# If you saw a miracle tomorrow **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 11, 2010, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792 "2010-06-11T13:19:38Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2010, 9:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/61 "2010-06-11T21:26:31Z")
> [@Marmite\_Lover](#): > > Jews killed him. Couldn’t have seen that coming. Of course, if some super-powered being claimed that the Jews killed Jesus, it would show that he was a liar and not to be trusted in general, regardless of whether or not kryptonite had en effect on him. ---
**Author:** ![Cyningablod](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9fc29f/32.png) [@Cyningablod](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyningablod)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2010, 9:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/62 "2010-06-11T21:28:14Z")
Many folks have already answered along the same lines as I would answer **Marmite Lover** ’s hypothetical in the OP: I’d wonder how the levitation/descent trick had been done. See, I know that magic tricks and special effects exist. I do NOT know–and am extremely skeptical–that gods, least of all the Bible God, exist. So I would yawn, and wait for James Randi or Michael Shermer to replicate the whole thing at Dodgers Stadium next week. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2010, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/63 "2010-06-11T21:37:42Z")
> [@The\_Hamster\_King](#): > > You can easily imagine exactly what this would be like. Just picture a god YOU don’t believe in showing up and doing exactly the same thing. > > You’re watching a soccer game on TV and suddenly the winged serpent Quetzalcoatl flies down out of the sky and lands on the pitch. He announces to everyone that the only true gods are the gods of the ancient Aztecs. Judaism, Christianity, Islam … all the other religions are meaningless bunk. > > They’ve been biding their time for the last 500 years deciding how to punish humanity for rejecting them, but now they’re back and they’re pissed. Anyone who doesn’t immediately worship them will be ritually killed. > > What do you do, **Marmite Lover**? Do you abandon your current beliefs and bow down to your true gods? I would do the only reasonable thing a person could do. I’d grab my obsidian knife, subdue the nearest human being I could find, cut his heart out, and offer it, still beating, to the Gods!! ---
**Author:** ![Frodo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/frodo/32/302_2.png) [@Frodo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Frodo)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2010, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/64 "2010-06-11T21:53:48Z")
why, I’ll call the GodBusters, obviously ---
**Author:** ![Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Attack_from_the_3rd_dimension)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2010, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/65 "2010-06-11T21:57:37Z")
My man **AClockworkMelon’s** [thread=561663] thread about knocking off a God. [/thread]. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2010, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/66 "2010-06-11T22:30:25Z")
Why do people pretend that they can’t imagine a crazy scenario? Just because you don’t believe in God, doesn’t mean you can’t pretend that Jesus just dropped out of the sky. And if you can’t pretend that, what is the point of posting in a thread that wants you to pretend that? ---
**Author:** ![Cyningablod](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/9fc29f/32.png) [@Cyningablod](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cyningablod)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2010, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/67 "2010-06-11T22:36:43Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Why do people pretend that they can’t imagine a crazy scenario? Just because you don’t believe in God, doesn’t mean you can’t pretend that Jesus just dropped out of the sky. And if you can’t pretend that, what is the point of posting in a thread that wants you to pretend that? The point is to try to help **Marmite Lover** understand that the hypothetical scenario s/he posited is not anything that any of us will ever have to worry about. It is laughably ridiculous on its face, and is not at all the sort of challenge to atheists that s/he obviously thinks it is. Besides, nobody here said that they “can’t imagine” it. They simply refused to play into **Marmite** ’s thinly-veiled theistic _argumentum ad baculum_, preferring instead to call him/her out on the stupidity of the proposed scenario. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2010, 10:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/68 "2010-06-11T22:59:46Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Why do people pretend that they can’t imagine a crazy scenario? Just because you don’t believe in God, doesn’t mean you can’t pretend that Jesus just dropped out of the sky. And if you can’t pretend that, what is the point of posting in a thread that wants you to pretend that? I can imagine it; I just can’t take it seriously. Not to mention that pages of responses that boil down to “well, the universe is controlled by an invincible, mind reading evil being, so I burn forever” are boring and depressing. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [June 11, 2010, 11:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/69 "2010-06-11T23:10:05Z")
No, I love all of the hilarious, over the top mockery. I think that is funny as hell. I’m talking about serious responses like this: > [@Leaffan](#): > > But see, the thing is, as atheists, we absolutely know this isn’t going to happen. At all. Ever. We never think in these fantastical terms. It doesn’t cross our minds. We don’t consider it. At all. Ever. End of story. > > I am a mammal. A mammal with the ability to speak, and to reason. That’s all I am. I’m not part of a grander plan. I’m a hairless ape typing at a keyboard and in 30-odd years, if all goes as planned, I will become a bag of fertilizer. That’s all there is to it. Nothing else. In the mean time I will be kind to my fellow hairless apes and treat them as I would want to be treated. Which you have to admit, Cyningablod, definitely _is_ stating that he can’t (or won’t) imagine it. ---
**Author:** ![Properties\_of\_Iron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/7cd45c/32.png) [@Properties\_of\_Iron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Properties_of_Iron)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2010, 5:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/70 "2010-06-12T05:33:51Z")
Well, given that any simple “illusionist” can perform a levitation trick, I wouldn’t be convinced. As for the images of hell, have you seen Avatar? High definition completely fictional entities. If James Cameron can do it, why should I believe this new guy? Wait a minute…Jesus Christ…James Cameron…J.C. I have seen hell, and it is Pandora! ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2010, 6:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/71 "2010-06-12T06:28:53Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Why do people pretend that they can’t imagine a crazy scenario? Just because you don’t believe in God, doesn’t mean you can’t pretend that Jesus just dropped out of the sky. And if you can’t pretend that, what is the point of posting in a thread that wants you to pretend that? I think that many such answers came from this sentence in the OP : > [@](#): > > I just cannot get my head around anyone who doesn’t believe in God and am wondering if they actually ever think this might happen and what they would do if it did. ---
**Author:** ![firstname](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7ab992/32.png) [@firstname](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/firstname)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2010, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/72 "2010-06-12T06:33:46Z")
I’d be skeptical, If god and jesus want to come have a few beers and explain that they’re real I’d be happy to listen, I’d certainly want them to explain why I should worship them though. I’m an atheist because there is no evidence, if there was evidence i’d be happy to reassess my beliefs, but i still don’t think i’d become a christian or join a religion. ---
**Author:** ![monavis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e0b2c6/32.png) [@monavis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monavis)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2010, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/73 "2010-06-12T12:24:17Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > Oddly enough, **kanicbird** ’s got the best answer. Just because someone shows up claiming that they’re God, and able to exhibit what appears to be god-like abilities, it does not automatically follow that they’re the deity mentioned in the Bible. Even if we are able to completely rule out human charlatans, there’s still the possibility that we’re dealing with A) aliens running some sort of scam B) supernatural, but not deific, entities misrepresenting their nature, C) actual gods, but not the god of the New Testament, trying to mislead us about the nature of the NT god, or D) the actual God of the New Testament, trying to mislead us about the nature of the universe. I wonder why kanicbird’s god has to judge anyone if he knows all things, and knew ahead of time how they would turn out! Does this God get a kick out of creating a being with flaws, then punish them because of it? ---
**Author:** ![Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Attack_from_the_3rd_dimension)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2010, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/74 "2010-06-12T12:31:56Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > I would do the only reasonable thing a person could do. I’d grab my obsidian knife, subdue the nearest human being I could find, cut his heart out, and offer it, still beating, to the Gods!! Would somebody like to swap seats with me? Please? ---
**Author:** ![Love\_Rhombus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/love_rhombus/32/10694_2.png) [@Love\_Rhombus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Love_Rhombus)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2010, 3:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/75 "2010-06-12T15:05:31Z")
> [@pedescribe](#): > > Man, that’d make an awesome premise for a book. Chapter 1: Jesus rises again, tells us the rapture is upon us, asserts that he can lead us to heaven…and an angry atheist kills him before he can finish. Now what? > > Or they could make it a disaster movie–sort of a Christian _2012_. That would be a great twist for a remake of The Warriors. ---
**Author:** ![Nzinga\_Seated](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/b5ac83/32.png) [@Nzinga\_Seated](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nzinga_Seated)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2010, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/76 "2010-06-12T15:15:52Z")
> [@clairobscur](#): > > I think that many such answers came from this sentence in the OP : Ah. I see, clairobscur. Leaffan’s answer makes more sense in that context. I think that kind of sentence would encourage some defensive answers, and I did read the OP and don’t know how I missed that sentence. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Understander](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3da27b/32.png) [@The\_Understander](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Understander)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2010, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/77 "2010-06-12T15:24:53Z")
Pfft. Might as well ask our reactions if Candle Jack turned out to be real (which, as we know, is complete nonse ---
**Author:** ![Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@Attack\_from\_the\_3rd\_dimension](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Attack_from_the_3rd_dimension)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2010, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/78 "2010-06-12T16:42:40Z")
They’re dropping like flies. Can I have his seat? ---
**Author:** ![Mijin](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mijin/32/9369_2.png) [@Mijin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mijin)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2010, 5:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/79 "2010-06-12T17:36:48Z")
> [@Nzinga\_Seated](#): > > Why do people pretend that they can’t imagine a crazy scenario? Just because you don’t believe in God, doesn’t mean you can’t pretend that Jesus just dropped out of the sky. And if you can’t pretend that, what is the point of posting in a thread that wants you to pretend that? Amen. It’s a _what if_ people! I’m an atheist, but I can answer the _what if_; heck, I could answer “What if pi were actually found to be exactly 3?”. * * * So anyway, my answer is that I’m not sure I could ever believe what I was seeing. Many of the properties of god, particularly as depicted in the “Abrahamaic” faiths, are irrational, contradictory and fit the pattern of (human-invented) myths IMO. So I’d assume it was a trick, or I’ve lost my mind, or the world is a simulation etc. If there is fire raining from the sky, rivers of blood etc, I’d probably be shit-scared and I’d say whatever Mr God wants. But privately, I’d still reject it; it would still make no sense to me. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [June 12, 2010, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792/80 "2010-06-12T17:56:33Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > No, because it’s sufficiently ridiculous that hallucination, special effects or a prank by aliens are all more plausible. What would it take to convince you that the Flying Spaghetti Monster is the One True God? > > And so, no I’m not worried about anything like this happening. Christianity is physically impossible and full of logical contradictions. There’s a better chance my left arm will spontaneously turn into a snake and bite me. > **lines up crosshairs on the back of God’s head** Aim for the bald spot. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-saw-a-miracle-tomorrow/542792.md?page=5)