would be great.” if you and others feel like proof of existence isn’t enough and you want your questions answered to your satisfaction before you do anything about it, that’s your choice. I cetrtainly can understand a reaction to God saying “I really care about creation " of,” like hell you do, what about X, Y and Z.?" ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/93 "2013-03-25T00:37:23Z")
> [@Spiritus\_Mundi](#): > > Lots of the responses in this thread seem limited to th idea of an omnipotent God who created the Univers and all things in it. I agree with **Human Action** that no the conceptions of God in human experience are larger than that. If you want to insist only upon that definition then no proof of God will ever be possible, It isnt possible from within this Universe to demonstrate incontrovertably that a specific being from beyond its bounds created it all. I agree, thanks for this post. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 1:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/94 "2013-03-25T01:11:08Z")
> [@rikules](#): > > I would like to ask him some questions… > > "If you are all powerful and can do anything then; > > “1. why did you foil all those assassination attempts on hitler?” > “2. why did you allow the holocaust?” > “3. why didn’t you stop 9/11?” > “4. is big foot real?” > “5. can’t you do something about mosquitoes and black flies?” > “6. is helping athletes to win big games a form of cheating?” Love that last one. Funny! I’ll make an observation that all of these type of questions can be boiled down to , “why is there so much suffering?” which IMO logically becomes “Why is there any suffereing at all?” which then leads to “Why a world of duality, good evil, pleasure and pain?” which leads to “why any creation at all?” ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/95 "2013-03-25T01:21:03Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > Because even the most basic class on communicating says so, care to elaborate? > [@](#): > > and if a god wants to have us hear he would be way smart enough not to hide his answers in a tree or under a rock. I see it as a question of purpose not smarts. Using your own analogy, what would be the purpose of a detailed biological explanation of where babies come from, to the inquisitive 4 year old. > [@](#): > > Sorry, we being connected (which is trivially true) does not answer anything. Certainly not why children drown. It explains why we care, true. There is an obvious secular answer - geologic forces don’t care about the little things that live on the earth, but I can’t imagine any answer from a powerful deity - or any answer that wouldn’t make me start plotting his end. I assume that babies drowning is only an example. there really isn’t that much difference between a baby drowning and say a 25 year old, in terms of "how tragic is it, is there? IMO, all these question boil down to , “why is there so much suffering?” which IMO logically leads to “why is there any suffereing at all?” which leads to , “why a world of apparant duality, good evil, pleasure and pain?” and finally, “why any creation at all?” ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 1:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/96 "2013-03-25T01:21:46Z")
> [@cosmosdan](#): > > Love that last one. Funny! > > I’ll make an observation that all of these type of questions can be boiled down to , “why is there so much suffering?” which IMO logically becomes “Why is there any suffereing at all?” which then leads to “Why a world of duality, good evil, pleasure and pain?” which leads to “why any creation at all?” Dualism is a human construct, it’s not an inherent part of the universe. If our is a world of dualism, _we_ made it that way. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/97 "2013-03-25T01:26:25Z")
> [@Zoe](#): > > It’s not that God differs at all. Perceptions about the Deity vary and cause the splintering. Sometimes people are able to see a little past the difference in perceptions. > > I’ve attended a lot of different churches (including Catholic and Protestant) and haven’t seen that much difference in their overall understandings of God. The greatest differences that I have seen are among the Protestant churches themselves. Some see God as an angry and vengeful God and others believe in a loving and sustaining God. But it’s not that they are worshipping different Gods. They have differing perceptions of the true nature of God. Exactly, and I think that trend would continue in the face of some global miraculous revelation. ---
**Author:** ![cosmosdan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a6a055/32.png) [@cosmosdan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cosmosdan)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/98 "2013-03-25T02:24:44Z")
> [@you\_with\_the\_face](#): > > The OP seems to be saying that human psychology is stronger than God’s will. That it is impossible for him to reveal himself in a way that would effectively overcome our mental resistances. No, not what I’m saying at all. > [@](#): > > If God wanted us to believe in him, he would know exactly what stunts to pull that would disable disbelief. That is a perk that comes with omnipotence. It is impossible for God to fail at anything, if he’s truly all-powerful being. So the OP’s argument is logically flawed. Nope, because just believeing in God doesn’t provide us with the knowledge of what to do with that belief. Which is kinda the point in this mental exercise. ---
**Author:** ![panaccione](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/94ad74/32.png) [@panaccione](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panaccione)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/99 "2013-03-25T03:01:42Z")
I don’t think there is anything “God” could do to prove himself regardless of how many miracles took place. Even if he did, your always left wondering “where did you come from?” ---
**Author:** ![Jamicat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c67d28/32.png) [@Jamicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jamicat)\ **Post date:** [March 25, 2013, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659/100 "2013-03-25T03:45:27Z")
What if GOD had already proven “The Almighty” to exist to all humanity sometime in the distant past…and then peeps wrote that shit down for generations to remember from then on. Forward a few thousand years…that same indisputable evidence is so commonplace now that we have forgotten what it was that gave it to us. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-god-proved-that-god-existed-then-what/653659.md?page=6)