# "I'll pray for you." Management Says "Not On My Watch!" **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [April 3, 2023, 11:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109 "2023-04-03T23:35:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 1:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/101 "2023-04-05T13:40:39Z")
> [@Cheesesteak](#): > > You know what’s actually innocuous? Keeping me out of your religious rituals. I never discuss them with anyone, so you’re safe. LOL ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/102 "2023-04-05T13:54:43Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > That’s the problem. Using the phrase sort of demands an endorsement of the practice, in the name of good manners. Acknowledging the phrase, which its user views as a gesture of kindness and support, in any non-rude way ends up implying to some extent that I think prayer is a good thing too. No it doesn’t. That’s the great thing about polite phrases, they hold no other meaning. If I say “Thank you” you have no idea if I’m being thankful or not but you can tell that I’m being polite. And your saying “You’re welcome” doesn’t mean you endorse my thankfulness, it means you want to be polite also. > [@](#): > > As a first step toward fixing this problem, I think it’s not necessary to say “Thank you” in response to “I’ll pray for you”, although of course it’s still necessary to be polite. I recommend a neutral and very fleeting “Mm” or “Mm-hm”, immediately followed by a warm expression of appreciation of the part of the behavior you actually do appreciate, such as “It was so kind of you to stop by to offer condolences, that means a lot to me”. Just tactfully pass over the TMI part where they are telling you about their personal prayer habits and their intention to make you a subject of them. Or just say “Thank you” instead of “Mm-hm” because it will be taken to mean the same thing because the other person is being polite to you. ---
**Author:** ![DavidNRockies](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/davidnrockies/32/6279_2.png) [@DavidNRockies](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DavidNRockies)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/103 "2023-04-05T14:09:03Z")
P1) “I’ll pray for you.” P2) “Well, aren’t you sweet!” or “Well, bless your heart!” ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 2:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/104 "2023-04-05T14:50:48Z")
> [@kayaker](#): > > What about, “wow, that sucks, if you need help with anything, let me know”? _- in a way that’s explicitly atheistic -_ ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/105 "2023-04-05T14:59:56Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > > [@msmith537](#): > > > > I look at “I’ll pray for you” in the same way. That is to say. I don’t literally expect them to ask an invisible man in the sky on behalf any more that I would expect them to bop themselves on the head with a mallet. > > Really? I think a significant number, at least, of the people who’ll say “I’ll pray for you” will do so. Because they really think it works. > > People who don’t think it works don’t say that; except, maybe, to people who they individually know will be upset if they don’t. Perhaps it would be more accurate to say I don’t CARE if they talk to an invisible man in the sky any more than I care if they bop themselves with a mallet. I do think they sound like an idiot though. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/106 "2023-04-05T15:07:03Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > I wouldn’t care if they said “I’ll pray to Satan for you” or even “I’ll pray to Trump for you”. I didn’t ask if you personally would care. I asked whether you think that in your area that would be considered “ordinary human discourse”. > [@TriPolar](#): > > If someone says “I’ll pray for you” it is a polite gesture and the polite response is “Thank you” unless you have a specific reason to think that individual means something else. It’s expected to be taken as a polite gesture. That doesn’t mean there’s not a whole lot of subtext involved. If somebody says that to me, I’m probably not going to read them a lecture on the subject. I may well say something like “uh, thanks.” But they didn’t comfort me. They made me uncomfortable. > [@Kimstu](#): > > That’s the problem. Using the phrase sort of demands an endorsement of the practice, in the name of good manners. Acknowledging the phrase, which its user views as a gesture of kindness and support, in any non-rude way ends up implying to some extent that I think prayer is a good thing too. > > If I were a vegetarian and somebody said “I’ll bake one of my sausage casseroles for you”, I could politely say “Oh, no thank you, I don’t eat meat and can’t use it, but how very kind of you to offer.” But if somebody says “I’ll pray for you”, I can’t say “Oh, no thank you, I can’t use it, but how very kind of you to offer”; I have to say just “Thank you”, which implies that I am grateful to them not only for their kind intention but for their action of prayer itself. Quoted for truth. That is indeed the problem. > [@kayaker](#): > > > [@Miller](#): > > > > My point is there’s no way to express condolences _in a way that’s explicitly atheistic_ that’s socially acceptable. > > What about, “wow, that sucks, if you need help with anything, let me know”? There’s nothing explicitly atheistic about that. An extremely religious person could say that. – and it would be better if they did, to people whose beliefs they don’t know, or to people whose beliefs they know differ from theirs. > [@DavidNRockies](#): > > > I’ll be over with a casserole and _all the time in the world_ to listen. > > Particularly when the situation _is_ grief, loss, horrible news about a serious illness, that sort of thing, I’ve found that line (delivered sincerely and backed up if accepted) to be pretty much nothing but upside. That is a very good one – provided that if the person doesn’t want to talk, that’s respected. > [@Jasmine](#): > > The sad fact is that we have too many people whose hobby seems to be getting offended by things that are really innocuous in nature. > [@Jasmine](#): > > Anyone who has been talked to in a haughty and condescending manner because they have spiritual beliefs knows exactly what I’m saying. Anyone who has been talked to in a haughty and condescencing manner because they don’t have religious beliefs, or don’t have specific religious beliefs, ought to know exactly what I’ve been saying. Let alone the ones who have actually been threatened, or had those threats acted upon. What you appear to be saying is ‘it’s fine for religious people to make others uncomfortable while claiming to comfort them, because the uncomfortable people don’t have any right to be uncomfortable.’ > [@TriPolar](#): > > That’s the great thing about polite phrases, they hold no other meaning. Some of them hold lots of other meaning. “Goodbye” has genuinely lost all sense of “God be with ye.” But “I’ll pray for you” is still specifically religious. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/107 "2023-04-05T15:11:03Z")
Would it be a hijack to say that the concept of corporate DEI initiatives kind of offends me? I know they mean well and all, but it just seems like this cottage industry of professionals who just seem to add overhead in both their salaries and the various diversity and inclusion-themed events and training they organize. I’d like to add up all the hours wasted worrying and discussing the implications of people feeling triggered because a coworker said “bless you” after they sneezed. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/108 "2023-04-05T15:12:28Z")
> [@thorny\_locust](#): > > What you appear to be saying is ‘it’s fine for religious people to make others uncomfortable while claiming to comfort them, because the uncomfortable people don’t have any right to be uncomfortable.’ What?! 🤣 What you appear to be doing is taking two separate statements from two separate posts and contexts, connecting them together, and drawing an erroneous conclusion. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/109 "2023-04-05T15:14:49Z")
> [@Miller](#): > > - in a way that’s explicitly atheistic - Which means what, though. I don’t mention god, praying, etc. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/110 "2023-04-05T15:17:21Z")
OK; so you’re saying that religious people shouldn’t say “I’ll pray for you” to people who they don’t know share their beliefs, and it’s entirely reasonable for me and others to feel uncomfortable if they do? ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/111 "2023-04-05T15:25:09Z")
I never say it simply because it is presumptuous and, therefore, very annoying and even agitating to those who don’t share the same beliefs. People who are in grief are already severely stressed. The idea is to comfort them, not stress them further. ---
**Author:** ![TroutMan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/troutman/32/6721_2.png) [@TroutMan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TroutMan)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/112 "2023-04-05T15:44:01Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Would it be a hijack to say that the concept of corporate DEI initiatives kind of offends me? I know they mean well and all, but it just seems like this cottage industry of professionals who just seem to add overhead in both their salaries and the various diversity and inclusion-themed events and training they organize. I’m guessing you probably aren’t a member of a minority who suffers micro-aggressions (and macro) on a daily basis at work and in society. DEI initiatives can seem like a lot of effort, or like they actually increase tensions, to people like me who don’t have to deal with it. But for people who feel excluded, every day can be exhausting. It takes effort to address it, and progress is often painful. But it’s still really important. ---
**Author:** ![Odesio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/odesio/32/20003_2.png) [@Odesio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Odesio)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/113 "2023-04-05T15:49:03Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Would it be a hijack to say that the concept of corporate DEI initiatives kind of offends me? I know they mean well and all, but it just seems like this cottage industry of professionals who just seem to add overhead in both their salaries and the various diversity and inclusion-themed events and training they organize. In addition to the touchy feely stuff, part of DEI means making sure we’re not inadvertantly dicriminating during the hiring process or when it comes to promotions. It might also include concentrating efforts to recruit among populations that are underrepresented in your workplace. ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/114 "2023-04-05T15:50:32Z")
OK. I don’t at all understand why you said the bit about people getting offended as a hobby, then; but maybe I don’t need to. ---
**Author:** ![Ann\_Hedonia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ann_hedonia/32/319_2.png) [@Ann\_Hedonia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ann_Hedonia)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/115 "2023-04-05T16:34:25Z")
> [@hopesperson](#): > > Yes. The occasional “I’ll pray for you” and “bless you” don’t bother me a bit, but wanting me to participate in a ritual of any kind would be a big no. That’s how I feel as well, but I draw the line at pressuring me to pray with you. Frankly, I don’t see anything wrong with “I’ll pray for you”, I know many, if not most, people that aren’t me are religious and I’m fine with them being religious as long as they don’t try to compel me to adhere to their beliefs. And, when faced with a situation where I religious person might say “I’ll pray for you”, I say “I’m thinking of you” or “I really hope everything works out for the best”. It’s easy, there’s no reason to bring my lack of religion into a conversation like that. I did once work with a religious guy that drove everyone crazy with his praying, but it was how he did it that annoyed everyone. He would drop into prayer mode randomly, in the middle of group conversations, then chastise the next person that tried to speak to him for “interrupting his prayer”. Even the other believers were annoyed by this. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/116 "2023-04-05T16:57:56Z")
Wow. In my experience it’s usually the other way around. ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/117 "2023-04-05T17:11:46Z")
I’m sorry you’ve been through that. I live in a northern liberal city far from the Bible Belt, so maybe that’s why I’ve never experienced that type of thing. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/118 "2023-04-05T17:19:28Z")
> [@Ann\_Hedonia](#): > > That’s how I feel as well, but I draw the line at pressuring me to pray with you. Frankly, I don’t see anything wrong with “I’ll pray for you”, I know many, if not most, people that aren’t me are religious and I’m fine with them being religious as long as they don’t try to compel me to adhere to their beliefs. “I’ll pray for you” sounds to me atheist ears the same as saying “bless you” when I sneeze, or something like that; it’s just a figure of speech meaning “I feel bad for you, you have my sympathies.” ---
**Author:** ![Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ba9def/32.png) [@Just\_Asking\_Questions](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Just_Asking_Questions)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/119 "2023-04-05T17:21:43Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#): > > But it isn’t welcomed. Even in this thread it sounds like people say it to make themselves feel better and not those they’re praying for. I’ve had people offer to pray for me because I am a liberal and they thought I needed to be saved, accept Jesus, and prevent my eternal damnation. It was not a good comment. > [@TriPolar](#): > > I cannot understand how one can be offended by a personal offer to waste time praying for them. Because them telling me they are going to pray for me is OK, but me saying “I’m not praying for you, there is no god” is somehow rude. I hate double standards. Different than the OP, yet more common in my experience, are the people who, upon hearing of, say, a plane crash, with 200 people on board, and one 5 year old girl survives. “Oh, God was looking out for her!” “It’s a miracle!” And the other 199 people on the plane? Did god hate them? Was he busy? Did they not pray hard enough? > [@puzzlegal](#): > > I heard your mom has cancer. That must be really rough for you. It’s always hard when misfortune comes to those close to us.” “I heard your mom has cancer. I guess she doesn’t pray enough.” And I get called rude! 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [April 5, 2023, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109/120 "2023-04-05T17:25:55Z")
I would rate it a little different. “Bless you” is pretty neutral. “God Bless You” less neutral. “I’ll pray for you” about the same level. Hell, I say “Bless you” without thinking about it. I dropped the God part probably when I was 10. So none of those bother me really. * * * * * * Once, when I said in reply to something else. “I have no faith, I’m too skeptical probably”; I had a coworker tell me “I’ll pray for you”. That was really pushing it. But she was our resident “Church Lady”. Also was quick to make little remarks loudly like, “Is everything OK, you were late getting back from lunch.” Oy! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/ill-pray-for-you-management-says-not-on-my-watch/982109.md?page=7)