# "If you want to be removed from this mailing list..." **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [August 25, 1999, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-want-to-be-removed-from-this-mailing-list/2892 "1999-08-25T08:21:00Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Satan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9bcb4/32.png) [@Satan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Satan)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 1999, 8:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-want-to-be-removed-from-this-mailing-list/2892/1 "1999-08-25T08:21:00Z")
I hate Spam. I always replied “Remove” when told it would remove me from whatever list I wound up on. Then someone told me that is a scheme to make sure addresses are real. I was told a reply means a verifiable address which is then sold for more Spamming. Anyone have The Straight Dope on this one? * * * Brian O’Neill CMC International Records [rockuniverse.com/cmc/cmc.html](http://rockuniverse.com/cmc/cmc.html) ICQ 35294890 AIM Scrabble1 Yahoo Messenger Brian\_ONeill ---
**Author:** ![TheIncredibleHolg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8797f3/32.png) [@TheIncredibleHolg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheIncredibleHolg)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 1999, 9:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-want-to-be-removed-from-this-mailing-list/2892/2 "1999-08-25T09:43:00Z")
I don’t think they need a reply to verify the address. Wouldn’t they get the mail returned with “user unknown” if an address is wrong? Besides, if you want to be removed, you wouldn’t be the perfect target for _more_ spam, would you? (Not that it matters if they just want to sell addresses. But would the existence of the address matter? If they get paid based on quality, does the quality measure include existence of the address but not interest on the part of the addressee?) A more common problem of mine is that the return address no longer exists when I reply to be removed, even if the original message explicitly stated you could do so. I guess it’s just not worth the effort. ---
**Author:** ![Undead\_Dude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e19adc/32.png) [@Undead\_Dude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Undead_Dude)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 1999, 10:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-want-to-be-removed-from-this-mailing-list/2892/3 "1999-08-25T10:18:00Z")
You can definitely verify that an address is real without getting a reply. For that matter, you don’t even need to send mail to find out. The appropriate mail server will be happy to tell you: telnet [mail.fathom.org](http://mail.fathom.org) 25 220 [borg.fathom.org](http://borg.fathom.org) ESMTP Sendmail 8.8.7/8.8.7; Wed, 25 Aug 1999 06:10:43 -0400 helo avalon 250 [borg.fathom.org](http://borg.fathom.org) Hello [FX4-1-170.mgfairfax.rr.com](http://FX4-1-170.mgfairfax.rr.com) [24.28.198.170], pleased to meet you mail from: [foo@foo.com](mailto:foo@foo.com) 250 [foo@foo.com](mailto:foo@foo.com)… Sender ok rcpt to: [undeaddude@fathom.org](mailto:undeaddude@fathom.org) 250 [undeaddude@fathom.org](mailto:undeaddude@fathom.org)… Recipient ok quit 221 [borg.fathom.org](http://borg.fathom.org) closing connection alternately, I could have gotten rcpt to: [badaddress@fathom.org](mailto:badaddress@fathom.org) 550 [badaddress@fathom.org](mailto:badaddress@fathom.org)… User unknown ---
**Author:** ![TheIncredibleHolg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8797f3/32.png) [@TheIncredibleHolg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheIncredibleHolg)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 1999, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-want-to-be-removed-from-this-mailing-list/2892/4 "1999-08-25T13:08:00Z")
I’m not sure about firewalls, though. ---
**Author:** ![RealityChuck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/realitychuck/32/195_2.png) [@RealityChuck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RealityChuck)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 1999, 1:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-want-to-be-removed-from-this-mailing-list/2892/5 "1999-08-25T13:08:00Z")
Never send the remove message. That just gets you more spam. You can complain to the ISP of the spammer; most have policies against spam. However, there are many ways the spammer can disguise the point of origin. The best tool in this regard is to get Sam Spade ( [http://www.samspade.com](http://www.samspade.com) ), which does a nice of job of analyzing things. You can then complain to the ISP’s abuse address (Be careful. Some of these just add your name to a list and you get double the spame.) Forward a copy of the e-mail (with headers) to the complaint address. You can also send it to [UCE@ftc.gov](mailto:UCE@ftc.gov), to get the Federal Trade Commission involved. If the spam gives a website, use Sam Spade to find the provider and forward the spam; the site will usually be shut down, especially with the various free site (Geocities, Tripod, etc.). ---
**Author:** ![JAlan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/c77e96/32.png) [@JAlan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JAlan)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 1999, 1:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-want-to-be-removed-from-this-mailing-list/2892/6 "1999-08-25T13:21:00Z")
It’s easy to tell that the email you sent made it to a viable email account, but it’s hard to tell if someone actually read it. The account might be abandoned, or a spam checker might have sent your message to a killfile. Responding to the spammer with a “Please remove me from the list” verifies to him (and all the people he’ll be selling your email address to) that you’re listening. ---
**Author:** ![TheIncredibleHolg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8797f3/32.png) [@TheIncredibleHolg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheIncredibleHolg)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 1999, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-want-to-be-removed-from-this-mailing-list/2892/7 "1999-08-25T13:45:00Z")
Couldn’t a spam blocker also send a ‘remove’ message? ---
**Author:** ![torq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/dfb087/32.png) [@torq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/torq)\ **Post date:** [August 25, 1999, 6:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-want-to-be-removed-from-this-mailing-list/2892/8 "1999-08-25T18:13:00Z")
> [@](#): > > Couldn’t a spam blocker also send a ‘remove’ message? It could. Mine used to. However, about 90% of the time, the “remove” address goes to one of those “free email” services, and the remove message will bounce because a) the fre email service has deactivated the account or b) the mailbox is full. Now I’ve just got it set to return a delivery error if it matches any of the spam traps… though, unfortunately, because my email address is used for work, I can’t be as aggressive as I’d like in rejecting stuff (for instance: if it were totally up to me, I wouldn’t get email from any free email service or anywhere in Korea, Brazil, or Hong Kong.) I don’t think the spammers see the delivery errors EITHER in most cases, but it probably gives me a slightly higher chance of being removed as an undeliverable. ---
**Author:** ![Undead\_Dude](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/e19adc/32.png) [@Undead\_Dude](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Undead_Dude)\ **Post date:** [August 30, 1999, 8:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-want-to-be-removed-from-this-mailing-list/2892/9 "1999-08-30T08:48:00Z")
> [@](#): > > I’m not sure about firewalls, though. – TIH Firewalls wouldn’t generally enter into it. A firewalled address wouldn’t really be a valid address anyway-- at least not for the general public. If your mail were to hit a firewall, you’d basically get a series of returns from your mail server along these lines: Could not send mail for 4 hours… Could not send mail for 5 days, removing from queue.