# If Joe Biden had run in 2016, President Bernie? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 19, 2017, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-joe-biden-had-run-in-2016-president-bernie/787014 "2017-05-19T17:53:33Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 5\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![dalej42](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@dalej42](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dalej42)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2017, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-joe-biden-had-run-in-2016-president-bernie/787014/21 "2017-05-21T17:36:33Z")
> [@Lord\_Feldon](#): > > I’m not sure about this, but…maybe Biden could have actually given Clinton the ability to carve out her own space on some of the issues. She basically let Sanders define all of the ideological stakes, and had to follow him in whatever direction he went. I’m not sure she would have been in that position if she’d had the opportunity to make a foil out of Joe Biden (D-Visa), chair of the Anita Hill hearings. A very good point. Sanders kept moving the goalposts and Clinton screwed up by letting Sanders basically dictate the party platform. Platforms are irrelevant but the insanity of letting Cornel West onto the platform committee and then have him turn around and endorse Stein was utter bullshit to try to appease the die hard Bernie or Bust crowd. ---
**Author:** ![DinoR](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dinor/32/2821_2.png) [@DinoR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DinoR)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2017, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-joe-biden-had-run-in-2016-president-bernie/787014/22 "2017-05-21T17:38:49Z")
> [@Sterling\_Archer](#): > > Biden divides the mainstream centrist D vote and Bernie ends up winning the nomination. Dividing that vote doesn’t guarantee Sanders the nomination. A plurality of delegates isn’t enough. It takes a majority. If all three stay in deep enough to make it a real three way race, it’s hard for any of them to get a majority on the first vote. Since it’s unlikely that Sanders gets more pledged delegates with Biden in the race than he did without him, his only route to a first ballot selection is the super delegates going overwhelmingly for him. After the first vote the rest of the Party, that just isn’t as left as Sanders, heads into the proverbial smoky back room. Maybe they pick Sanders as the candidate with a plurality. Maybe the centrists unite around a candidate closer to the centrist majority of the party like Clinton or Biden. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2017, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-joe-biden-had-run-in-2016-president-bernie/787014/23 "2017-05-21T17:52:22Z")
Again, COULD a different Democrat have won? Sure. But would either Biden or Bernie have excited the apathetic black voters? No. They still would have stayed home. Moreover, would either have won over those Republicans who were having doubts about Trump? Maybe, but I can’t see it. Bernie Sanders might have convinced those people to vote for Trump enthusiastically rather than reluctantly. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2017, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-joe-biden-had-run-in-2016-president-bernie/787014/24 "2017-05-21T18:13:58Z")
I was not a Biden fan in 2008, or when he ran before. I think he distinguished himself as VP. I’m not sure how the race would have turned out, but using his 2008 flop as evidence of unelectability in 2016 is ignoring that he had a biggesr national and international stage than Clinton had during the same years. ---
**Author:** ![DinoR](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dinor/32/2821_2.png) [@DinoR](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DinoR)\ **Post date:** [May 21, 2017, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-joe-biden-had-run-in-2016-president-bernie/787014/25 "2017-05-21T20:59:23Z")
> [@astorian](#): > > Moreover, would either have won over those Republicans who were having doubts about Trump? Maybe, but I can’t see it. Bernie Sanders might have convinced those people to vote for Trump enthusiastically rather than reluctantly. He might have kept some traditional Democratic voters that defected or home in key states she narrowly lost - union households. She won the group but only by 8 points nationwide. That’s the worst a Democrat did with union households since Mondale got crushed in 84. Obama won the demographic by 18 points in 2012. It’s a smaller portion of the electorate now but it is still pretty important in states like MI and OH. Trump actually beat her by 9 points among Ohio union household voters. That’s a 32 point swing from 2012 where Obama won by 23 points. There was also a 20 point swing in MI between 2012 and 2016 ( +13 for Clinton vs +33 for Obama.) [Cite](http://www.politico.com/story/2016/11/labor-unions-hillary-clinton-mobilization-231223) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-joe-biden-had-run-in-2016-president-bernie/787014.md?page=1)