# If I don't protest when white people are killed in police custody ... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [June 9, 2020, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330 "2020-06-09T23:22:06Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/41 "2020-06-10T12:59:25Z")
> [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](#): > > Nope. Nobody. I don’t approve of police killing anyone in their custody, but I’m not the protesting type. I tend to focus more on things like obeying the law and providing for my family. It’s certainly easy to be “not the protesting type” when it’s not your family being threatened by potentially fatal bias and bigotry. But it sounds more likely that this is just a pathetic justification for apathy and laziness. ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/42 "2020-06-10T13:18:07Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > But it sounds more likely that this is just a pathetic justification for apathy and laziness. I think it’s more likely still that he actually approves of the killings as a necessary part of a vigorously policed nation. To reduce the unjustified killings means relaxing attitudes, “coddling” criminals, and he specifically doesn’t want that to happen. I’m not the protesting type either (this weekend was my first protest) but I supported and voted for change, what are the chances out friend here would support policies to reduce LEO killings vs. support the Joe Arpaio’s of the nation? ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/43 "2020-06-10T13:42:10Z")
> [@scabpicker](#): > > 1. For a myriad of reasons ranging from simple racism to economics to ease of prosecution, black people in the US are unfairly targeted by law enforcement and unfairly come to the attention of the behavior mentioned in #1. And, to be clear, the “economics” and “ease of prosecution” reasons are also rooted quite firmly in racism. It’s racism all the way down. ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/44 "2020-06-10T13:59:45Z")
I know that folks like **A Dodgy Dude** and **Tim R. Mortiss** have already actively chosen to ignore some basic truths in order to arrive at the conclusion that liberals and black people are the real bad guys, but I’ll say it again: Protests going on right now, while sparked by the murder of George Floyd, are about police brutality in general. The solutions being called for are not going to apply to black people only, but to everyone. It is not hypocritical to be angered by the systemic treatment of black people at the hands of the police, because white people do not suffer under the same systemic injustices. Also, the constant refrain from the right that protesting police brutality is the real racism is a particularly ugly and pathetic one. ---
**Author:** ![Babale](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/babale/32/15666_2.png) [@Babale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Babale)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 2:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/45 "2020-06-10T14:08:42Z")
> [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](#): > > Nope. Nobody. I don’t approve of police killing anyone in their custody, but I’m not the protesting type. I tend to focus more on things like obeying the law and providing for my family. I’m very happy for you that as a white man in America you can trust that as long as you keep doing that the cops will treat you right. Unfortunately that’s not true of black Americans. ---
**Author:** ![AlsoNamedBort](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alsonamedbort/32/3213_2.png) [@AlsoNamedBort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlsoNamedBort)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/46 "2020-06-10T14:11:00Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > [This was showing](https://old.reddit.com/r/pics/comments/gzn8tj/at_a_protest_in_arizona/) at a protest today (or yesterday) in Arizona. Does that count? December 21st, 2017: [Mesa ‘Rally for Justice’ held for Daniel Shaver](https://www.12news.com/article/news/local/valley/mesa-rally-for-justice-held-for-daniel-shaver/75-501627698) > [@](#): > > On Thursday — organizers, **including Black Lives Matter,** with the blessing of Shaver’s widow — held a vigil. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/47 "2020-06-10T14:31:38Z")
> [@A\_Dodgy\_Dude](#): > > If I don’t protest when white people are killed in police custody … but I _do_ protest when black people are killed in police custody, wouldn’t that make me a racist? 😕 Oh.My.God. I wish you racists would keep up. And no, the hypothetical wouldn’t make you a racist. But posing it in the arrogant and ignorant way you do DOES make it rather likely you are a racist. Here’s a breakdown of the 1004 people shot dead by police in the U.S.: (One THOUSAND and four! Would you think that’s too many, Dodgy Dude?) White 370 36.9% Black 235 23.4% Hispanic 158 15.7% Other 39 3.9% Unknown 202 20.1% How many of the 235 black killings led to massive protests? If it were all 235, or even a substantial fraction thereof, we might consider your point. But it wasn’t, and we don’t need to. Blacks and other pro-Justice Americans put up with abusive police behavior until there is a coincidence: video of the police abuse, saturation of resentment, and so on. Are some whites abused by the police? Probably! Start a protest about one of those incidents if you want. _ **Blacks will join your protest as they have in the past.** _ You can get more information about racist policing, and why blacks feel especially victimized both here at SDMB, and via Google. But you won’t. Because YOU are probably a racist, even though you might be to stupid to even realize it. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/48 "2020-06-10T14:35:25Z")
If your only criteria for protesting when the police kill someone in custody is the color of their skin then you are racist or have some weird non-racist skin color thing going on. ---
**Author:** ![Great\_Antibob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@Great\_Antibob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Great_Antibob)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 2:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/49 "2020-06-10T14:42:45Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > have some weird non-racist skin color thing going on. That’s still plain racism. But we have to call it something else because it’s not from the RacistDouche region of France. ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/50 "2020-06-10T15:14:37Z")
> [@AlsoNamedBort](#): > > December 21st, 2017: > [Mesa ‘Rally for Justice’ held for Daniel Shaver](https://www.12news.com/article/news/local/valley/mesa-rally-for-justice-held-for-daniel-shaver/75-501627698) Disclaimer: I am a white guy living in Mesa. It has nothing to do with racism from me, but I do wonder why this story never became a large issue. Mesa PD killed an unarmed man lying face down on the ground, begging for his life. AND it was captured on video. And NOTHING happened! The fact that Mr Shaver was white should not have any affect on the coverage or disposition of the case. But that appears to be the problem with the handling of the case, too. The Blue Wall, and conservative Mesa residents. meant that the cops are always right and Shaver must have done something to deserve it and anyway “it doesn’t affect me”. I am surprised to see all the protesting downtown against the Phoenix PD, when Mesa PD is probably the most gun-happy PD in AZ, if not the country. The only thing is that they are equal-opportunity, shooting white people almost as often. eta : it was so long ago I can’t find any story on-line, but Mesa PD once pulled a “Gauntlet” and pumped something like 21 bullets (each? I can’t remember) into two teens in a Suburban, who were fleeing" and “maybe possibly moving in the direction of officers, therefore their lives were in imminent danger”. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/51 "2020-06-10T15:17:10Z")
> [@QuickSilver](#): > > Ridiculous. That’s not what makes you a racist. Huzzah! 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 4:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/52 "2020-06-10T16:38:34Z")
> [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](#): > > Disclaimer: I am a white guy living in Mesa. > > It has nothing to do with racism from me, but I do wonder why this story never became a large issue. Mesa PD killed an unarmed man lying face down on the ground, begging for his life. AND it was captured on video. And NOTHING happened! > > The fact that Mr Shaver was white should not have any affect on the coverage or disposition of the case. But that appears to be the problem with the handling of the case, too. I’ve posted this link a couple other places on these threads previously, but can’t lay my hand on it right now, so [here](https://www.aclu.org/blog/criminal-law-reform/reforming-police/youre-fucked-acquittal-officer-brailsford-and-crisis) is the original link to the ACLU’s stirring December 2017 denunciation of the Daniel Shaver killing, written by ACLU Deputy Legal Director Jeffery Robinson: > [@](#): > > ‘You’re Fucked’: The Acquittal of Officer Brailsford and the Crisis of Police Impunity […] > > We have seen this movie before. Daniel Shaver was not armed or committing any crime when was he shot to death by Brailsford. Like many previous police shooting videos, this one shows police behaving much more aggressively than Mr. Shaver. And like previous videos, a jury acquitted the officer of all criminal charges. But this video showed us two things about policing culture in America that stand out. First, the video shows Shaver begging for his life while he tried to follow contradictory instructions screamed at him by an officer. And Shaver was white. […] Oh, and by the way? Jeffery Robinson is black. So, if you want examples of black anti-police-brutality activists standing up for the rights of white victims, there’s one right there. I hope it makes some of these “gotcha” internet warriors whining about how “BLM activists are the REAL racists” properly ashamed of their selfish lazy white asses. ---
**Author:** ![Lance\_Turbo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lance_turbo/32/6156_2.png) [@Lance\_Turbo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lance_Turbo)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/53 "2020-06-10T17:21:47Z")
> [@A\_Dodgy\_Dude](#): > > … but I _do_ protest when black people are killed in police custody, wouldn’t that make me a racist? 😕 > > Of course it would. No, shit like this makes you racist… > [@Black Panther movie](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/black-panther-movie/809075/1): > > “Refugees bring their problems with them” > -Black Panther > > ‘Black Panther’ Continues To Make B.O. History: $195M+ > > “Refugees bring their problems with them” > -President Trump > > Trump denounced as a racist and xenophobe. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/54 "2020-06-10T17:28:37Z")
> [@Lance\_Turbo](#): > > No, shit like this makes you racist… Another thread on race started by the OP that ended up in the Pit in short order. Coincidence or dumb luck? You be the judge. ---
**Author:** ![Chisquirrel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6bbea6/32.png) [@Chisquirrel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chisquirrel)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 9:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/55 "2020-06-10T21:06:52Z")
> [@Tim\_R.Mortiss](#): > > OMFG. I cannot believe, in this day and age, that anyone, even a Doper, can be so incredibly racist as to ask such a question. White. Got it. ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Borgia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/larry_borgia/32/156_2.png) [@Larry\_Borgia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Borgia)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 9:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/56 "2020-06-10T21:13:48Z")
As someone pointed out to me, the Black Lives Matter crowd are sticking up for a 75 year old white man. The “all lives matter” crowd are sticking up for the cops who knocked him over and concussed him. It shows you what group truly believes all lives matter. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/57 "2020-06-10T22:10:04Z")
> [@Chisquirrel](#): > > White. Got it. Unfortunately, lots of white people don’t even understand what racism is. These folks have trouble identifying it in others, and there’s very little chance they could hope to identify it within themselves. ---
**Author:** ![Unreconstructed\_Man](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/76d3ee/32.png) [@Unreconstructed\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Unreconstructed_Man)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/58 "2020-06-10T22:41:15Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > ISTM that on the contrary, you should be grateful to them for being willing to take up any of the slack on the fight against injustice that your selfish lazy white ass can’t be bothered with. What, specifically, are _you_ doing? I’m keen to know. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/59 "2020-06-10T22:55:34Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Oh.My.God. I wish you racists would keep up. And no, the hypothetical wouldn’t make you a racist. But posing it in the arrogant and ignorant way you do DOES make it rather likely you are a racist. > > Here’s a breakdown of the 1004 people shot dead by police in the U.S.: (One THOUSAND and four! Would you think that’s too many, Dodgy Dude?) > White 370 36.9% > Black 235 23.4% > Hispanic 158 15.7% > Other 39 3.9% > Unknown 202 20.1% > How many of the 235 black killings led to massive protests? If it were all 235, or even a substantial fraction thereof, we might consider your point. But it wasn’t, and we don’t need to. Blacks and other pro-Justice Americans put up with abusive police behavior until there is a coincidence: video of the police abuse, saturation of resentment, and so on. Are some whites abused by the police? Probably! Start a protest about one of those incidents if you want. _ **Blacks will join your protest as they have in the past.** _ > > You can get more information about racist policing, and why blacks feel especially victimized both here at SDMB, and via Google. > > But you won’t. Because YOU are probably a racist, even though you might be to stupid to even realize it. The question is how many of these killings were at least somewhat justified? Like the guy had a gun and was shooting. I suspect if you remove them, the situation looks even worse. If cops started shooting people wearing MAGA hats, we’d really see some change. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 11:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330/60 "2020-06-10T23:07:18Z")
> [@Unreconstructed\_Man](#): > > What, specifically, are _you_ doing? I’m keen to know. Me personally? Mostly throwing money at the problem, as an ACLU member and supporter of BLM and affiliated organizations. I also do some in-person activism in the form of working on campaigns for legislative remedies, attending rallies, writing letters to my elected representatives, etc. Sadly, I haven’t participated in any in-person gatherings (not counting online meetings) during the COVID crisis, rationalizing that I may be doing more good overall by staying out of the healthcare system and helping with funding than by joining in a physical march. But I am not really sure whether that’s the morally right choice to make in this situation, and I am deeply grateful to the activists who **are** running those risks for picking up the slack on the fight against injustice on behalf of my selfish lazy white ass. (I also don’t count arguing with people on the Dope in my activism-activities total, as that seems more like recreation than civic engagement.) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-i-dont-protest-when-white-people-are-killed-in-police-custody/855330.md?page=4)