# If Kavanaugh gets in and Roe v. Wade is overturned, what do you think that will look like? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [September 9, 2018, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031 "2018-09-09T00:24:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2018, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/61 "2018-09-11T16:33:52Z")
Gee, thanks ever so much for mansplaining my 69 years’ life experiences to me. Asshole. ---
**Author:** ![EscAlaMike](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/escalamike/32/4177_2.png) [@EscAlaMike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EscAlaMike)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2018, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/62 "2018-09-11T16:35:53Z")
> [@elucidator](#): > > “Complete sexual liberty” _includes_ celibacy as an option, dumbass. It could, but when I use the term in contrast to “complete celibacy”, it seemed obvious to me that it doesn’t. I apologize if I was unclear in my terminology. Maybe I should have said “uninhibited promiscuity”? Regardless, your joke about marriage and celibacy made no sense to me (I assume it was a joke?). ---
**Author:** ![EscAlaMike](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/escalamike/32/4177_2.png) [@EscAlaMike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EscAlaMike)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2018, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/63 "2018-09-11T16:37:04Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Gee, thanks ever so much for mansplaining my 69 years’ life experiences to me. > > Asshole. Your “life experience” is irrevelant. I’m not talking about one person’s experience, I am talking about society over a long period of time. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2018, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/64 "2018-09-11T16:42:04Z")
> [@EscAlaMike](#): > > Your “life experience” is irrevelant. I’m not talking about one person’s experience, I am talking about society over a long period of time. Which of course is made up of many people’s experiences over time. But do go on telling women what their reality actually is; it would be amusing if it weren’t so pathetically tiresome. ---
**Author:** ![EscAlaMike](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/escalamike/32/4177_2.png) [@EscAlaMike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EscAlaMike)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2018, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/65 "2018-09-11T16:48:04Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Which of course is made up of many people’s experiences over time. But do go on telling women what their reality actually is; it would be amusing if it weren’t so pathetically tiresome. I never specifically addressed women until other posters and you mentioned women specifically. Men have been harmed by the sexual revolution too. ---
**Author:** ![Morgyn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/morgyn/32/3041_2.png) [@Morgyn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgyn)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2018, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/66 "2018-09-11T17:38:08Z")
You are utterly misinformed and historically unaware. > [@EscAlaMike](#): > > When the majority of children grow up in a home that does not consist of biological father and mother, … The divorce rate has nothing to do with the “sexual revolution”. It is a result of women gaining the civil rights that should have been theirs to work and own property and have money in their own names, so they are not dependent on a male for income. It is also a result of both men and women deciding that it’s okay to quit a marriage. > [@EscAlaMike](#): > > … when pornography is ubiquitous … Pornography has been with us for millennia. It is not a recent development; any culture capable of making a semi-permanent record of information has sex manuals and pornography. > [@EscAlaMike](#): > > … when sex is completely separated from procreation, … If you think the only reason to have sex is to create children, you’re doing it wrong. You’re also completely out of step with 99.99999999% of the rest of humanity, who know that sex is fun. Granted, evolution designed it to be fun to increase the odds of species survival, but fun is fun and people don’t have to obey species imperative just because someone thinks they shouldn’t be having fun. > [@EscAlaMike](#): > > … when society defines “love” as “sodomy”, … No one here is equating sodomy with love. Love is love. Sex is sex. Sex can be a profound expression of love, but love isn’t necessary for it. Witness rape, which is about power, not love. Sodomy is a form of sex that many people enjoy. You seem to have some issues with homosexual sex, but that’s your issue, not the rest of humanity’s. > [@EscAlaMike](#): > > … when the vast majority of society has no clue what marriage is, … People know what marriage is, your opinion not withstanding. > [@EscAlaMike](#): > > \ Eg. rape culture and an entitlement attitude toward sex, prevalence of depression and other MH disorders, prevalence of divorce, etc. “Rape culture” is not a result of the sexual revolution, either. It’s, once more, something that has been in existence for millennia. Check your Bible and see how it says to treat women who have been raped. Over the millennia, most men have felt entitled to sex. This is not new. What is new is that more and more people have decided that this is not ok and are saying so. If that weren’t the case, we’d have the Harvey Weinsteins and Green River Killers pursuing their merry ways with no repercussions at all. The same can be said for depression. It’s not more prevalent, it’s _more recognized_ and more admitted to. You are obviously a misogynist. I’m betting you’re self-identified as either an involuntary incel (because your attitude is toxic) or an MRM. In any case, you’re going on my Ignore list, because you’re also an idiot. ETA: On preview, I see you are also claiming that men have been harmed by the sexual revolution. As a woman, the only harm I see most men suffering is being told “no” and having to accept it. You’re still an idiot. ---
**Author:** ![Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/try2b_comprehensive/32/65_2.png) [@Try2B\_Comprehensive](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Try2B_Comprehensive)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2018, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/67 "2018-09-11T17:55:57Z")
> [@davidm](#): > > Any state that requires a 14 year old rape victim to carry a fetus to term is, at least in my mind, **a slave state.** You misspelled “God’s country.” ---
**Author:** ![EscAlaMike](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/escalamike/32/4177_2.png) [@EscAlaMike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EscAlaMike)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2018, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/68 "2018-09-11T18:12:37Z")
> [@Morgyn](#): > > You are utterly misinformed and historically unaware. > > The divorce rate has nothing to do with the “sexual revolution”. This is your opinion, one that I would challenge. > [@Morgyn](#): > > It is a result of women gaining the civil rights that should have been theirs to work and own property and have money in their own names, so they are not dependent on a male for income. Women have had civil rights to work, own property, and have money in their own names since well before the sexual revolution. > [@Morgyn](#): > > It is also a result of both men and women deciding that it’s okay to quit a marriage. I would argue that this mentality is a product of the sexual revolution, specifically a lack of understanding as to what marriage is. > [@Morgyn](#): > > Pornography has been with us for millennia. It is not a recent development; any culture capable of making a semi-permanent record of information has sex manuals and pornography. This is true, but the ubiquity and widespread availability of pornography is something unprecedented in history. > [@Morgyn](#): > > If you think the only reason to have sex is to create children, you’re doing it wrong. You’re also completely out of step with 99.99999999% of the rest of humanity, who know that sex is fun. Granted, evolution designed it to be fun to increase the odds of species survival, but fun is fun and people don’t have to obey species imperative just because someone thinks they shouldn’t be having fun. Of course I don’t think that. Sex is many things and has multiple purposes, pleasure being one of them. The issue I brought up is that there are going to be societal repercussions when you separate the procreatic aspect of sex from the rest of it. > [@Morgyn](#): > > People know what marriage is, your opinion not withstanding. When society at large believes that two people of the same sex can marry each other, clearly they are missing something, my opinion notwithstanding. > [@Morgyn](#): > > You are obviously a misogynist. I’m betting you’re self-identified as either an involuntary incel (because your attitude is toxic) or an MRM. In any case, you’re going on my Ignore list, because you’re also an idiot. I’m not at all a misogynist and I’m confident that every woman (or man) I’ve ever met would say the same. The incel movement is a prime example of a product of the sexual revolution and rape culture. I’ve never heard of an “MRM”. > [@Morgyn](#): > > As a woman, the only harm I see most men suffering is being told “no” and having to accept it. Being told “no” and having to accept it is not harm, it is a good thing. ---
**Author:** ![CaptMurdock](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/captmurdock/32/11736_2.png) [@CaptMurdock](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CaptMurdock)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2018, 11:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/69 "2018-09-11T23:31:01Z")
> [@EscAlaMike](#): > > I never specifically addressed women until other posters and you mentioned women specifically. Men have been harmed by the sexual revolution too. Totally. For example, my uncle…poor guy. Got his virginity shot off in the Sexual Revolution. 😃 > [@EscAlaMike](#): > > Women have had civil rights to work, own property, and have money in their own names since well before the sexual revolution. Well, you’ve already failed at disproving **Morgyn** ’s assertion about being utterly misinformed and historically unaware. For the latter two items, it was overwhelming the exception rather than the rule when they were true. As for the first, look up when the 19th Amendment was ratified in this country. It may have been “before the sexual revolution” but not WELL before. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [September 11, 2018, 11:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/70 "2018-09-11T23:49:38Z")
> [@EscAlaMike](#): > > All abortions are dangerous to the child. A fetus isn’t a child. And pregnancy & birth are dangerous to the woman, who is an actual person not a clump of cells. Of course that’s the whole point; opposition to abortion is entirely about oppressing, torturing and killing women, and nothing else. Every woman who dies is a victory for them. ---
**Author:** ![davidm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidm/32/225_2.png) [@davidm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/davidm)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 12:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/71 "2018-09-12T00:01:59Z")
> [@CaptMurdock](#): > > Totally. For example, my uncle…poor guy. Got his virginity shot off in the Sexual Revolution. 😃 > … Hey, it was Trump’s Vietnam. > **[Donald Trump Calls Avoiding STDs His 'Personal Vietnam'](https://people.com/politics/trump-boasted-of-avoiding-stds-while-dating-vaginas-are-landmines-it-was-my-personal-vietnam/)** > > Donald Trump likens avoiding contracting STDs during his single years to Vietnam in Howard Stern interview ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 12:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/72 "2018-09-12T00:29:40Z")
You guys are talking to it like it’s more person than parrot. It’s probably composing its self-congratulatory Giraffe Board post even now. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 2:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/73 "2018-09-12T02:19:16Z")
> [@EscAlaMike](#): > > When the majority of children grow up in a home that does not consist of biological father and mother … then AFAICT they will be pretty typical of the majority of children for most of human history. Given the high rates of death in childbirth and other forms of parental mortality prior to the last couple of centuries, plus other institutions such as polygyny, concubinage and joint families, plus the sexual exploitation of working-class and enslaved women, to the best of my knowledge pre-industrial humans have **never** had a majority of children living out their entire childhood in a home with both biological parents heading the household. > [@EscAlaMike](#): > > when pornography is ubiquitous, when sex is completely separated from procreation, when society defines “love” as “sodomy”, when the vast majority of society has no clue what marriage is, etc. etc. etc. then there will be repercussions. But none of this is happening, so you can quit worrying about it. I’m not saying that modern social/family mores are perfect, any more than any pre-modern mores ever were, but I’m confident in predicting that society is not going to define “love” as “sodomy”. For one thing, it would make a lot of conversation extremely confusing. _“I sodomize my baby so much!”_ 😕 :eek: :eek: :smack: ---
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 3:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/74 "2018-09-12T03:25:37Z")
> [@EscAlaMike](#): > > All abortions are dangerous to the child. Forcing children to carry to term can be dangerous to them as well, and it can fuck up the rest of their lives. Fortunately, we have started to take measures to help children understand sex and its potential results, and providing them access to contraceptives so that they can avoid getting in such binds in the first place – though, many of the people who want everyone to carry to term are the same ones who want to keep our children ignorant of the issues. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/75 "2018-09-12T04:30:42Z")
> [@EscAlaMike](#): > > Do I come off as some kind of patriarchal misogynist? Because that is ridiculous and I don’t take those suggestions seriously. If you’re not a patriarchal misogynist, you should get your computer password protected. Somebody else is posting things using your name. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 4:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/76 "2018-09-12T04:35:33Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > This is a page from the CDC, showing the **teenage pregnancy rates** in each state, as of 2016: > > [Stats of the State - Teen Birth Rates](https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/pressroom/sosmap/teen-births/teenbirths.htm) > > What this shows is that nearly all of the states with the highest rates of **teen pregnancy** are “red states,” many of which are already making it more difficult to receive abortions. I’m going to guess that, in many of those states, sex education in schools stresses abstinence-only, as well. Meanwhile, the lowest **teen pregnancy rates** tend to be in traditionally “blue” states. > > If Roe is overturned, and abortion becomes illegal in those states with already-higher levels of teen pregnancy, we might see those rates go up even higher. {bolding mine} The map graphic refers to teenage _births_, not teenage _pregnancies_. It could be these Red States have relatively low pregnancy rates but also low abortion rates which lead to higher birth rates. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 5:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/77 "2018-09-12T05:35:19Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > {bolding mine} > > The map graphic refers to teenage _births_, not teenage _pregnancies_. It could be these Red States have relatively low pregnancy rates but also low abortion rates which lead to higher birth rates. A good clarification. I’ll have to do some more digging to see if I can find actual numbers on teen pregnancy, and / or abortions, by state. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 5:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/78 "2018-09-12T05:51:55Z")
I found this site with state-by-state teen pregnancy rates: [https://powertodecide.org/what-we-do/information/national-state-data/teen-pregnancy-rate](https://powertodecide.org/what-we-do/information/national-state-data/teen-pregnancy-rate) Most of the same states (nearly all of them in the South and Southeast) with the highest teen birth rates in my earlier post/cite also have the highest teen pregnancy rates. ---
**Author:** ![aruvqan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/aruvqan/32/2891_2.png) [@aruvqan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aruvqan)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 8:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/79 "2018-09-12T08:24:29Z")
> [@EscAlaMike](#): > > when sex is completely separated from procreation, . So my husband and I need to get divorced because I am sterile? Interesting because the Catholic view of sex in marriage is the bonding aspect between husband and wife as well as procreation. Protestant [New England Baptist upbringing] is also bonding as well as procreation. I can’t procreate so all our sex is recreational … ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 12, 2018, 10:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031/80 "2018-09-12T10:28:52Z")
No judge vetted by conservative power-brokers would ever dream of overturning Roe. It’s far too valuable to them as a rallying point. The only politicians who have any opposition to abortion are all Democrats. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-kavanaugh-gets-in-and-roe-v-wade-is-overturned-what-do-you-think-that-will-look-like/821031.md?page=5)