# If it works in the Phillipins should Mexico try the same? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 23, 2016, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748 "2016-08-23T18:10:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Mr\_Shine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mr_shine/32/464_2.png) [@Mr\_Shine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr_Shine)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 3:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/21 "2016-08-24T15:34:24Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > But if they loose their income all at once, it would cause inflation :rolleyes: _Golf Clap_ ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/22 "2016-08-24T15:45:56Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > It seems to be working (sorta) in the Phillipines where they are killing the drug dealers in the streets. Lots of people are being killed. There’s no real way of knowing if they are drug dealers. ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 4:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/23 "2016-08-24T16:06:31Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > The Filipinos seem to think its working. Filipinos thought the Marcoses were swell folks and tried to beat the shit out of the Beatles. Forgive me if I seek outside confirmation. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/24 "2016-08-24T17:59:03Z")
> [@Tom\_Tildrum](#): > > The Philippines has a long history of a high level of political violence. What’s going on now is a worsening of the trend, but I think it’s just a difference in degree more than it is anything new. > > I seem to recall that **diego** lives in the Philippines. I have not seen him around here in a while, though. Did they really used to kill 1700 alleged drug dealers and arrest 300 allegedly corrupt police officers? Did 600,000 people used to surrender to the police when the administration changed? ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/25 "2016-08-24T18:00:06Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > Lots of people are being killed. There’s no real way of knowing if they are drug dealers. Well that’s the downside of “extrajudicial” killings, you don’t have to prove anything. But it seems targeted well enough that 600,000 alleged drug dealers have surrendered to the police. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/26 "2016-08-24T18:13:06Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > If this sort of authoritarian policy works in getting their country’s violence and crime under control, how would you feel about Mexico doing something similar to get their problems under control? As far as I’m concerned you’ve answered your own question here. If it’s authoritarian and extrajudicial I’m against it. I don’t give a shit how well it works. Fighting evil with more evil doesn’t sit well with me. But then I’m also against the death penalty because I don’t care if the false execution rate is 1 in 100,000. One is one too many. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/27 "2016-08-24T18:29:15Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Filipinos thought the Marcoses were swell folks and tried to beat the shit out of the Beatles. Forgive me if I seek outside confirmation. I don’t know if the Filipinos thought the Marcos were swell folks after they declared martial law. After all they got chased out of the country. But I will agree that the Filipinos are awfully forgiving of a family that looted their country and oppressed their citizens. I don’t know about the Beatles incident but I wouldn’t dismiss the democratic will of an entire nation because some of them mistreated a bunch of musicians that were perceived to have slighted the democratically elected head of state and had recently compared themselves to Jesus. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/28 "2016-08-24T19:22:21Z")
They’ve replaced illegal drug sales with government death squads. As a solution, this is equivalent to getting rid of a toothache by cutting off your head. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/29 "2016-08-24T19:32:05Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Did they really used to kill 1700 alleged drug dealers and arrest 300 allegedly corrupt police officers? Did 600,000 people used to surrender to the police when the administration changed? I’d seen a [citation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Political_killings_in_the_Philippines_(2001%E2%80%9310)#Background) to 1200 extrajudicial killings there in 2010, but having looked at other sources, I think that’s probably the figure for 2001-10. So, sure, it’s a bigger spike than I realized, but it’s still the case that the Philippines has been a [very](http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/36481-the-killing-fields-extrajudicial-killings-in-the-philippines) [violent](https://www.hrw.org/world-report/2015/country-chapters/philippines) [polity](http://asiafoundation.org/2011/10/12/extrajudicial-killings-in-the-philippines-is-the-situation-really-improving) for a long time. ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/30 "2016-08-24T20:04:16Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > About 600,000 drug dealers have turned themselves in to avoid getting killed. That is a drug dealer for every 168 people. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/31 "2016-08-24T20:43:28Z")
> [@carnivorousplant](#): > > That is a drug dealer for every 168 people. :dubious: I’m sure plenty of people turned themselves in to avoid being killed, regardless of their history with drugs. Assuming that actually 600,000 turned themselves in (which as you pointed out is a questionable number) there’s no way of really knowing how many were actually drug dealers and how many were scared potential victims. ---
**Author:** ![Aspidistra](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aspidistra/32/3894_2.png) [@Aspidistra](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Aspidistra)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 9:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/32 "2016-08-24T21:16:13Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > The Filipinos seem to think its working. Apart from the dead ones of course ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/33 "2016-08-24T21:19:33Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > They’ve replaced illegal drug sales with government death squads. As a solution, this is equivalent to getting rid of a toothache by cutting off your head. Or its like killing breast cancer with a mastectomy and chemotherapy. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/34 "2016-08-24T21:22:47Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > I’m sure plenty of people turned themselves in to avoid being killed, regardless of their history with drugs. Assuming that actually 600,000 turned themselves in (which as you pointed out is a questionable number) there’s no way of really knowing how many were actually drug dealers and how many were scared potential victims. Why is it questionable? The number was reported by several news outlets without a hint of skepticism. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/35 "2016-08-24T21:25:37Z")
> [@Aspidistra](#): > > Apart from the dead ones of course Which amounts to less than a fifth of one percent, of one percent of the population. Sure its still a big number but this guy came into power promising to do exactly this and that promise was a large part of why he won. ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [August 24, 2016, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/36 "2016-08-24T21:53:17Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Sure its still a big number but this guy came into power promising to do exactly this and that promise was a large part of why he won. You know who else won an election ;)? Strongmen are often popular with certain segments of a frightened or paranoid population - Putin certainly is. But by and large history doesn’t tend to judge them kindly, the less so the father you get from them in time. Just because you democratically elect an authoritarian demagogue, doesn’t make them less of an authoritarian demagogue. Especially in a state where the rule of law is fragile at best, all but absent at worst. In other threads there are even posters advocating for aiding in the overthrow of Recep Tayyip Erdogan, another democratiocally elected authoritarian asshole ( though less of a wild card than this joker ). ---
**Author:** ![carnivorousplant](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/carnivorousplant/32/3563_2.png) [@carnivorousplant](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/carnivorousplant)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/37 "2016-08-25T02:19:59Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Which amounts to less than a fifth of one percent, of one percent of the population. Sure its still a big number but this guy came into power promising to do exactly this and that promise was a large part of why he won. What if my ex wife falsely accused me of being in that one fifth of one percent and I were killed? What if someone on the SDMB accused you? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/38 "2016-08-25T02:41:55Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > Why is it questionable? The number was reported by several news outlets without a hint of skepticism. The current number being reported is actually 700,000. With a population of 98 million that means there would be 1 drug dealer for every 140 citizens and presumably more left to turn themselves in. Do you think that is an accurate representation of the drug problem in the Philippines or do you think perhaps something else is going on? ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 11:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/39 "2016-08-25T11:26:52Z")
If only those unjustly accused of a crime, one that suddenly entailed immediate capital punishment, had a way to protect themselves from a government that had become tyrannical. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 2016, 1:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748/40 "2016-08-25T13:44:42Z")
Back to the title of the thread, no, Mexico should not create death squads. First, the predictable result would be Mexicans fleeing their country to the US in the hands of human smugglers. Tons of children from Central America had done a similar thing over the last several years, fleeing drug violence in places like Honduras and Guatemala, and it has been a serious problem. Nobody should encourage that sort of nonsense. Second, no matter how popular such murders are, it is immoral to set death squads on the loose. It’s just straight up _evil_. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-it-works-in-the-phillipins-should-mexico-try-the-same/763748.md?page=3)