# "I'll pray for you." Management Says "Not On My Watch!" **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 3, 2023, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109 "2023-04-03T23:35:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 18\ **Page:** 13
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2023, 3:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/241 "2023-04-11T15:18:42Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > My hypothetical was my attempt to come up with a situation in which Person A does something for Person B that Person B thinks is pointless and useless, yet Person B may still be appreciative or comforted that Person A is doing it, because “it’s the thought that counts.” It was a contrived situation that didn’t really answer the question as to why someone would think that it would be comforting. But anyway… > [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > You may be looking for a closer parallel to the “praying for” situation than what I intended. That would be the subject of the thread, yes. > [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > If you mean “you” generically, to refer to anyone who does tell others they’re praying for them: I don’t know, but I strongly expect it’s different for different people: there’s no one interpretation that applies in all situations. That’s the point. My stock answer for when people foist their prayers on me is to lie and say, “I appreciate it.” and I do my best to keep any hint of sarcasm out of my voice. I _want_ to sound sincere in thanking them, otherwise, they get upset. What reaction do you think I’d get if I was honest and said, “No thank you”, or “Please don’t.”? Or even just didn’t have enough thankfulness in my voice as I respond? Unless you think that I’d get the same reaction from a “Thank you” as to a “no thank you.” then you are aware that they are imposing on me. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2023, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/242 "2023-04-11T15:47:21Z")
> [@k9bfriender](#): > > My stock answer for when people foist their prayers on me is to lie and say, “I appreciate it.” and I do my best to keep any hint of sarcasm out of my voice. I _want_ to sound sincere in thanking them, otherwise, they get upset. > > What reaction do you think I’d get if I was honest and said, “No thank you”, or “Please don’t.”? Or even just didn’t have enough thankfulness in my voice as I respond? I honestly don’t know. And neither do you—unless you know those people better than I do, or are able to pick up on some non-verbal signals they’re giving out, both of which are entirely possible. But, just because some people would get upset because you didn’t sound sufficiently grateful doesn’t mean everyone would. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2023, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/243 "2023-04-11T16:05:18Z")
> [@DSeid](#): > > I don’t think anyone here is claiming that such wishes would cause horrible upset, or that they would do much or anything to act on any offense they received. Whether or not they would think lesser of the person for the remark would depend on what they thought of them before. If anything. > > I more and more think of this as a consent issue. Don’t hug a co-worker without knowing them well enough to know they want a hug, or asking permission first. Don’t impose your religiousity on them without similarly knowing first. “May I include you in my prayers?” , asking permission, is probably okay. Exactly. For both parts of this. > [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > I’m sorry if my hypothetical didn’t work for you, but I thought it was reasonably realistic. I didn’t; because, as I said, it assumes that the person who’s lost the keys is unable to give any reason why they’re not at the other person’s house. I suppose there may be people ditsy enough to say ‘I know they’re not there’ when they have no reason to do so; but the analogy fails because people in this society who are non-religious generally do have reasons to be so, and people who are members of different religions and uncomfortable about possibly being brought up in rituals they believe are wrong have that reason. > [@Cheesesteak](#): > > That’s the trouble with microaggressions. We historically have placed the onus on the receiver (usually a minority or otherwise ‘out group’ person) to charitably interpret the actions of the majority ‘in group’ person. Again, this, exactly. And it only goes one way. ‘You [majority person] are being rude, possibly without realizing it’ is itself considered a rude thing to say. ‘You [minority person] are being rude by challenging my beliefs’ (when the ‘challenge’ is only pointing out that not everyone agrees with them) is considered entirely normal. > [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > I honestly don’t know. And neither do you—unless you know those people better than I do We know some people better than you do. And we don’t always, on every given day, quite possibly multiple times in a given day, want to risk that type of reaction from someone whose reaction we don’t have a good way to judge. People who are grieving may especially not have the spoons to deal with it. The other thing about microaggressions is that they’re generally not things that come up only rarely in one’s life. If that were true, they actually would be trivial. But they come up, in varied forms, over and over and over and it’s exhausting. The person who _asks_ whether it’s OK is signaling that they’re probably a safe person to whom to say ‘no thanks’ or ‘if it comforts you, sure, but I don’t believe that’. The person who just reflexively says they’ll pray for you is signaling that either they assume everyone is their religion and if not they ought to be, in which case their reaction is very likely to be negative; or that they’ve just never thought about it, in which case their reaction is entirely unpredictable. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [April 11, 2023, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/244 "2023-04-11T18:16:32Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Your “message” is aimed at people who perpetrate this behavior (your “generic you”), although I’m not sure there are any such people reading this thread. I agree that there don’t seem to be any. But isn’t it common to use generic “you” and generic “me” to make general statements about hypothetical situations? As in, say, “you touch my Joe Shlabotnik-signed baseball and I’ll poke you in the snoot”, despite the fact that nobody on a digital messageboard can actually touch anybody else’s baseball? That’s all I intended by it. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/245 "2023-04-12T22:13:44Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > This time, he sent out the email, told people to clean out leftovers from the office refrigerators for the long weekend, and finished with… > > > [@](#): > > > > As the priest wrote on the sign outside church > > > > To the Christians, I wish you a good Easter. > > To the Jews, I wish you a good Passover. > > And to the atheists, I wish you good luck Jesus H… that is more offensive than about 3,463 “I’ll pray for yous”. Thats the kind of shit you sue over. It’s about equal to saying “All Muslims (or Jews or Shintos) are worthless barbarians”. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/246 "2023-04-12T22:20:46Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > Thats the kind of shit you sue over. Unfortunately, I suspect he could weasel out of a lawsuit by insisting that he meant it benignly. “What’s wrong with wishing people good luck?” ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 10:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/247 "2023-04-12T22:23:21Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > Thats the kind of shit you sue over. It’s about equal to saying “All Muslims (or Jews or Shintos) are worthless barbarians”. Maybe I’m just incredibly laid back, but I found it rather amusing even though I don’t think it’s appropriate for a manager to send out. That said, I don’t think this alone would be grounds to sue your employer. i.e. Without a pattern of behavior showing a hostile work environment, I don’t think a lawyer would take the case. ---
**Author:** ![I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/i_love_me_vol.i/32/521_2.png) [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/I_Love_Me_Vol.I)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/248 "2023-04-12T22:55:38Z")
Well, I didnt think it through in a lawyer-ly sense–I’m not saying one would have a case. Just that it’s certainly religious, and also inulting. Theres no place for that in a workplace. On a church sign? Sure. But not work. > [@Odesio](#): > > Maybe I’m just incredibly laid back, but I found it rather amusing […] Yeah. It’s kinda clever… in a “Eat shit and die, heathen sub-humans!” kind of way. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [April 12, 2023, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/249 "2023-04-12T23:16:46Z")
> [@I\_Love\_Me\_Vol.I](#): > > Jesus H… that is more offensive than about 3,463 “I’ll pray for yous”. > > Thats the kind of shit you sue over. It’s about equal to saying “All Muslims (or Jews or Shintos) are worthless barbarians”. Would it make you feel better if you knew he was an 80-something old rich lawyer who sits in his office all day watching FOX news and, I guess, counting money? Yeah, probably not. (Remember their freak out over Dr. Seuss? On that Friday, he sent out a little poem “opposing” censorship. It was all I could do to not respond with ‘Fox news rots your brain’) > [@Odesio](#): > > Maybe I’m just incredibly laid back, but I found it rather amusing even though I don’t think it’s appropriate for a manager to send out. That said, I don’t think this alone would be grounds to sue your employer. i.e. Without a pattern of behavior showing a hostile work environment, I don’t think a lawyer would take the case. He does try to be funny. His office door has a sign that says “Financial Aid.” In his office, you sit in old fashioned barber chairs (“take a haircut”…get it?). He’s a guy who founded a law firm 51 years ago and still comes into the office. He’s earned his right to yammer about whatever he wants, I figure. I should be so fortunate. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [April 13, 2023, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/250 "2023-04-13T00:37:51Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > He’s a guy who founded a law firm 51 years ago and still comes into the office. He’s earned his right to yammer about whatever he wants, I figure. Denny Crane! ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [April 14, 2023, 5:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/251 "2023-04-14T17:44:12Z")
> [@RitterSport](#): > > As I said above, it’s really only Christians who say “I’ll pray for you.” My Muslim mother says I’ll pray for you (and she tells me and my family she’s praying for whatever thing is going on in our lives - though I’m Lutheran so it doesn’t bother me any). It’s likely because you are a Christian heavy society. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2023, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/252 "2023-04-17T04:05:12Z")
> [@ISiddiqui](#): > > My Muslim mother says I’ll pray for you (and she tells me and my family she’s praying for whatever thing is going on in our lives - though I’m Lutheran so it doesn’t bother me any). It’s likely because you are a Christian heavy society. Does your mother say this to friends and family primarily, those who most likely are of the same religious persuasion, or does she say this to the general public, people at work etc.? ---
**Author:** ![puzzlegal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puzzlegal/32/3827_2.png) [@puzzlegal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puzzlegal)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2023, 10:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/253 "2023-04-17T10:27:43Z")
> [@Moriarty](#): > > Would it make you feel better if you knew he was an 80-something old rich lawyer who sits in his office all day watching FOX news and, I guess, counting money? > > Yeah, probably not. It makes me more surprised. I would have expected a lawyer, even an old one who watches Fox TV all day, to know better. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2023, 1:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/254 "2023-04-17T13:10:19Z")
Clarence Thomas. 'Nuf said. ---
**Author:** ![Moriarty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moriarty/32/49_2.png) [@Moriarty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moriarty)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2023, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/255 "2023-04-17T13:51:57Z")
> [@puzzlegal](#): > > I would have expected a lawyer, even an old one who watches Fox TV all day, to know better. You’d be disappointed. He was recently talking to me about a disgruntled employee, who happened to be female. He explained to me that when a female employee is unhappy, “99% of the time it’s due to some issue with the home” (actually, she feels underpaid and overworked). Or, when explaining why you need to be sure to charge enough when taking on a client, he’s explained that it’s like the “black preacher. In the black neighborhoods, they want their preacher to wear nice suits and drive a Cadillac. Similarly, your clients want to feel like they’ve hired a prominent lawyer. They’re proud of it.” He also likes to tell the employees how much he and the other partners “love them.” Things like that have always made me uncomfortable, and seem wholly inappropriate for an office. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2023, 2:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/256 "2023-04-17T14:31:50Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > > [@ISiddiqui](#): > > > > My Muslim mother says I’ll pray for you (and she tells me and my family she’s praying for whatever thing is going on in our lives - though I’m Lutheran so it doesn’t bother me any). It’s likely because you are a Christian heavy society. > > Does your mother say this to friends and family primarily, those who most likely are of the same religious persuasion, or does she say this to the general public, people at work etc.? Her friends are mostly Christian, so I guess… similar-ish religious persuasion? She worked as a stay at home mom, so didn’t have an opportunity to offer to pray for co-workers. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 4:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/257 "2023-05-26T04:25:32Z")
My Daughter (Age 6): Who was Jesus (who she probably discovered on YouTube)? Me: Well, Daddy was raised Jewish, so we don’t really learn about Jesus. You want to talk to Mommy or Grammy about that because they are Presbilutherin or something. My Daughter (Age 6): But do you know who he is? Me: As I understand it, you know how on Stranger Things that girl Eleven has all sorts of magic powers and can blow up bad people and evil creatures with her mind and everyone thought she was dead at the end of Season One but then she came back to protect her friends? My Daughter (Age 6): Yeah. Me: Same shit. My Daughter (Age 6): Are you going to Hell because you don’t believe in Jesus? Me: No. At least not because of that. ---
**Author:** ![Snipe70e](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/51bf81/32.png) [@Snipe70e](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snipe70e)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2023, 12:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/258 "2023-05-26T12:24:58Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > > [@Horatius](#): > > > > How would Christians feel about someone saying, “I’ll sacrifice to Baal for you” in such a situation? > > I’m not much of a Christian these days but I’d feel the same as if someone said “I’ll sacrifice a dove at Temple for you”. I’d rather they didn’t. But if they want to offer prayers to whoever/whatever without killing some critters, that’d be nice. As a Christian how would I feel. I would feel that they are going to wish the best for me that they can. Even to many Christian saying I will pray for you is just the same thing as wishing good luck. If I tell someone I will pray for you I will find the time to pray for you. But prayer is not the complete answer. Man in a row boat during a storm and the boat starts taking on water. I believe he should pray, BUT he should also be rowing to shore as hard as he can. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109.md?page=12)