# If "Paki" is acceptable to use then what other slurs are? Nigger? Spic? Homo? Jap? **URL:** \ **Category:** About This Message Board\ **Created:** [July 16, 2012, 2:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375 "2012-07-16T02:51:40Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![Irishman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/b487fb/32.png) [@Irishman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Irishman)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/241 "2012-07-18T04:15:03Z")
> [@Nunzio\_Tavulari](#): > > I would guess that Yank, Brit and Aussie were all originally slurs, but through frequent use in diverse situations they became acceptable shorthand. > [@Full\_Tilt\_Boogie](#): > > The only one of the three terms you cite whose etymology is deliberately derisive, is ‘Yank’ (it being derived from the Confederate term of contempt for someone from the USA during that country’s civil war - i.e. a _Yankee_). Neither Brit (merely an abbreviation of British) nor Aussie have ever been considered in any way pejorative or a slur. Actually, the term “Yankee” was originally a derogatory term the Brits had for the Americans during the US Revolutionary War. It was subsequently used by Southerners to refer to Northerners during the American Civil War and through Reconstruction, and thus the modern disdain many Southerners have for the term “Yankee”. “Yanks” is a UK abbreviation for “Yankees” but applied to all of us Revolutionaries. > [@Nunzio\_Tavulari](#): > > Pakistanis is a long word. I’d prefer to be able to say Paki. So would I. Unfortunately, the word has taken on a derogatory connotation for many people due to historical usage of one geographic area. Sucks, but there it is. > [@](#): > > However, the Pakistanis may be even more offended that we would lump them under the general term Indian. This is where cultural insensitivity combines with pragmatism and racial confusion. Lumping Southern Asians as a collective “race” is a natural inclination but fraught with problems. Pakistanis are likely to get irritated if you refer to them as being “Indian”, and Indians (i.e. folks from India) are likely to get ticked if you imply they are Pakistanis. Quite apart from any white supremacist baggage associated with a particular term. Many of us insulated Americans aren’t as familiar with the issues of Britain’s Asian history, as it is less relevant to _us_ than things like, oh, the American Civil War. Thus, “Partition” is gibberish. Knowing there is a distinction between Pakistanis and Indians is a stretch. > [@](#): > > As far as I know, there is no slur for people from Southeastern Asia. They are prominent in the gas station, motel and convenience store industries and people appreciate those services. As mentioned, “coolie” is a historical term. Not that I’m making a list of modern slurs to use. [deleted] > [@Full\_Tilt\_Boogie](#): > > 1. I’m not aware of anyone so culturally unaware/insensitive who might seek to ‘lump’ Pakistanis in with Indians (at least no post-Partition in 1947). Many Americans just aren’t familiar with that history. > [@Candyman74](#): > > It’s a racist term. It is used by right-wing nationalists; it is used by drunken racists on a Saturday night out. Whether you like it or not, it is. Well, drunken racists could be using the word “Pakistani” or “Indian” as well. They aren’t too concerned with being accurate or appropriate. They are more likely to use terms that convey an inherent sense of disrespect - like picking on skin color, for instance. I just don’t think drunken racists are the standard by which we should decide what words are appropriate to use. > [@DrDeth](#): > > This is a American board. Now that we shouldn’t be somewhat sensitive to others, but until we get actual UK people of Pakistani descent getting upset, let us not let the board be run by people only \*pretending \*to be butthurt, so that they can act all “holier than thou”- which is exactly what this is about. I think having a person who has been a victim of that usage complaining about the term is sufficient to consider the appropriateness of the usage. I wouldn’t equate that with being “holier than thou” or “pretending to be butthurt”. > [@Mangetout](#): > > You know, I think the best thing would be for you to argue this directly with **AK84**. You’re proposing deletion of what he considers a perfectly innocuous part of his vocabulary, on account of the misbehaviour of idiots in another country. Wait, you’re encouraging an Indian to start an argument with a Pakistani? Are you _trying_ to start a war? 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 4:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/242 "2012-07-18T04:34:55Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > So, as shown by\*\* Acsenray \*\*and by **the irish poster whose name I can’t remember** - also does “Brit” has that same history. > > Sure, I agree that context is critical. But thus Paki is fine- in most American contexts. > > So is “Jap”. I just hear it the other day “Man, that’s one cool Jap bike you got there!”, said admiringly of a motorcycle. Is that a slur? If I say I “jewed someone down”, is that a slur? ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 11:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/243 "2012-07-18T11:09:24Z")
> [@Acsenray](#): > > In the movie “An Everlasting Piece,” set in the 1980s in Belfast, the Catholic characters definitely used “You’re a Brit” and “Brits” as derogatory terms for Protestant Irish. I think typically it refers to the British Army. I’ll have to defer to the superior knowledge of one of our NI posters though. I had always assumed it was only usually used in that context. ---
**Author:** ![An\_Gadai](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d6d6ee/32.png) [@An\_Gadai](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/An_Gadai)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 11:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/244 "2012-07-18T11:14:02Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > If we find\* one dude, anywhere \*that thinks it’s a slur, then it’s out? > > But you have shown that Brit is a slur… in some rare conditions. Thus, it needs to be banned just like Paki. I don’t think it’s really correct to call it a slur given the context in which it was used, but your mileage may vary. ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/245 "2012-07-18T11:56:48Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > If I say I “jewed someone down”, is that a slur? I would give you a moderator note for saying it. ---
**Author:** ![Candyman74](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ad7895/32.png) [@Candyman74](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Candyman74)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/246 "2012-07-18T13:03:34Z")
> [@Full\_Tilt\_Boogie](#): > > I’m not aware of anyone so culturally unaware/insensitive who might seek to ‘lump’ Pakistanis in with Indians My observation has been that pretty much only skin colour is used to make the distinction (or, in this case, not make a distinction) by certain sections of society. To continue earlier discussion, then - while the word “Paki” may well share four letters with the nation of “Pakistan”, may well be used _withi_n the nation of Pakistan, its primary use in my experience has been solely to refer to a skin colour, and the word has been co-opted by a lot of people to mean just that. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 1:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/247 "2012-07-18T13:11:45Z")
> [@Nunzio\_Tavulari](#): > > Pakistanis is a long word. I’d prefer to be able to say Paki. To the best of my knowledge, it’s not a slur in the US and several posters have backed me up. However, the Pakistanis may be even more offended that we would lump them under the general term Indian. > > As far as I know, there is no slur for people from Southeastern Asia. They are prominent in the gas station, motel and convenience store industries and people appreciate those services. Right, we agree. “Slant” “Gook” are some very bad terms. ---
**Author:** ![Acsenray](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/acsenray/32/4519_2.png) [@Acsenray](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Acsenray)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 1:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/248 "2012-07-18T13:20:23Z")
> [@Nunzio\_Tavulari](#): > > As far as I know, there is no slur for people from Southeastern Asia. They are prominent in the gas station, motel and convenience store industries and people appreciate those services. Your use of “Southeastern Asia” in this way confuses me. I’m not sure whom you’re talking about. Just to be clear, these are how the terms are commonly used in the United States: Southeast Asia: The region bounded by, but _excluding_, Australia, India, and China. So, that would include Burma, Thailand, Vietnam, Cambodia, Laos, the Philippines, Malaysia, and Indonesia. South Asia: The Indian Subcontinent, that is, Pakistan, India, Nepal, Bhutan, Bangladesh, and Sri Lanka. So, which were you referring to? ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/249 "2012-07-18T13:21:12Z")
Dr. Deth’s experience and knowledge of the world differ from mine. “Paki” is not a derogatory term in the US – in fact, it’s just never used. It _is_ a derogatory term in England, always. “Jap” is a derogatory term in the US (although it seems to be losing just a bit of its sting within certain younger circles lately.) It is not so derogatory in Australia, I’m told. “Brit” is never a derogatory term, anywhere. ---
**Author:** ![Revtim](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/revtim/32/1042_2.png) [@Revtim](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Revtim)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/250 "2012-07-18T14:15:56Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > If I say I “jewed someone down”, is that a slur? > [@samclem](#): > > I would give you a moderator note for saying it. What if I responded with “I tried that, but he gentiled me back up.” Clearly I’m using ‘gentile’ in an pejorative context, but perhaps I’m the first person to do so in such a manner (for the sake of argument, lets say I am). Would that be a warning? Or does it have to have a pre-existing history of pejorative use? ---
**Author:** ![JKellyMap](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jkellymap/32/15880_2.png) [@JKellyMap](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JKellyMap)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/251 "2012-07-18T14:32:23Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > What if I responded with “I tried that, but he gentiled me back up.” Clearly I’m using ‘gentile’ in an pejorative context, but perhaps I’m the first person to do so in such a manner (for the sake of argument, lets say I am). Would that be a warning? Or does it have to have a pre-existing history of pejorative use? Without trying to speak for the Mods, let me just say that, IMHO, there is a difference when the new use of an old word is in reference to a group which has a long and deep history of being discriminated against (or worse). To pretend otherwise is to engage in false equivalencies. Thus, if you attempt to fashion derogatory connotation against a traditionally empowered group, it will deserve less of a rebuke than if you attempt to fashion a derogatory connotation against a traditionally oppressed group. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 3:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/252 "2012-07-18T15:01:41Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > If I say I “jewed someone down”, is that a slur? It’s a bigoted stereotype, yes, and I would also mod-note or warn you for that. > [@Revtim](#): > > What if I responded with “I tried that, but he gentiled me back up.” It’d be hard to treat that very seriously since you’re basically making up the word. But I’d tell you to stop so the thread doesn’t turn into a debate over the meaning and offensiveness of “Jewed him down.” ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/253 "2012-07-18T15:05:35Z")
> [@Revtim](#): > > What if I responded with “I tried that, but he gentiled me back up.” Clearly I’m using ‘gentile’ in an pejorative context, but perhaps I’m the first person to do so in such a manner (for the sake of argument, lets say I am). Would that be a warning? Or does it have to have a pre-existing history of pejorative use? **samclem** said that he would issue a moderator note, not an official warning. That’s probably what I would do in the case of “jewed.” And I’d probably also give a mod note for the “gentiled” remark as well, especially if it was in response to “jewed.” Whatever the history of the term, using it in that context would be pretty jerkish and intended to escalate hostilities. If either came from a poster with a history of bigoted remarks, they might elicit a warning. Look, just don’t try to game the system by screwing around. People are constantly trying to evade the rules by playing around with the letter of the law while violating the spirit. We’re not going to spell out every possible way in which someone can insult someone else, because it’s just not possible. Just treat other posters with respect and you won’t have problems. Trying find a way to ding them while technically avoiding a warning is not a good strategy. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/254 "2012-07-18T15:22:00Z")
> [@JKellyMap](#): > > Dr. Deth’s experience and knowledge of the world differ from mine. > > “Paki” is not a derogatory term in the US – in fact, it’s just never used. It _is_ a derogatory term in England, always. > > “Jap” is a derogatory term in the US (although it seems to be losing just a bit of its sting within certain younger circles lately.) It is not so derogatory in Australia, I’m told. > > “Brit” is never a derogatory term, anywhere. We agree more than you think: 1. I concur (although out here we see it once in a great while, but that’s mainly on a Pakistani owned business or club.). But it’s also not a slur outside of GB, such as in Pakistan, etc. In other words, it is only commonly used as a slur on one small island. 2. “Jap” _can_ be used as a slur in the USA, depending\* heavily \*on context. 3. I overstated my case, but “Brit” is certainly a slur on Ireland- yet another small island. Thus, “Brit” is a slur every bit as much as “Paki” is- both are mostly used as a slur only on one small island. ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/255 "2012-07-18T16:12:10Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > It’s a bigoted stereotype, yes, and I would also mod-note or warn you for that. > It’d be hard to treat that very seriously since you’re basically making up the word. But I’d tell you to stop so the thread doesn’t turn into a debate over the meaning and offensiveness of “Jewed him down.” And rightly so, which was my entire point. So if someone called a motorcycle a “jap bike”, would they get a warning? ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/256 "2012-07-18T16:18:59Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > So if someone called a motorcycle a “jap bike”, would they get a warning? As always, context matters. I’d probably give a mod note regardless, but if I thought they were really not saying anything negative about Japanese people I wouldn’t give a warning. ---
**Author:** ![Colibri](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/colibri/32/1841_2.png) [@Colibri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Colibri)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/257 "2012-07-18T16:19:18Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > And rightly so, which was my entire point. So if someone called a motorcycle a “jap bike”, would they get a warning? I don’t think it’s productive to try to come up with every possible variation of potentially offensive comments. As with anything else, how a remark like that is going to be moderated will depend on context. If that particular remark was posted by someone who was merely ignorant that “jap” was potentially offensive, I would most likely just issue a mod note to tell them to refrain in the future. If it were posted by someone with a history of bigoted remarks, who was clearly aware of the meaning, it could get a warning. ---
**Author:** ![bldysabba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ecccb3/32.png) [@bldysabba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bldysabba)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/258 "2012-07-18T16:27:13Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > As always, context matters. I’d probably give a mod note regardless, but if I thought they were really not saying anything negative about Japanese people I wouldn’t give a warning. > [@Colibri](#): > > I don’t think it’s productive to try to come up with every possible variation of potentially offensive comments. As with anything else, how a remark like that is going to be moderated will depend on context. If that particular remark was posted by someone who was merely ignorant that “jap” was potentially offensive, I would most likely just issue a mod note to tell them to refrain in the future. If it were posted by someone with a history of bigoted remarks, who was clearly aware of the meaning, it could get a warning. FWIW, if it’s clear from context that Jap is not being used as a slur, I think it shouldn’t even be mod noted. You perpetuate the negative connotation. That’s Jap, and American board, American slur, I don’t have much standing to discuss it. With Paki, I think I do have some, although obviously much less than Pakistanis. I think you actively _propagate_ the negative connotation by calling out instances where Paki isn’t being used negatively. I’d request the mods to discuss this. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/259 "2012-07-18T16:35:56Z")
> [@bldysabba](#): > > FWIW, if it’s clear from context that Jap is not being used as a slur, I think it shouldn’t even be mod noted. I should clarify that in situations like that I would probably not ding the person for using offensive word- I’d say they should avoid the word in the future because there’s a good chance it would offend someone else. > [@](#): > > You perpetuate the negative connotation. I think the history of “Jap” in the U.S. (tied to World War II, Pearl Harbor, and the internment of Japanese-Americans) probably won’t go away any time soon. ---
**Author:** ![Ibn\_Warraq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e19b73/32.png) [@Ibn\_Warraq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ibn_Warraq)\ **Post date:** [July 18, 2012, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375/260 "2012-07-18T16:49:44Z")
> [@Guinastasia](#): > > And rightly so, which was my entire point. So if someone called a motorcycle a “jap bike”, would they get a warning? I think a more appropriate comparison to the phrase “I Jewed him down” would be “I got gyped.” Now, the phrases both mean similar things and are based on ethnic stereotypes but I think it’s almost 100% certain that you would not get mod noted for the second phrase because it’s a far more commonly used phrased and most of the people who use the phrase are unaware of it’s origins nor do they agree with the anti-gypsy sentiments expressed within it. I find it extremely difficult to believe that anyone who uses the phrase “Jewed him down” is unaware of it’s origins much less that they don’t agree with the sentiments expressed in it. Similarly, had someone discussing the movie The Sum of All Fears referred to Morgan Freeman’s character, the CIA Director, as “the chief spook” and when people protested he’d claimed that he was using term because it was a common nickname for spies in both the US, the UK and other countries(In fact a few years ago there was a UK TV series about MI-5 called _Spooks_) not because of Morgan Freeman’s race, frankly I wouldn’t believe him and would think that he was deliberately using the term to rile people up because most people associate the term with a racial slur for blacks and I would find it preposterous that he didn’t realize how people would react to seeing him refer to a black person that way. In fact, when the aforementioned UK series was released in the US it was retitled _MI-5_. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375.md?page=12) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-paki-is-acceptable-to-use-then-what-other-slurs-are-nigger-spic-homo-jap/628375.md?page=14)