# If we had a multiparty system in America, which party would you support? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [November 2, 2004, 12:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462 "2004-11-02T00:47:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/41 "2004-11-02T17:40:13Z")
> [@OtakuLoki](#): > > Sorry, I was actually just trying to make a pun, not accusing of anything improper. My apologies for not making that clear. > > Seriously, there are levels of activism out there. Some of it is very good: The models used by MADD, SADD, or the alliance of people pushing for ‘Timothy’s Law’ here in NYS are good, to the point, and low-key enough that they sound reasonable, not strident. Then you get some of it where… they’re the next best thing to terrorist groups. Frankly, I think PeTA’s links to ALF and ELF do make it a terrorist group. But, because they’re so outrageous, and have enough brain dead celebs mindwashed, they can keep their message in the minds of people. What they don’t seem to be able to realize is that their actions actually alienate the very people they should be trying to woo: Those who don’t have a strong conviction one way or the other on their issue. > > Again, sorry for not making my attempt at humor more clear, **Candid Gamera**. Well, heck, there’re so many political terms out there these days that one never can tell what is and isn’t one. I yearn for the bygone age of Whigs and Tories. (No, not really.) But you and I seem to see eye to eye on the activism thing. The ones like MADD and SADD - they don’t throw red paint on people or blow up buildings, and they have a purpose that lots of people can get behind. (I mean, are there any Mothers FOR Drunk Driving?) They’re mainly there to educate. ---
**Author:** ![Strainger](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/strainger/32/244_2.png) [@Strainger](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strainger)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/42 "2004-11-02T18:00:12Z")
I’ll say Independence first, Libertarian second. (Some of the responses here are _way_ too serious. Look at the forum, people!) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 6:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/43 "2004-11-02T18:25:06Z")
> [@Strainger](#): > > (Some of the responses here are _way_ too serious. Look at the forum, people!) So? It’s a very serious topic. I would have put it in GD, but it’s more in the nature of a poll than a debate. ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/44 "2004-11-02T20:01:40Z")
> [@CandidGamera](#): > > But you and I seem to see eye to eye on the activism thing. The ones like MADD and SADD - they don’t throw red paint on people or blow up buildings, and they have a purpose that lots of people can get behind. (I mean, are there any Mothers FOR Drunk Driving?) They’re mainly there to educate. I agree. Well, except for that last sentence… I think I’m a bit older than you and I remember the way that MADD, especially, helped to turn drunk driving from a socially acceptable thing to a crime with social costs. Both groups, now, are mostly educational. But for a while they were viewed as the lunatic fringe. ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/45 "2004-11-02T20:19:01Z")
> [@OtakuLoki](#): > > I agree. Well, except for that last sentence… I think I’m a bit older than you and I remember the way that MADD, especially, helped to turn drunk driving from a socially acceptable thing to a crime with social costs. Both groups, now, are mostly educational. But for a while they were viewed as the lunatic fringe. Wow - yeah, you must be. I can’t imagine an era where drunken driving would be socially acceptable. “Let’s see - half-ton steel four-wheeled chariot of flaming-death-to-be - check. Vodka - check. Let’s roll!” For the record, I’m 26. ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/46 "2004-11-02T20:36:40Z")
> [@CandidGamera](#): > > Wow - yeah, you must be. I can’t imagine an era where drunken driving would be socially acceptable. > > “Let’s see - half-ton steel four-wheeled chariot of flaming-death-to-be - check. Vodka - check. Let’s roll!” > > For the record, I’m 26. Sadly, until the 80’s that’s exactly what drunk driving was: socially acceptable. Against the law, but no more of a problem for the person found doing it, than speeding, really. Sentencing for drunk driving convictions was similarly lenient. Part of the reasoning behind it seemed to be a lot of ‘there but for Og go I’ on the part of judges, prosecuters, and neighbors. When MADD started, in 1980, the idea of treating drunk drivers like **real** criminals was a radical departure. I remember watching as their advocacy changed the attitudes and the laws. At the time it seemed to be glacially slow. But within 10 years they’d achieved a huge change in the social code. Wow. ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/47 "2004-11-02T20:38:32Z")
> [@CandidGamera](#): > > For the record, I’m 26. For your record, I’m 36, just ten years older. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/48 "2004-11-02T20:49:17Z")
Given the choices, it’d be a toss-up between Independence, Progressive, and Labor for me. I don’t mind big government and more taxes as long as it’s socially progressive and somewhat competently run. Anything left of the current political mainstream is fine by me. ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/49 "2004-11-02T20:57:58Z")
> [@OtakuLoki](#): > > Sadly, until the 80’s that’s exactly what drunk driving was: socially acceptable. Against the law, but no more of a problem for the person found doing it, than speeding, really. Sentencing for drunk driving convictions was similarly lenient. Part of the reasoning behind it seemed to be a lot of ‘there but for Og go I’ on the part of judges, prosecuters, and neighbors. When MADD started, in 1980, the idea of treating drunk drivers like **real** criminals was a radical departure. I remember watching as their advocacy changed the attitudes and the laws. > > At the time it seemed to be glacially slow. But within 10 years they’d achieved a huge change in the social code. Wow. Getting the subject of drunk driving on an episode of _Quincy_ really helped. ---
**Author:** ![Kyyrewyyoae](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Kyyrewyyoae](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyyrewyyoae)\ **Post date:** [November 2, 2004, 11:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/50 "2004-11-02T23:03:59Z")
I’m Libertarian all the way. I’ve usually voted Republican but neocons sicken me. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2004, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/51 "2004-11-03T18:34:00Z")
Here’s a bit of new relevant to this thread: Instant runoff voting just had its first major trial run in the U.S., the San Francisco municipal elections. There were a few glitches, but on the whole, IRV seems to have worked out just fine. From the _San Francisco Chronicle,_ [http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2004/11/03/BAGPN9KOG41.DTL](http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2004/11/03/BAGPN9KOG41.DTL). Congressman Jesse Jackson, Jr. (D-Ill.) has introduced a bill to conduct all federal elections by IRV – [http://www.fairvote.org/irv/jacksonirvbill.htm](http://www.fairvote.org/irv/jacksonirvbill.htm). Will the idea spread? ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2004, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/52 "2004-11-03T18:39:34Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Here’s a bit of new relevant to this thread: Instant runoff voting just had its first major trial run in the U.S., the San Francisco municipal elections. There were a few glitches, but on the whole, IRV seems to have worked out just fine. From the _San Francisco Chronicle,_ [http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2004/11/03/BAGPN9KOG41.DTL](http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/chronicle/archive/2004/11/03/BAGPN9KOG41.DTL). Congressman Jesse Jackson, Jr. (D-Ill.) has introduced a bill to conduct all federal elections by IRV – [http://www.fairvote.org/irv/jacksonirvbill.htm](http://www.fairvote.org/irv/jacksonirvbill.htm). Will the idea spread? I’d been about to point out the Cambridge, MA City council voting having been in place for years, but that’s Proportional Voting, not IRV. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 3, 2004, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/53 "2004-11-03T22:54:49Z")
> [@OtakuLoki](#): > > I’d been about to point out the Cambridge, MA City council voting having been in place for years, but that’s Proportional Voting, not IRV. So, what’s the practical effect of that? Does Cambridge have a multipartisan City Council? ---
**Author:** ![OtakuLoki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ac8455/32.png) [@OtakuLoki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OtakuLoki)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 3:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/54 "2004-11-04T03:13:01Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > So, what’s the practical effect of that? Does Cambridge have a multipartisan City Council? I’m not sure, and thier website ([here](http://www.cambridgema.gov/ccouncil.cfm) ) doesn’t list party affiliation. However, given that Cambridge is home to Hahvahd, MIT, and a few other rather outspoken institutions of higher learning, I’d not be surprised if an accurate polling of candidates in the city leads to a single party council. ---
**Author:** ![Leonard](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a6a055/32.png) [@Leonard](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leonard)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 4:07am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/55 "2004-11-04T04:07:46Z")
It would have to be Libertarian or Indepenence. I guess it would depend on how the existing Libertarian Party reacted to the possibility of actually doing something besides campaigning. My cynical nature leads me to believe they would continue to court the fringes and shoot themselves in the foot. So I guess Independence then Libertarian. ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/56 "2004-11-04T13:22:05Z")
To which of these would Ross Perot belong? ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/57 "2004-11-04T14:55:40Z")
> [@CandidGamera](#): > > To which of these would Ross Perot belong? Independence, probably, but it’s a tough call. The Reform Party never had any clear ideology because it was an unstable coalition of two discontented shutout groups: paleoconservative nativist-isolationist populists like Pat Buchanan, and progressives (in the early-20th-Century Teddy Roosevelt sense, not the modern left-liberal sense) like John Anderson. ---
**Author:** ![CandidGamera](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/candidgamera/32/2878_2.png) [@CandidGamera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CandidGamera)\ **Post date:** [November 4, 2004, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/58 "2004-11-04T15:20:04Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Independence, probably, but it’s a tough call. The Reform Party never had any clear ideology because it was an unstable coalition of two discontented shutout groups: paleoconservative nativist-isolationist populists like Pat Buchanan, and progressives (in the early-20th-Century Teddy Roosevelt sense, not the modern left-liberal sense) like John Anderson. Teddy Roosevelt was cool. Okay, was just curious. ---
**Author:** ![rippingtons\_fan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rippingtons_fan/32/11767_2.png) [@rippingtons\_fan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rippingtons_fan)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/59 "2004-11-05T02:03:33Z")
> [@Tuckerfan](#): > > What was it Roy Rogers said? “I’m not a member of any organized political party. I’m a Democrat.” IIRC. > > I’d probably go Libertarian, then Independance, and the Democrat. You must mean Will Rogers! [http://www.willrogers.org/](http://www.willrogers.org/) ---
**Author:** ![Tuckerfan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/eada6e/32.png) [@Tuckerfan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tuckerfan)\ **Post date:** [November 5, 2004, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462/60 "2004-11-05T02:08:24Z")
> [@rippingtons\_fan](#): > > You must mean Will Rogers! > [http://www.willrogers.org/](http://www.willrogers.org/) Yup. Dunno how I got them confused. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-had-a-multiparty-system-in-america-which-party-would-you-support/272462.md?page=4)