# If the MAN took the Indians land, who'd they take it from?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [January 13, 2003, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341 "2003-01-13T18:57:15Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@yme](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yme)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/1 "2003-01-13T18:57:15Z")
I really don’t know. I doubt they spontaneously appeared.
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### Author:  [@Soup\_Nazi\_1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Soup_Nazi_1)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/2 "2003-01-13T19:00:21Z")
IANAAnthropologist, but from what I remember being taught, the Native Americans (which I assume that’s what you mean by Indians) crossed an ice sheet from Siberia to Alaska. So I guess They took it from the animals that were here before them, though neither claim land as a possession.
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### Author:  [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/3 "2003-01-13T19:04:19Z")
Yup. They arrived first. However, this is really a simplification. Some NA nations attacked and pushed other NA nations off of their traditional tribal land and conquered each other before the Euros got there.
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### Author:  [@yme](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yme)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 7:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/4 "2003-01-13T19:08:23Z")
Yes, feathers, not dots.
I’ve heard of that too, where they crossed the ice sheet. I’m willing to bet that there were some humans before the _native americans_.
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### Author:  [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/5 "2003-01-13T19:14:06Z")
Why the heck would you assume that? And by the way, I’m not aware of any anthropologist who would agree with that statement.
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### Author:  [@yme](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/yme)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/6 "2003-01-13T19:32:15Z")
I’m not assuming anything. It’s just that all this time it’s been a common belief that the Native Americans were here first. How do anthropologists know this to a certainty?
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### Author:  [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/7 "2003-01-13T19:34:43Z")
Because there’s no fossil/archaeological evidence to the contrary? Besides, how would they have gotten here?
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### Author:  [@emarkp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/emarkp)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/8 "2003-01-13T19:34:57Z")
Perhaps you should ask Kennewick Man?
[http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/first/](http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/first/)
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### Author:  [@Siemsi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siemsi)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/9 "2003-01-13T19:53:22Z")
BTW…there are a lot of theories out there regarding who the Native Americans descended from. Search: origin of Native Americans, please.
_ **sing it with me now…"This land is your land…this land is my land…"** _
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### Author:  [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/10 "2003-01-13T19:53:53Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by emarkp \*
> \*\*Perhaps you should ask Kennewick Man?
>
> [http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/first/](http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/first/) \*\*
Oh Christos, please… NOT an “ASK THE OCCIDENTAL DEAD GUY WHO GOT HERE BEFORE THE INDIANS” thread… (especially if he was gay and Catholic- there’ll be 9 million posts).
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### Author:  [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 8:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/11 "2003-01-13T20:03:17Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by yme \*
> \*\*Yes, feathers, not dots.
>
> I’ve heard of that too, where they crossed the ice sheet. I’m willing to bet that there were some humans before the _native americans_. \*\*
I’m sure there were a few stragglers who came over before a bulk of the native americans came over, but if you think that the native americans took this land from another set of people who were already here, then there is no evidence for that.
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### Author:  [@SuaSponte](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SuaSponte)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/12 "2003-01-13T20:07:07Z")
Sure, there is, **Meatros** - the Book of Mormon.
D&R
Sua
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### Author:  [@Meatros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Meatros)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 8:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/13 "2003-01-13T20:16:18Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by SuaSponte \*
> \*\*Sure, there is, **Meatros** - the Book of Mormon.
>
> D&R
>
> Sua \*\*
Uh…well damn…I don’t know how to respond to that!😃
If you see this thread reopen in a few months, then you will know that I have **finally** thought of a response.😃
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### Author:  [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 8:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/14 "2003-01-13T20:22:09Z")
I doubt if there is any land that didn’t have one tribe push another tribe off of it- many times, in fact. The “white man” was just another, bigger tribe, with better weapons. Several tribes warred heavily on another, to the point of “genocide”. The thing to remember, dudes- is that the “native Americans” are PEOPLE- first, foremost & always. And PEOPLE are just human, with all the warts, nastiness & nobility, intolerance, evil & good, ignorance & wisdom.
Not that I am claiming that our pushing the Indians into reservations (which few we didn’t kill) was a “Good” thing- but it was, unfortunately- an all too “Human” thing. Assuming the “Native Americans” had had the technology & numbers- some tribes would have happily done the same to the Europeans.
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### Author:  [@Siemsi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siemsi)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 8:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/15 "2003-01-13T20:37:24Z")
DrDeth,
Well said! I agree with you.
Unfortunately these types of human behavior have been going on for thousands of years.
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### Author:  [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/16 "2003-01-13T20:40:38Z")
Oh sure, I’ll agree with that, **DrDeth**. But the Native Americans were by and large descended from the original land bridge crossers. There’s no evidence that those crossers pushed anyone off anything. However, it’s important to note that the crossing encompassed thousands of years, it’s not like those crossers came in one single chunk and then no one else came in.
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### Author:  [@Liberal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Liberal)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/17 "2003-01-13T20:49:50Z")
Of course, lack of evidence for X does not constitute evidence for ~X.
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### Author:  [@Neurotik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Neurotik)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/18 "2003-01-13T20:57:13Z")
Of course, lack of evidence for X merely constitutes evidence for lack of evidence of X. But if you are going to assert X without having any corroborating evidence for X…
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### Author:  [@you\_with\_the\_face](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/you_with_the_face)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/19 "2003-01-13T21:22:16Z")
Here’s a possibly stupid question: What would evidence for X have to look like to indicate that there were people here prior to Native Americans? Would fossil age alone be enough?
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### Author:  [@Sampiro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sampiro)
#### Post date: [January 13, 2003, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-the-man-took-the-indians-land-whod-they-take-it-from/148341/20 "2003-01-13T21:26:48Z")
> [@](#):
>
> \*Originally posted by you with the face \*
> \*\*Here’s a possibly stupid question: What would evidence for X have to look like to indicate that there were people here prior to Native Americans? Would fossil age alone be enough? \*\*
The main things that indicate that remains belong to non Beringian immigrants are bone structure (every ethnicity has a unique skeletal geometry), hair samples (race is actually determined by hair type, not by skin color), and to a lesser degree projectile points, basketry, clothing, and other remaining manmade relics.
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