# If we MUST have a leader bent on world domination ... **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [February 10, 2005, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455 "2005-02-10T20:25:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Inigo\_Montoya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/inigo_montoya/32/124_2.png) [@Inigo\_Montoya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Inigo_Montoya)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2005, 8:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/1 "2005-02-10T20:25:39Z")
Can we at least get one with a pair of BALLS? All the sabre rattling we did at Iraq, and are doing at Iran & N.Korea, and the evil glances we cast at Syria, Canada, Mexico, Cuba, Saudi, Jordan, Liverpool…What is all that? The whole damned planet knows where the U.S. leadership is heading, why drag it out? It’s too expensive to strike & occupy, and it kills our guys. Condie: "Now lookie here N. Korea, if you keep up with this, you’ll be isolated [some more](http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/asiapcf/02/10/nkorea.talks/index.html). And you too Iran! Just put those filthy nukes down and step away from the stockpile. Or else. " Yeah, or else what? Or else we’ll smack your country upside the head anyway? Like we did to Saddam…you should be thankful we got him off you back doorstep, nevermind who put him there in the first place. Now hand over the oil & tahini like the good little bootlickers we might let you be. We got TONS of nukes just rotting away, a world that doesn’t trust us anyway, and apparently we also have an agenda that includes smacking down anyone who dares aproach us at the top of the hill. We haven’t been about “human rights” since Carter packed his bags in the 70s, why not just take off the mask and admit it–we want to run the world and enslave it in various flavors from outright oppression to political/financial extortion. The honesty would be refreshing. Old Kim waving nukes in our face? Didn’t anyone ever tell him the first rule of concealed carry: the only time someone knows you’ve got a weapon is when they’re seeing the muzzle flash! Show the little bitch what a REAL nuke power is capable of. Iran wants to keep nuke weapons open as an option? Let’s send a few to their leadership too. House of Sod? They’re up to no good, coy bastards, let’s sterilize the place and move Nabisco over there–only a few degrees more than the ambient temerature and you can bake all the goodies you want–think of the energy savings! The world will turn against us? Big whoop. Bring the boys back home, seal up the borders give the cops some better guns and some REAL power–we’ll be safe from the foreigners! Honestly, has NOBODY in the Whitehouse ever played Risk? Allies are a waste of time. Just set your borders, attack the threats, expand your turf. Any populations rise up from within, squish it and behead any news execs that allow it to air. What’s so damned hard about that? Shit. At least nobody can call us anything but ruthless, and when hasn’t that been a quality held in awe by history? Come on Mr. Bush, I just can’t respect a man who won’t out with his agenda and stand behind it. Stop pissing down my back and telling me it’s raining! ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 6:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/2 "2005-02-11T06:57:29Z")
Bush’s mouth is writing checks that the American military can’t cash, I fear. ---
**Author:** ![GaWd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f08c70/32.png) [@GaWd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaWd)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 7:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/3 "2005-02-11T07:47:40Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > Bush’s mouth is writing checks that the American military can’t cash, I fear. I fear it as well. But try explaining that to some of the more…erm, rabid Boardmembers, and real life people and see what it gets you. Hell, if we can make it through Bush II without another major attack against our people I’ll consider us lucky. Sam ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/4 "2005-02-11T12:33:11Z")
Well like I’ve said before, these assholes write the checks, and the people in DC and NY cash them in with their lives. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 12:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/5 "2005-02-11T12:57:28Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > Well like I’ve said before, these assholes write the checks, and the people in DC and NY cash them in with their lives. Yup. ☹ Just look at all the people in DC and NY who the terrorists killed after we invaded Afghanistan and Iraq. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 1:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/6 "2005-02-11T13:41:10Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > Yup. ☹ > > Just look at all the people in DC and NY who the terrorists killed after we invaded Afghanistan and Iraq. You posted 5 years too early. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/7 "2005-02-11T13:59:54Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > You posted 5 years too early. So we’re allowed to invent the future to justify argument we make in the present? SWEET!!! In that case, there won’t be any repurcussions in five years, because in 3 years we’re gonna be invaded by aliens that resemble large art-deco hedgehogs made of tin! They’ll go door-to-door selling overpriced vacuum cleaners, then crown George W the First Emporer of the Earth before leaving. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/8 "2005-02-11T14:09:50Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > So we’re allowed to invent the future to justify argument we make in the present? > > SWEET!!! > > In that case, there won’t be any repurcussions in five years, because in 3 years we’re gonna be invaded by aliens that resemble large art-deco hedgehogs made of tin! They’ll go door-to-door selling overpriced vacuum cleaners, then crown George W the First Emporer of the Earth before leaving. Cute. It’s pretty much a given that there will be repercussions for Iraq, and that NY and DC will be at the top of the target list. The people who voted Bush because they’re concerned about terrorism also happen to be in geographic locations with a very low probability of being hit. It’s easy to write checks your ass won’t cash. ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/9 "2005-02-11T14:15:11Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > Yup. ☹ > > Just look at all the people in DC and NY who the terrorists killed after we invaded Afghanistan and Iraq. Fuck the dead Afghanis, right? Really fuck the dead Iraqi civilians, especially the women and children, right? And especially fuck all the dead Iraqis because Iraq itself had not a single fucking thing to do with the goddamn terrorist attacks on NY or DC. Iraq could not have attacked NY or DC or any other goddamn place on the North American continent on the best day it ever had. The loss of lives of all nationalities in Iraq are justified because the terrorists haven’t attacked NY or DC, is that it? Why the hell should they since we’ve given them plenty of targets right in their own back yard? What does it take to convince you that the invasion of Iraq and the subsequent loss of lives and treasure should have never taken place? Understand: Iraq had **nothing to do** with the goddamn attacks on NY or DC. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/10 "2005-02-11T14:20:29Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > It’s pretty much a given that there will be repercussions for Iraq, and that NY and DC will be at the top of the target list. No, it’s not a given. We invaded Iraq nearly two years ago, and there haven’t been any attacks on US soil yet. _If_ we suceed in starting a democratic government in Iraq, I don’t think it’s even close to a “given” that its going to significantly increase the chance of an attack on the US. > [@World Eater](#): > > The people who voted Bush because they’re concerned about terrorism also happen to be in geographic locations with a very low probability of being hit. Oh come on. That’s a gross oversimplification that ignores the many other ideological divides between the red and blue states and the nature of the presidency as an executive chosen by the country as a whole to represent the country as a whole. > [@World Eater](#): > > It’s easy to write checks your ass won’t cash. Tell that to the red state families of soldiers who’ve died in the war, asshole. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Corrado](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/a88e4f/32.png) [@John\_Corrado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Corrado)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 2:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/11 "2005-02-11T14:24:39Z")
> [@World Eater](#): > > Cute. > > It’s pretty much a given that there will be repercussions for Iraq, and that NY and DC will be at the top of the target list. The people who voted Bush because they’re concerned about terrorism also happen to be in geographic locations with a very low probability of being hit. It’s easy to write checks your ass won’t cash. As a Bush voter who works ten blocks from the Capitol Building, fuck you and your idiotic generalizations. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 2:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/12 "2005-02-11T14:25:10Z")
> [@LouisB](#): > > Fuck the dead Afghanis, right? Really fuck the dead Iraqi civilians, especially the women and children, right? Yes. That’s exactly what I meant when I refuted **World Eater** ’s assertion that people in NY and DC would be dying because of the war in Iraq. Exactly. Wish I could follow arguments that well. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/13 "2005-02-11T14:55:23Z")
> [@](#): > > It’s pretty much a given that there will be repercussions for Iraq, and that NY and DC will be at the top of the target list. I strongly disagree with this. They attacked US, we are fighting back, and yes I do belive Iraq was in on it, and no you can’t convince me otherwise. There have been terrorist atempts since the attacks on 9-11, and they will continue to try, and may succede, but we have disrupted their command and control, which puts us in a much stronger position. I have no doubt that when they pull off a sucessfull attack they will claim it was becasue of Iraq, but they are just using our own media against us. If we treated 9-11 as a police matter, like the 1st WTC attack, I have no doubt they would also keep trying. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/14 "2005-02-11T14:56:21Z")
> [@Metacom](#): > > No, it’s not a given. We invaded Iraq nearly two years ago, and there haven’t been any attacks on US soil yet. _If_ we suceed in starting a democratic government in Iraq, Even _If_ we succeed, (we won’t btw) it’s not going to magically erase all the ill will we’ve brought on ourselves. > [@](#): > > I don’t think it’s even close to a “given” that its going to significantly increase the chance of an attack on the US. If you don’t think all our sabre rattling will increase our likelyhood of being attacked from someone I have a bridge I’d like to sell you. > [@](#): > > Oh come on. That’s a gross oversimplification that ignores the many other ideological divides between the red and blue states and the nature of the presidency as an executive chosen by the country as a whole to represent the country as a whole. No it’s not. They do a poll down in Florida and 65% of the people are worried about terror attack, so they vote for Bush, because he’ll protect them. Someone ought to tell them that nobody is going to attack Orlando, so don’t worry about it. > [@](#): > > Tell that to the red state families of soldiers who’ve died in the war, asshole. Tell that to Bush who sent them. We didn’t have a choice of getting hit on 9/11. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/15 "2005-02-11T14:58:20Z")
> [@John Corrado](#): > > As a Bush voter who works ten blocks from the Capitol Building, fuck you and your idiotic generalizations. So it’s untrue that many people that were/are worried about terrorism live in places that will never get attacked? You think that’s air your breathing? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/16 "2005-02-11T15:07:52Z")
My ire was raised by the attempt to tie the invasion of Iraq to the lack of attacks on US soil by terrorists. Iraq and terrorists are not and never were the same thing. If, and it is a mighty big if, the invasion of Iraq prevented or delayed terrorist attacks on US soil, it is only because the terrorists now have plenty to do closer to home. That said, I do hope with all my soul that Al Queda and / or other terrorist groups hit their homerun ball on 9/11 and that there will never be a repeat of that day. Afghanistan, however, is pacified except in the vast majority of the place that is ruled by various warlords who derive their income and strength through trafficing in opium. I will readily admit that opium peddling warlords are a big improvement on the Taliban, most of whom have joined the warlords and are thus no longer in complete control. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/17 "2005-02-11T15:16:31Z")
Hmmmm. We invaded Iraq because they attacked us? Got it. I thought it was the Bin Laden boys. After that it was all about the Iraqi WMD (which our own CIA says never existed). Finally it was about freedom. No, it was about a Bush family feud and was built on lies. It was led by a “war president” who started the wars, but in his time was an AWOL “air guard” draft dodger, and whose VP “had other priorities” when it would have been his turn in the barrel. You people are too stupid or blind to notice the story keeps changing. We were all about freedom and justice. So, we started Gitmo, escalated Abu Graib, and justified torture to spread justices and goodness and light. Got it Sending soldiers over there for the above listed “reasons” is OK. Even though they were ill equipped and inadquately supplied (go with what you’ve got) and with no plan, direction, or exit plan. Extending their tours because they are over-extended is OK. Blowing a chance to actually get the Big Bad OBL is OK too. Let’s just get more of our own folks killed anyway. If they make it back, let’s just send them over there again and hey let’s try cutting their benefits too. Now, we’re rattling our sabres at Iran too. With a military that is already fucked up by our leaders, against a country that may be willing to literally fight to the death. We are also pressuring a North Korean lunatic who does have nukes and is crazy enough to use them. There were lots of terror alerts of all kinds of pretty colors right before the election. Afterwards, NONE. Plus, we had a nice little “vote for us or the boogie man will kill you” blurb from Darth Cheney. And a lion’s share of anti-terror funding went to Cheney’s home state. while the cities that got hit, or may get hit got shortchanged. You partisan hacks are even more damn stupid than I thought. I’m amazed. ---
**Author:** ![Phatlewt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a698b9/32.png) [@Phatlewt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Phatlewt)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/18 "2005-02-11T15:25:44Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > I strongly disagree with this. They attacked US, we are fighting back, and yes I do belive Iraq was in on it, and no you can’t convince me otherwise. If I can’t convince you otherwise, can [The 911 Comission report](http://www.9-11commission.gov/staff_statements/staff_statement_15.pdf)? (Staff Statement No. 15, p. 5) > [@](#): > > Bin Ladin also explored possible cooperation with Iraq during his time in Sudan, despite his opposition to Hussein’s secular regime. Bin Ladin had in fact at one time sponsored anti-Saddam Islamists in Iraqi Kurdistan. The Sudanese, to protect their own ties with Iraq, reportedly persuaded Bin Ladin to cease this support and arranged for contacts between Iraq and al Qaeda. A senior Iraqi intelligence officer reportedly made three visits to Sudan, finally meeting Bin Ladin in 1994. Bin Ladin is said to have requested space to establish training camps, as well as assistance in procuring weapons, but Iraq apparently never responded. There have been reports that contacts between Iraq and al Qaeda also occurred after Bin Ladin had returned to Afghanistan, but they do not appear to have resulted in a collaborative relationship. Two senior Bin Ladin associates have adamantly denied that any ties existed between al Qaeda and Iraq. We have no credible evidence that Iraq and al Qaeda cooperated on attacks against the United States. But if the findings of the comission (hand-picked by President Bush) can’t convince you, then you’re a lost cause anyways. You go on believing that Iraq was behind the 9/11 attacks, and go on believing in the Easter Bunny. ---
**Author:** ![GaWd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/f08c70/32.png) [@GaWd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GaWd)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 3:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/19 "2005-02-11T15:35:20Z")
> [@kanicbird](#): > > I strongly disagree with this. They attacked US, we are fighting back, and yes I do belive Iraq was in on it, and no you can’t convince me otherwise. There have been terrorist atempts since the attacks on 9-11, and they will continue to try, and may succede, but we have disrupted their command and control, which puts us in a much stronger position. > > I have no doubt that when they pull off a sucessfull attack they will claim it was becasue of Iraq, but they are just using our own media against us. If we treated 9-11 as a police matter, like the 1st WTC attack, I have no doubt they would also keep trying. You fucking dumbfuck. After everything that has come out contrary to your wonderfully intelligent position, how can you still believe something so assinine? It’s good to see you with your head buried up to your shoulders in middle-eastern sands. People like you are the reason we’re in the mess we’re in now. Until such time as you can be convinced, take heart in the content of my sig line, ust for you: ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2005, 3:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455/20 "2005-02-11T15:39:08Z")
Anyway, if you really want to know if the Prez has any balls, try re-watching that old video of him and McCain. The one where McCain calls him on one of his smear campaigns. Bush couldn’t even look him in the eye. That says it all right there. NO BALLS. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-we-must-have-a-leader-bent-on-world-domination/289455.md?page=2)