# If you think the Schiavo case will "backfire" on Republicans, you're a fool **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 23, 2005, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904 "2005-03-23T17:01:32Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 15
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/281 "2005-03-26T00:38:55Z")
> [@rjung](#): > > If she’s just going to shuffle her vote from a Bush to Some Other Republican Politician With A Different Name But The Same Ideals™, that’s not much of a victory. She didn’t say, but I was left with the impression that she is really soured by the current Republican party. I wouldn’t care to guess how she will vote in the future, but she sure sounded fed up today. I consider it a victory because she has always been as rabidly Republican as some of our more hardline members. For her to write such letters to our Republican Governor is akin to an RC Cardinal publically telling the Pope he was dead wrong about birth control. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 1:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/282 "2005-03-26T01:41:14Z")
Which is what I mean by erosion. My own relationship to the Dem party is probably not as relevent as I think, but I’ve pretty much always ended up voting for the Dem. Since I am on the conservative wing of the extreme left, I’m never much excited about my candidate. (Though, in 1968, if you’d told me I would see the day when John Kerry would mount a near-miss campaign for President, I’d have asked what you were smoking and where I could get some.) So my loyalty is vulnerable to erosion, I had a lot of sympathy for the Naderite position in 2000, that the Dems were too much a part of the System, not so much corrupt as compliant. I know for a fact I have parallels amongst Republicans. Indeed, they want to hold the line against the termites of depravity, they don’t want to see Gay Outreach on local cable. On the other, they also don’t want snake-handling Pentecostal Baptists entirely displacing the Old Guard of Episcopalians, Methodists, and the right sort of Catholics and Jews. They’re conservative Christians right down to their socks, but don’t want to see Falwell or Buchanan as ayatollah. Like me, they align themselves with a national party as a compromise. And like me, that compromise is fragile. I can hardly imagine a situation wherein I might vote Republican, but I might not vote Dem. Needless to say, I can certainly understand, and sympathize, with an honest Republican puking his/her guts out behind a tree. ---
**Author:** ![Barbarian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e19adc/32.png) [@Barbarian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barbarian)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 1:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/283 "2005-03-26T13:38:36Z")
There’s an interesting article in today’s [Daily News](http://www.nydailynews.com/front/story/293629p-251302c.html) indicating that the religious right will hold Jeb Bush personally responsible for Terri Schiavo’s death. My favourite quote (regarding Jeb Bush’s decision to finally agree that the law doesn’t allow him to do anything else): > [@](#): > > That wasn’t good enough for Tyler Batteese, 35, a Tampa lawyer demonstrating outside the hospice where Schiavo lay dying. Batteese said Bush should send in the National Guard. “So he gets impeached, so what?” he asked. “At least he could save her for now.” There’s probably some quote about hitching your wagon to two mules, or something like that. Looks like most Americnas are slamming the Republicans for doing too much in this case, and the extremely religious are slamming them for not doing enough. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/284 "2005-03-26T14:32:26Z")
> [@Barbarian](#): > > My favourite quote (regarding Jeb Bush’s decision to finally agree that the law doesn’t allow him to do anything else): > > > [@](#): > > > > That wasn’t good enough for Tyler Batteese, 35, a Tampa lawyer demonstrating outside the hospice where Schiavo lay dying. Batteese said Bush should send in the National Guard. “So he gets impeached, so what?” he asked. “At least he could save her for now.” And a [bit of Googling](http://www.florida-lawyer-search.com/lawyer.jsp/Tyler-E.-Batteese) turns up the fact that Attorney Batteese specializes in “Health Care; Legal Malpractice; Medical Malpractice” and is a cum laude graduate of UMiami Law School. Maybe he needs a few refresher courses? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 4:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/285 "2005-03-26T16:15:25Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > And a [bit of Googling](http://www.florida-lawyer-search.com/lawyer.jsp/Tyler-E.-Batteese) turns up the fact that Attorney Batteese specializes in “Health Care; Legal Malpractice; Medical Malpractice” and is a cum laude graduate of UMiami Law School. > > Maybe he needs a few refresher courses? :dubious: **ETF** , I’m reading that quote as bemoaning the fact that Jeb doesn’t consider Schiavo’s life important enough to break the law (and, apparently, use his mysterious mesmerist powers to convince the Florida National Guard and/or State Police to do the same on his orders), not that he thinks there’s something _within_ the law left for Jeb to do. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/286 "2005-03-26T18:06:22Z")
Yes, **jayjay** , I read it that way too, and find it, shall we say, astonishing that any lawyer, let alone one who practices in those areas of law, would advocate such egregious lawbreaking. The general public may not understand just how offensive to the rule of law that is, but an attorney damn sure should. I consider our legal system, whatever its flaws, to be an essential bulwark against “ends justify the means” anarchism. An independent judiciary that decides based upon law and facts, not upon the will of the mob, is vital to the survival of our society. Advocating the overthrow of a reasoned decision based squarely upon the facts and the law, with all due process affirming the original decision, by force of arms under color of official authority – well, if even the prospect of that doesn’t scare the bejesus out of you, it should. ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/287 "2005-03-26T18:10:42Z")
> [@EddyTeddyFreddy](#): > > Yes, **jayjay** , I read it that way too, and find it, shall we say, astonishing that any lawyer, let alone one who practices in those areas of law, would advocate such eregious lawbreaking. The general public may not understand just how offensive to the rule of law that is, but an attorney damn sure should. > . isnt it a rather big no no for a lawyer to encourage some one to break the law? ---
**Author:** ![joyfool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df788c/32.png) [@joyfool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/joyfool)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/288 "2005-03-26T18:17:43Z")
I so hate it when I forget about a thread then it ends up be way far much further along before I have to go back and follow up. However, I’m tenacious. So, **Abbie** are you still out there? I’d love to hear your responses to my previous questions (even a couple, actually) and I promise to continue a non-judgmental conversation. I’d just like to understand your opinion and what it’s based on. Plus, curiosity will kill this cat. 😃 But I’m looking forward to it. ---
**Author:** ![EddyTeddyFreddy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eddyteddyfreddy/32/18796_2.png) [@EddyTeddyFreddy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/EddyTeddyFreddy)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 6:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/289 "2005-03-26T18:26:43Z")
> [@wring](#): > > isnt it a rather big no no for a lawyer to encourage some one to break the law? One would think so. [Bending it like a pretzel](http://www.freep.com/news/nw/schiavo-bar226e_20050326.htm), however, seems to be just fine with certain Florida officials: > [@](#): > > Hours after a judge ordered Wednesday that Terri Schiavo wasn’t to be removed from her hospice, a team of Florida law-enforcement agents were en route to seize her – but they stopped short when local police told them they would enforce the judge’s order, the Miami Herald reported. > > Agents of the Florida Department of Law Enforcement told police in Pinellas Park, where Schiavo lies at Hospice Woodside, that they were on the way to take her to a hospital to resume her feeding. > > For a brief period Thursday morning, local police, who have officers around the hospice to keep protesters out, prepared for what sources called a showdown. > > \ > > The developments that set Thursday morning’s event in motion began the previous afternoon, when the governor and DCF chief Lucy Hadi announced they were considering sheltering Schiavo under the state’s adult protection law. The department has been besieged, officials say, by thousands of calls alleging Schiavo is the victim of abuse or neglect. > > Pinellas County Circuit Judge George Greer signed an order Wednesday afternoon forbidding the department from “taking possession of Theresa Marie Schiavo or removing her” from the hospice. > > But at 8:15 a.m. Thursday, DCF lawyers appealed Greer’s order to judges at the 2nd District Court of Appeal in Lakeland. > > That created time to seize Schiavo. When the agency filed its appeal, it effectively froze the judge’s order. It took nearly three hours before the judge found out and canceled the automatic stay, shortly before 11 a.m. > > According to sources, DCF intended to take Schiavo to Morton Plant Hospital, where her feeding tube had been reinserted in 2003 following a previous judicial order allowing its removal. ---
**Author:** ![DoctorJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctorj/32/2904_2.png) [@DoctorJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DoctorJ)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 6:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/290 "2005-03-26T18:34:13Z")
This is finally starting to bite Jeb in the ass. The nutjobs are finally realizing that if Jeb really believed that everything has to be done, that he’d do it, even if it meant sending in the state troopers or convincing his Bro to send in the National Guard. Bob Schindler was even calling Jeb out for not using his executive powers to save his daughter. It has been clear for some time to most of the country that this has all been poltical posturing, and now even the people he’s been pandering to are starting to realize it. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/291 "2005-03-26T19:03:00Z")
In for a penny, in for a pound? Will some GOPer take a bullet for The Cause (ie. 2008)? Stay tuned… -Joe ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/292 "2005-03-26T19:40:14Z")
> [@Larry Mudd](#): > > I think, based on the rhetoric that these groups are using, it’s unlikely that they’re going to walk away from the argument when she stops breathing. On the contrary, they’re not going to stop at pursuing Michael Schiavo. It’s “judicial homicide,” right? They’re going to sue Schiavo, his attorney, Judge Greer, and anyone else that they feel is responsible.\* They’re not going to sue Mike Schiavo. They’re going to [**kill**](http://edition.cnn.com/2005/US/03/25/arrest.schiavo/) him. For the culture of life. ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 8:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/293 "2005-03-26T20:01:15Z")
This is rapidly becoming a surrealist movie in real life. The local police were preparing for a _showdown_ with state troopers?! It’s like the Florida executive branch is starting a blood feud with the judicial. That none of the loudest “pro-Terri” protestors is seeing the absolute absurdity of the whole thing is telling. ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 9:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/294 "2005-03-26T21:35:03Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > This is rapidly becoming a surrealist movie in real life. The local police were preparing for a _showdown_ with state troopers?! It’s like the Florida executive branch is starting a blood feud with the judicial. That none of the loudest “pro-Terri” protestors is seeing the absolute absurdity of the whole thing is telling. Ends justify the means, omae. They’ll save Terri’s live for the sake of Life no matter how many have to die for the sake of Life. -Joe, born of the thigh of Zeus ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [March 26, 2005, 9:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/295 "2005-03-26T21:50:14Z")
> [@Merijeek](#): > > Ends justify the means, omae. You sound like a Shadowrun sourcebook when you do that, you know. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2005, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/296 "2005-03-27T00:58:28Z")
> [@jayjay](#): > > You sound like a Shadowrun sourcebook when you do that, you know. 😃 Fuck it. Cut out The Awakening and wait 40 years… -Joe ---
**Author:** ![Steve\_MB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/steve_mb/32/5339_2.png) [@Steve\_MB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steve_MB)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2005, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/297 "2005-03-27T02:11:02Z")
> [@Evil Captor](#): > > Like Elucidator, I hope that this will backfire and lead to some serious erosion of their base among fiscal conservatives, but like Apos I don’t think the fiscal conservatives will ever jump ship. It is not necessary to drive them to the point where they “jump ship”. The damage will be done if they’re driven to the point where they’d still vote Republican… if it’s not raining on Election Day, and the lines at the polls aren’t too long, and there’s nothing good on TV, and… ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2005, 2:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/298 "2005-03-27T02:43:37Z")
> [@Evil Captor](#): > > This will get their fundie base thoroughly on their bandwagon for the next election cycle or three, allowing them to be more MOR as the elections approach. As Apos said, it’s good strategy. Like Elucidator, I hope that this will backfire and lead to some serious erosion of their base among fiscal conservatives, but like Apos I don’t think the fiscal conservatives will ever jump ship. But the fundies are going to be furious at the Republicans when she dies in spite of their promises. The signs at the hospice have Jeb Bush’s name on them… ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2005, 2:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/299 "2005-03-27T02:44:04Z")
Seriously, unless this drags on considerably longer or events this next week become much more alarming, I’d bet that 20 months from now on Election Day, your average voter will barely even remember Terry Schiavo. Interviewer, CA 2002 mid-terms: “Elian Gonzalez!” Average voter: “Who?” ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [March 27, 2005, 3:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904/300 "2005-03-27T03:01:29Z")
It’ll be interesting to see what happens now that the legal appeals are exhausted and there’s nothing left to do but wait until she expires. The fad for getting yourself arrested with a water bottle has worn thin since nobody really cares, half the crowd has already gotten that t-shirt and nobody’s even watching anymore. If there’s no attention to be had by it, there’s no longer any point. Calling on Jeb to storm the hospice is a waste of time since he isn’t completely insane and it’s not like hever ever really _cared_ anout this woman. Will the mob stick it out if Terri hangs around for another three or four days? How long will it take before they all get bored and start to drift away? I’m sure a lot of them have to go to work on monday and for all intents and purposes, the show’s over there. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904.md?page=14) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-think-the-schiavo-case-will-backfire-on-republicans-youre-a-fool/295904.md?page=16)