# If you were G.W. Bush, would you issue a blanket pardon of yourself... **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 18, 2008, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872 "2008-04-18T11:59:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![BarnOwl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e95f7d/32.png) [@BarnOwl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BarnOwl)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/1 "2008-04-18T11:59:27Z")
…before you left office? I proposed this idea in a presidential pardon thread, but no one responded. So, I’m asking it in a separate thread. W’s approval of torture might zoom to the top as his primary concern of potential prosecution. I think it would be a diabolical stroke of genius if he pardoned only himself and let the rest of the possible felons in his administration sweat blood. Just wondering. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/2 "2008-04-18T12:28:58Z")
Setting aside any Constitutional questions, why would he pardon an innocent man, especially since he doesn’t think he’s done anything wrong, ever? There would be no better way to guarantee endless inquiries into his Administration after he leaves office than to pardon himself. I think Bush thinks that history will vindicate his Administration. I’m sure he realizes that such a thing could never happen if he tried to preemptively pardon himself or other top officials. I wouldn’t rule out preemptive pardons for lower level folks, like the CIA agents who engaged in the “enhanced interrogation techniques.” ---
**Author:** ![Merijeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f05b48/32.png) [@Merijeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Merijeek)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 12:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/3 "2008-04-18T12:47:55Z")
[QUOTE=Ravenman] Setting aside any Constitutional questions, why would he pardon an innocent man, especially since he doesn’t think he’s done anything wrong, ever? There would be no better way to guarantee endless inquiries into his Administration after he leaves office than to pardon himself. [/QUOTE] Because all them Dem’crat politicians are going to play politics! -Joe ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 12:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/4 "2008-04-18T12:54:06Z")
The question is not “would he” but “can he.” ---
**Author:** ![BarnOwl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e95f7d/32.png) [@BarnOwl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BarnOwl)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/5 "2008-04-18T12:58:39Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] The question is not “would he” but “can he.” [/QUOTE] But why not? It’s not in the spirit of the law, perhaps, but where does it say a prez cannot pardon himself? Not arguing, just asking for information. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/6 "2008-04-18T13:22:32Z")
[QUOTE=BarnOwl] But why not? It’s not in the spirit of the law, perhaps, but where does it say a prez cannot pardon himself? Not arguing, just asking for information. [/QUOTE] It’s an open question. No POTUS has ever tried to pardon himself before. ---
**Author:** ![BarnOwl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e95f7d/32.png) [@BarnOwl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BarnOwl)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/7 "2008-04-18T13:27:52Z")
It would create a firestorm, but Bush could make it stick: > **[The U. S. Government](https://www.thoughtco.com/us-government-4133021)** > > Learn about the form and functions of the US government with detailed articles, extensive study guides, homework helpers, and clear, unbiased analysis of politics and policy. “Keep in mind that the recommendations of the Pardon Attorney to the president are just that – recommendations and nothing more. The president, bound by no higher authority than Article II, Section 2, of the Constitution, is in no way required to follow them and retains the ultimate power to grant or deny clemency.” ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 1:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/8 "2008-04-18T13:42:42Z")
😕 What is it in this thread that Google thinks warrants an “Undo Circumcision Damage” ad at the bottom? ---
**Author:** ![42fish](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/4/b487fb/32.png) [@42fish](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/42fish)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 1:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/9 "2008-04-18T13:49:13Z")
[QUOTE=BrainGlutton] 😕 What is it in this thread that Google thinks warrants an “Undo Circumcision Damage” ad at the bottom? [/QUOTE] Perhaps it’s Google’s way of saying Bush is a dick? (And one who’s lacking something, even.) ---
**Author:** ![Paranoid\_Randroid](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/paranoid_randroid/32/18_2.png) [@Paranoid\_Randroid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Paranoid_Randroid)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/10 "2008-04-18T14:06:27Z")
Now, now. Bush is every bit as satisfying this way, and easier to keep clean. ---
**Author:** ![Napier](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ce73a5/32.png) [@Napier](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Napier)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 2:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/11 "2008-04-18T14:21:24Z")
I predict that most will agree we should look forward and not spend our efforts on the past, and W will be home free. This is because, for some reason, the ideas of punishment and deterrence and protection of the innocent victims which are so obvious that they are the basis of our system of justice have no relevance when the criminal behavior is committed by politicians. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/12 "2008-04-18T15:13:04Z")
[QUOTE=Ravenman] I wouldn’t rule out preemptive pardons for lower level folks, like the CIA agents who engaged in the “enhanced interrogation techniques.” [/QUOTE] Possibly, but Congress has already passed a bill that did that. If they were to rescind that bill, there would be _ex post facto_ issues preventing them from prosecuting the CIA agents. From the OP: > [@](#): > > I think it would be a diabolical stroke of genius if he pardoned only himself and let the rest of the possible felons in his administration sweat blood. Is it your contention that Bush is a diabolical genius? ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/13 "2008-04-18T15:20:32Z")
I hope he does it. Seeing him exposed as the lying little weasel that he is would give me more satisfaction than seeing him in prison. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 3:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/14 "2008-04-18T15:28:15Z")
[QUOTE=BobLibDem] I hope he does it. Seeing him exposed as the lying little weasel that he is would give me more satisfaction than seeing him in prison. [/QUOTE] But let’s say he did. How that expose him as a lying weasel? If he honestly thinks he was right and it would be an injustice to prosecute either himself or anyone else for things like waterboarding, then he’d be entirely consistent to issue a pardon. ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 4:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/15 "2008-04-18T16:00:39Z")
Innocent men don’t pardon themselves. I can see that someone could interpret it as insurance against a kangaroo court. But I think more would see it as an admission of guilt and that his administration isn’t what he has spent eight years promoting it to be. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/16 "2008-04-18T16:09:57Z")
In fact, there is case law on the issue: you don’t have to accept a pardon, because acceptance of it carries an admission of guilt as well as a remission of any criminal liability. Burdick v. U.S. ---
**Author:** ![BarnOwl](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/e95f7d/32.png) [@BarnOwl](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BarnOwl)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 4:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/17 "2008-04-18T16:11:33Z")
[QUOTE=John Mace] Possibly, but Congress has already passed a bill that did that. If they were to rescind that bill, there would be _ex post facto_ issues preventing them from prosecuting the CIA agents. From the OP: Is it your contention that Bush is a diabolical genius? [/QUOTE] No. Rove. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/18 "2008-04-18T16:31:46Z")
[QUOTE=BobLibDem] Innocent men don’t pardon themselves. [/QUOTE] I don’t see why not. If said man thought he was innocent (I think Bush does), and he thought others would go after him for a crime doesn’t believe he committed (many on this board would like to), and if said man could pardon himself, then I don’t think your statement is true. ---
**Author:** ![mlees](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba8739/32.png) [@mlees](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mlees)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 4:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/19 "2008-04-18T16:32:29Z")
I guess I’m being a little slow today, but how can the POTUS pre-emptively pardon himself? Wouldn’t that imply that the POTUS is “above the law”? Isn’t that counter to the intentions of the framers, considering that they built in all kinds of checks and balances to keep the various branches of the government in line (Including those on the Executive Branch)? Wouldn’t, if it were possible, every person who is sworn in as POTUS then, as thier first official act, grant themselves pardons? Heck, even Nixon didn’t pardon himself… ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [April 18, 2008, 4:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872/20 "2008-04-18T16:37:42Z")
[QUOTE=mlees] Heck, even Nixon didn’t pardon himself… [/QUOTE] He didn’t have to-- Ford did. Pre-emptively. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/if-you-were-g-w-bush-would-you-issue-a-blanket-pardon-of-yourself/445872.md?page=2)