# If they stonewall the 9/11 report, can they hold the election?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452
**Category:** Great Debates
**Created:** [April 5, 2004, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452 "2004-04-05T23:04:42Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 2
### Author:  [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/21 "2004-04-06T01:15:34Z")
> [@Brutus](#):
>
> It would stretch any sane persons imagination to envision a scenario such as **Alaric** puts forward. There is no constitutional provision for delaying elections, report released on time or not.
I agree fully. Alaric may not be sane, but he sure can clean up after himself. That’s a good thing, these days.
> [@](#):
>
> Do you really take seriously his scenario of intentional bombings, followed by a suspension of the elections?
Not really. I wouldn’t be floored to see an escalation in combat exercises in Iraq, Afghanistan, and/or any other countries we invade between now and then happening around the end of October, though. I also wouldn’t be terribly surprised to see a terrorist attack (or attempted terrorist attack) around the same time. Al Qaeda seems to like the feeling of changing election results. I wouldn’t step out and say that Bush would let it happen to boost his ratings, though. I happen to think that Bush is a mostly honest, if a little slow-witted and misguided. He just isn’t a liar. His advisors, though…
> [@](#):
>
> And WHAT THE FUCK was that bit about Goering, New Jersey State Police uniforms, and Karl Rove? If you are **Alaric** ’s self-styled defender, then defend away. I eagerly await your responses.
Frankly, I have no idea, but it isn’t like no one has ever criticized a Democrat for acting like a Communist. I throw around the term “fascism” a bit myself, mostly out of hyperbole. I can’t speak for Alaric, though.
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### Author:  [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/22 "2004-04-06T01:15:51Z")
The original ‘premise’, which you conveniently ignore, is that somehow the delay of the report will facilitate GW launching his
I note with chagrin that I did not make myself clear, and have therefor been misconstrued by partner B.
The verb is neccesitate, not facilitate.
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### Author:  [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/23 "2004-04-06T02:21:12Z")
No, the original premise was that they can’t hold the election if they are sitting on the 9/11 report.
And was silly, since they have no choice but to hold the election as scheduled. Which neither can, nor will, be postponed by Bush or anyone else.
Put it this way. If the election is not held as scheduled, I will personally buy a hundred rifles for the left-wing resistance . If it is, will you vote for Bush?
Regards,
Shodan
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### Author:  [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 2:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/24 "2004-04-06T02:37:05Z")
if the election is not held as scheduled, I’m outta here, fuck the resistance…
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### Author:  [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/25 "2004-04-06T03:03:11Z")
There is no plan to postpone the election, the Bushiviks would probably hold it tomorrow if they could, while they still retain a shred of credibility. There is no intention to change to election date, merely to ensure that the electorate is as uninformed as humanly possible.
The report will be turned over to the White House for review and “vetting”. This is a complex and lengthy process, can’t be hurried, mustn’t rush. Sections relating to previous failures, as in the Clinton administration, can probably be moved right along, much less chance of national security breach. Parts referring to more recent events, however, must be very, very carefully considered.
Maybe by Christmas.
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### Author:  [@Squink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Squink)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/26 "2004-04-06T03:16:42Z")
> [@elucidator](#):
>
> Maybe by Christmas.
I expect that if Bush takes too long vetting the report, some brave soul will leak it. Before the election.
Republicans will be displeased, and whine about “national security.” Others will read the report. A rollicking good time will be had by all.
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### Author:  [@Michael\_Ellis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Michael_Ellis)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 5:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/27 "2004-04-06T05:07:28Z")
> [@alaricthegoth](#):
>
> if the election is not held as scheduled, I’m outta here, fuck the resistance…
Nice to see ya standing up for what’s right.
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### Author:  [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 6:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/28 "2004-04-06T06:59:20Z")
> [@Squink](#):
>
> I expect that if Bush takes too long vetting the report, some brave soul will leak it. Before the election.
> Republicans will be displeased, and whine about “national security.” Others will read the report. A rollicking good time will be had by all.
The White House will denounce the leaked report as a fake.
George W. Bush will blame Clinton for the leak.
Dick Cheney will say the leaker is working for the Kerry campaign.
John Ashcroft will accuse everyone who reads the report as a terrorist sympatizer.
And a security investigation will uncover the leak and prosecute the leaker so fast that Valerie Plame’s head does a full 1080-degree spin.
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### Author:  [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/29 "2004-04-06T15:11:09Z")
> [@wonderwench](#):
>
> Great post Brutus.
>
> A better question than asking if the election will be held (it will), would be to ask why we are holding an investigation during a war effort?
>
> Congress approved the war based upon the same information as was available to the Bush administration. All the 9/11 Commission is achieving, besides spurring sales for Clarke’s historical fiction, is to provide grandstanding opportunities for career politicians.
>
> The government waited until after WWII was concluded to investigate Pearl Harbor. That was a wise decision then. It would be equally wise not to put our policy and strategy on display for foreign consumption now.
A-FRIGGIN’-MEN! Well stated, WonderWench!!!
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### Author:  [@Jonathan\_Chance](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jonathan_Chance)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/30 "2004-04-06T15:25:38Z")
> [@rjung](#):
>
> The White House will denounce the leaked report as a fake.
>
> George W. Bush will blame Clinton for the leak.
>
> Dick Cheney will say the leaker is working for the Kerry campaign.
>
> John Ashcroft will accuse everyone who reads the report as a terrorist sympatizer.
>
> And a security investigation will uncover the leak and prosecute the leaker so fast that Valerie Plame’s head does a full 1080-degree spin.
I’ll go farther and cheerfully predict that this report will be leaked so fast you could time it with a stopwatch. AND it’ll be difficult to trace.
There’s no way this sucker stays secret. The Starr report was on the streets early (I certainly had a copy days before the official release) and so will this one. This is, in its purest form, political dynamite.
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### Author:  [@Zagadka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zagadka)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 3:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/31 "2004-04-06T15:27:56Z")
> [@Clothahump](#):
>
> A-FRIGGIN’-MEN! Well stated, WonderWench!!!
You people are a disgrace to America. How DARE you criticize people for asking why the government is censoring itself? What POSSIBLE logic do you have that makes this in any way “OK” for a Republic? When Clinton led us to conflict in Yugoslavia, I suppose you were the first one arguing, “how can we investigate Whitewater, Lewinsky, and the Yugoslavian situation? We are at WAR here,” right? Unquestioning acceptance of a government at war?
Oh? What’s that? It was OK to investigate and protest against Clinton, but not Bush? Why is that?
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### Author:  [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/32 "2004-04-06T15:39:22Z")
> [@Jonathan Chance](#):
>
> I’ll go farther and cheerfully predict that this report will be leaked so fast you could time it with a stopwatch. AND it’ll be difficult to trace.
>
> There’s no way this sucker stays secret. The Starr report was on the streets early (I certainly had a copy days before the official release) and so will this one. This is, in its purest form, political dynamite.
I don’t think the two situations are comparable. The 9/11 commission is at least nominally nonpolitical. And with the Republicans in control of Congress in both situations, at least the leadership would be biased towards leaking during the Clinton administrationi and against leaking now.
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### Author:  [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/33 "2004-04-06T18:39:48Z")
I am nonplussed, not to say dismayed, that no one seems to agree with my underlying message-- that the electorate will predictably rise like a wounded beast to savage the republicans for trying to sell such a steamy pile of bullshit…
I suppose there is no end to the crap we are expected dociley to eat.
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### Author:  [@NotMrKnowItAll](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotMrKnowItAll)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/34 "2004-04-06T19:07:28Z")
> [@alaricthegoth](#):
>
> I am nonplussed, not to say dismayed, that no one seems to agree with my underlying message-- that the electorate will predictably rise like a wounded beast to savage the republicans for trying to sell such a steamy pile of bullshit…
>
> I suppose there is no end to the crap we are expected dociley to eat.
I think they will. I know of more that a few lifelong Republicans who will not vote for Bush this fall. I saw a poll on FOX of all places that said that 7 out of 10 think Bush is hiding something. The Republican Senate is apparently pissed off at the Whitehouse over Iraq “intelligence.” The US Congress thumbed their collective noses at the President and put forth their own highway bill. We haven’t even seem what indictments will be coming out of the Plame investigation. Seemingly all of the heat he’s been getting has been from his own side. Here in dumb old Tejas, twice as many Democrats turned out for the Primaries in my precinct than Republicans. And they had many contested races and we had just County Sherriff. I thought that was a good sign. e4
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### Author:  [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/35 "2004-04-06T19:17:26Z")
I know of more that a few lifelong Republicans who will not vote for Bush this fall.
Oddly enough, there do seem to be some.
I would guess, for instance, that Warren Rudman will not be voting for Bush this year…
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### Author:  [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 7:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/36 "2004-04-06T19:19:51Z")
I’d love to, **Al** , truly I would. But they won’t, or should I say _we_ won’t. Americans, by and large, have a deeply rooted need to believe. They wrap thier solemn bloviation in the flag, and it works.
They are selling a line of purest horseshit. They have a compelling need to go over every single line of the report, they’re already saying they won’t be done till the election is over. And its utter crap.
For the most part, the panel’s discussion took place in public. As well, every member of that panel and every person on thier staff knows whats going to go into that report, there are no, repeat _no_ “national security” issues involved. Leastwise, none that could remotely be categorized as “secret”. An uninformed electorate is to the Bushiviks advantage, and they will use whatever tactic is required to keep it so.
Hell, its been what? two months now? since the committee to investigate the “intellligence failures” was formed. Have they even decided what room to meet in? Proceeding on the same breakneck pace as the Plame investigation, urgently trying to get to the bottom of it. (Which could have been done in one hour, and everybody with the good sense God gave a goose knows it!)
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### Author:  [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/37 "2004-04-06T19:32:18Z")
I feel ya’
but the thing of it is, I like to think of myself as a pretty good, all 'round bald faced liar.
And, there are a few ex wives around who will, I think, support my position.
But THESE guys just put me in the shade. I could never imagine saying what they do and keeping my face straight. (Rumsfeld has a little trouble with his face as it is…)
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### Author:  [@Mtgman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mtgman)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/38 "2004-04-06T19:34:26Z")
> [@John Mace](#):
>
> No, it doesn’t. But I’ll tell you what. I’ll offer you 1,000:1 odds at any amount you want to wager that the election will be held on the first Tues of Nov. Care to back up your paranoia, or do you prefer the safety of the critics corner?
10,000:1? Holy crap! I in no way think the election will be suspended or canceled, but anyone offering those kinds of odds is just begging for a ten dollar bet. Heck, five bucks. I lose a measly five bucks most likely, but 50Gs is sooo tempting.
Enjoy,
Steven
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### Author:  [@alaricthegoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alaricthegoth)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/39 "2004-04-06T19:39:35Z")
tempting, but how to collect from Vancouver?
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### Author:  [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)
#### Post date: [April 6, 2004, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-they-stonewall-the-9-11-report-can-they-hold-the-election/238452/40 "2004-04-06T20:10:04Z")
> [@alaricthegoth](#):
>
> I am nonplussed, not to say dismayed, that no one seems to agree with my underlying message-- that the electorate will predictably rise like a wounded beast to savage the republicans for trying to sell such a steamy pile of bullshit…
Go read the messages from **Clothahump** and **wonderwench** and **Brutus** again. Some people _will_ cheerily swallow whatever Bushit this administration feeds them…
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