# If it's like getting drunk, what's it like in Paris? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 8, 2009, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332 "2009-01-08T03:56:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Patch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a183cd/32.png) [@Patch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patch)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/1 "2009-01-08T03:56:11Z")
\*“It’s unpleasantly like being drunk.” “What’s so unpleasant about being drunk?” “Go ask a glass of water.”\* One of the many exchanges in _Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy_ that’s stuck in my head. But the exchange depends upon “drunk” (intoxicated) being confused with “drunk” (past tense of the verb, ‘drink’). How does this and other examples of humor of this type work when translated into other languages? ---
**Author:** ![panamajack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/47e85d/32.png) [@panamajack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panamajack)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 4:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/2 "2009-01-08T04:29:12Z")
I’m sure the next person that comes along has been in her, and can probably tell you. ---
**Author:** ![Hazle\_Weatherfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Hazle\_Weatherfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hazle_Weatherfield)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/3 "2009-01-08T04:30:52Z")
> [@panamajack](#): > > I’m sure the next person that comes along has been in her, and can probably tell you. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![panamajack](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/47e85d/32.png) [@panamajack](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/panamajack)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 4:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/4 "2009-01-08T04:37:27Z")
More seriously - it doesn’t work in German, which is close to English in these word forms. Drunk (as in “Ford has drunk the glass of water.”) is _getrunken_ from _trinken_ for ‘to drink’. Drunk (as in falling down) is _betrunken_, and I think there’s the verb \*betrinken (sich)\*which could mean to get (oneself) drunk. There’s a parallel to the somewhat old-fashioned sounding English ‘be-’ verbs like ‘besotted’. ---
**Author:** ![Indistinguishable](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/90ced4/32.png) [@Indistinguishable](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Indistinguishable)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 4:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/5 "2009-01-08T04:41:50Z")
Does anyone actually have a translated copy of the Hitchhiker’s Guide to check what was actually done in any other language? ---
**Author:** ![susan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/susan/32/17537_2.png) [@susan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/susan)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/6 "2009-01-08T04:52:00Z")
IIRC, this is called “violating an M-constraint.” She left in a huff, and a Toyota. [Here’s a little tedium to brighten your day.](http://books.google.com/books?id=C_K3NxEzWvgC&pg=PA26&lpg=PA26&dq=m-constraint+linguistics&source=web&ots=FV_KA0O7Qr&sig=jub0NAZdDUxVnh5vE39ViEKK0jE&hl=en&sa=X&oi=book_result&resnum=1&ct=result#PPA27,M1) ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 4:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/7 "2009-01-08T04:58:51Z")
It could be made to work in Spanish, I think, since _bebido_ is both the past participle of “to drink” and also means “drunken.” ---
**Author:** ![Patch](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a183cd/32.png) [@Patch](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Patch)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 4:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/8 "2009-01-08T04:59:21Z")
> [@panamajack](#): > > More seriously - it doesn’t work in German, which is close to English in these word forms. I figure it doesn’t work with any other language, unless there’s slang that makes things close enough. The question then becomes, how does the exchange go in other languages? I assume they use some other comparison particular to their language, or the humor just won’t work. ---
**Author:** ![Sage\_Rat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sage_rat/32/399_2.png) [@Sage\_Rat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sage_Rat)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/9 "2009-01-08T05:00:37Z")
In Japan, during movies, what they’ll do is write a little note next to the word that’s being played on explaining what the play is. But yeah, this probably explains a lot of why puns are looked down on as a source of humor. They’re essentially just a really big in-joke. ---
**Author:** ![Freudian\_Slit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/5daacb/32.png) [@Freudian\_Slit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Freudian_Slit)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/10 "2009-01-08T05:11:02Z")
I’ve actually wondered this in random moments. One of those things that sticks in my head, and then I find myself wondering if others get to experience it, too. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 9:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/11 "2009-01-08T09:44:44Z")
> [@susan](#): > > She left in a huff, and a Toyota. If that’s too soon, she can leave in a minute and a huff. ---
**Author:** ![Mycroft\_Holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a5b964/32.png) [@Mycroft\_Holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mycroft_Holmes)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 10:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/12 "2009-01-08T10:07:21Z")
> [@Colibri](#): > > It could be made to work in Spanish, I think, since _bebido_ is both the past participle of “to drink” and also means “drunken.” It won’t work in Portuguese though. There you have “bebado” for intoxicated and “bebido” for “past tense of the verb drink”. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 10:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/13 "2009-01-08T10:10:05Z")
It works perfectly in Hebrew - the word \*Shatui \* may have slightly more elegant associations than “drunk” (“inebriated”, maybe), but it still means both things. ---
**Author:** ![bienville](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4bbf92/32.png) [@bienville](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bienville)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 10:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/14 "2009-01-08T10:10:07Z")
On a related note, I always wonder when in subtitled films word-play or literary device is matched in both the spoken dialogue and in the translation offered by the subtitles. Example: In the movie [Amélie](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0211915/), there is a scene wherein the characters Dufayel and Lucien are making fun of Lucien’s boss, Collignon. The rant of insults and name calling are all based on rhyming insulting suggestions with the name “Collignon”. Listening to the French spoken by the actors, it is clear (even not knowing French) that the insults follow a rhyme scheme. Then, in the English subtitles, the very same rhyme scheme is observed. I have always assumed that the subtitles did not present a direct literal translation, since it would be a huge coincidence that the insults that rhyme in French also rhyme in English. To completely rewrite a line is common in dubbing and translating films, so I would assume that it is the same for books- when a literary device is important to style, but does not work in translation. I know from the DVD commentary for [Men in Tights](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0107977/) that, when dubbed into German, the line “Unlike _some_ Robin Hoods, I can speak with a British accent” (a dig at Kevin Costner for his recent Robin Hood) was dubbed to be (in German) “Unlike _some_ Robin Hoods, I don’t _cost_ the studio X million dollars” which used the German verb “kosten” to pun the name “Costner”\*. \*I only know this from the DVD commentary and would like to hear it since it sounds like a pretty crummy joke. Singular present form of kosten would be “kostet” which is a stretch to pun with “Costner”. I wish I had a less dubious example to give. That’s the only one I could think of off the top of my head. ---
**Author:** ![jjimm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba8739/32.png) [@jjimm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jjimm)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/15 "2009-01-08T10:57:27Z")
I have a friend who collects the “my dog’s got no nose” “how does he smell?” joke in lots of different languages. It only works in English, which makes what he’s doing more amusing to me, and more baffling to foreigners. “Ngoh-de gau mo bei.” - “Geh heung?” “Mm ho.” 😃 😃 😃 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Oukile](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/13edae/32.png) [@Oukile](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Oukile)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/16 "2009-01-08T12:17:05Z")
In French, it would not work with the littral translation (intoxicated = ivre, to drink = boire), but one could use the familliar expression ‘être bourré’ which litterally means ‘to be filled’ but is commonly used used for ‘being intoxicated’. So it would be easy to design a joke using this expression. When it comes to translating books, one will generally look for a joke that corresponds as good as possible to the original. This reminds me of the famous ‘REDRUM’ in Shining. It worked out pretty nicely in French, where they used ‘TROMAL’. This did even add to the joke, indeed ‘trop mal’ means something like ‘too much pain’. When you read it backward, you obtain ‘la mort’, i.e. ‘the death’. ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/17 "2009-01-08T13:21:09Z")
The English translators of the French _Asterix_ comic books faced a similar problem and by all accounts did a great job. Interesting to compare the punning French character names with the English ones. The French puns seem a bit random, whereas the English ones are more apt, e.g. Assurancetourix (a play on _Assurance tous risques_, comprehensive insurance) vs. Cacofonix (cacophony) for the bard character. > **[English translations of Asterix | Lost in translation](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_translations_of_Asterix#Lost_in_translation)** > > Bell and Hockridge were widely praised for their rendition of the English language versions, maintaining the spirit and humour of the French original even when direct translation is impossible – as it often is when translating puns between languages which are not closely related. A good example occurs in Asterix and the Chieftain's Shield when Obelix redistributes the water in the spa pools by diving in, the other guests complain and the druid in charge arrives asking Vitalstatistix, "Where are y... ---
**Author:** ![lawoot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/35a633/32.png) [@lawoot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lawoot)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/18 "2009-01-08T15:01:17Z")
\*“It’s unpleasantly like being in Paris.” “What’s so unpleasant about being in Paris?” “Go ask half the male population of Beverly Hills.”\* ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/19 "2009-01-08T15:21:57Z")
> [@bienville](#): > > On a related note, I always wonder when in subtitled films word-play or literary device is matched in both the spoken dialogue and in the translation offered by the subtitles. Almost all movies here in Panama are shown in English with Spanish subtitles. In my experience, puns are rarely translated successfully. Mostly they just ignore them, or translate them in a way that doesn’t really convey the joke well. One case where it did work was the Leslie Nielsen movie [Spy Hard](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0117723/), where there was a lot of double entendre based on the main character’s name, Dick Steele. In Spanish he was called “Agapito;” the short form, Pito, also translates in slang as “dick” in the rude sense. ---
**Author:** ![choie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/choie/32/7829_2.png) [@choie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/choie)\ **Post date:** [January 8, 2009, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332/20 "2009-01-08T20:26:21Z")
On a side note, I’m embarrassed to admit how long it took me to ‘get’ this joke when I was first reading the books. The reason was Ford’s actual line in that dialogue: Arthur: “What’s so unpleasant about being drunk?” Ford: “You ask a glass of water.” If Adams had written just “Ask a glass of water,” I’d have got it at once. But as written, I couldn’t parse it correctly. I kept wondering why Ford was implying that when you’re drunk, you ask a glass of water something, without actually specifying _what_ you ask for. Probably on my fourth re-reading it finally hit home. Believe it or not, I wasn’t normally this thick as a teenager. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-its-like-getting-drunk-whats-it-like-in-paris/480332.md?page=2)