# Illinois Debt/Budget Crisis **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 26, 2017, 6:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929 "2017-06-26T18:15:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 6:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/41 "2017-06-27T18:58:32Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > I don’t know why you are making this personal in Great Debates. ☹ I’m simply saying that there’s no value in a debate when one side is 100% partisan and makes that clear from the get go. What minds are going to be changed when you start from that point? ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 8:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/42 "2017-06-27T20:35:02Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > I’m simply saying that there’s no value in a debate when one side is 100% partisan and makes that clear from the get go. What minds are going to be changed when you start from that point? HA! Like there’s no one on this message board whose posts aren’t 100% partisan. It happens on an hourly basis. But I guess if they’re on “your side”, it’s Ok, right? ---
**Author:** ![Folly](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/folly/32/3219_2.png) [@Folly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Folly)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/43 "2017-06-27T20:43:14Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I do notice from the chart I posted that Illinois has low property taxes. Given that this appears to be the best untapped source of revenue, how well do you think middle class Illinois voters will accept a steeper property tax? Illinois does have a fairly low income tax RATE, but the base is pretty broad and it does seem to raise a lot of revenue, comparable to states with higher rates. I suppose they could try to raise that more, but again, it’s a flat tax and I’m not sure how well Illinois residents would take that. > . Illinois has very high property taxes, second only to New Jersey. Most of it gets diverted to things like schools and does not show up in the state’s balance sheets. ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/44 "2017-06-27T20:50:58Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > Because if they could, they would. IOW you mean that they won’t rather than cannot. ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/45 "2017-06-27T21:04:44Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > HA! Like there’s no one on this message board whose posts aren’t 100% partisan. It happens on an hourly basis. But I guess if they’re on “your side”, it’s Ok, right? Once again, and maybe you’ll actually comprehend this time, I stated this to start: **It is not a one party problem** That was in my original post to this thread and I have not deviated from that. You have blamed only one party consistently and persistently. One of these kids is not like the other **#sesamestreet** :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/46 "2017-06-27T21:53:44Z")
> [@Quartz](#): > > IOW you mean that they won’t rather than cannot. Cannot in that they either can’t raise more revenue due to increased flight from the state, or they’ll all lose their jobs, Republicans will take the legislature, and they’ll do even worse to the pensioners. I think the plan is to cut pensions, but they’ll need an Act of Congress to do it. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/47 "2017-06-27T21:57:09Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > Once again, and maybe you’ll actually comprehend this time, I stated this to start Again with the personal attacks in Great Debates. What is up with that? 😕 ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 10:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/48 "2017-06-27T22:17:26Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Again with the personal attacks in Great Debates. What is up with that? 😕 What personal attack? I’ve repeated myself on that point several times and for some reason it seems to not be getting across. I’m really not sure what the issue is. I also believe I said that discussion between us on this point would be fruitless so I’m not sure the purpose of continuing on in this vein. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 10:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/49 "2017-06-27T22:22:57Z")
> [@CarnalK](#): > > Watching you guys trying to blame your opponents’ party is such fascinating and enriching political discussion. Really helps me understand this budget crisis. :golf clap: I’m blaming the governor. Quinn sucked as well and I would have rather seen him primaried out. He didn’t deserve a second term. But now Quinn isn’t governor, Rauner is and he’s failing at the job. ---
**Author:** ![ultimate11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/49beb7/32.png) [@ultimate11](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultimate11)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/50 "2017-06-27T22:31:30Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > I’m blaming the governor. Quinn sucked as well and I would have rather seen him primaried out. He didn’t deserve a second term. But now Quinn isn’t governor, Rauner is and he’s failing at the job. Who do I (or we) blame for not compromising and solving the budget crisis? In my opinion, both Bruce Rauner and Michael Madigan, and the Democratic and Republican leaders in Illinois are to blame. Both need to be ousted from office and term limits must be implemented. I’m suggesting one term. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/51 "2017-06-27T22:43:27Z")
> [@ultimate11](#): > > Obviously Illinois is within days of either making a budget or going down to junk status, leading to hung construction plans, companies more urged to leave and god knows what else. Illinois can’t declare bankruptcy, so now what? How far as we to a default? A catch 22. Illinois can raise taxes again for a short term fix, however the wealthy people or college educated high skilled worker would exit in greater numbers. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/52 "2017-06-27T23:04:17Z")
I primarily blame the governor since he (a) knew the political situation when he ran and claimed he would fix the budget regardless, (b) has stone-walled for non-budget related goals and © is the chief executive of the state. I mean, you could boot Madigan and Rauner would still have to deal with the next Democratic Speaker and Rauner has proven himself entirely incapable of doing so. If Rauner is incapable of dealing with the well-known political situation in Illinois then Rauner should let someone capable do the job. ---
**Author:** ![D\_Anconia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/67e7ee/32.png) [@D\_Anconia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/D_Anconia)\ **Post date:** [June 27, 2017, 11:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/53 "2017-06-27T23:51:09Z")
> [@Airbeck](#): > > What personal attack? I’ve repeated myself on that point several times and for some reason it seems to not be getting across. I’m really not sure what the issue is. I also believe I said that discussion between us on this point would be fruitless so I’m not sure the purpose of continuing on in this vein. Telling a fellow poster in GD that he “fails to comprehend” something is rude, and possibly veering into jerk territory. ---
**Author:** ![Airbeck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/airbeck/32/6574_2.png) [@Airbeck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airbeck)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2017, 12:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/54 "2017-06-28T00:14:47Z")
> [@D\_Anconia](#): > > Telling a fellow poster in GD that he “fails to comprehend” something is rude, and possibly veering into jerk territory. As is ignoring what another poster says and/or mischaracterizing it when replying. Again, I see no need to continue, this is hardly on topic. ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2017, 3:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/55 "2017-06-28T03:00:26Z")
> [@ultimate11](#): > > One worry I have with increasing the Illinois tax rate- despite it’s low rate- is that people are moving out of the state. Raise it up higher and more people will leave. So even raising taxes might not work. I didn’t move out of Illinois due to the taxes, I moved out because of the crime rate - people were getting shot and murdered in my neighborhood and I didn’t want to be the next statistic. There’s more to Chicago and Illinois problems than _just_ the taxes. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2017, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/56 "2017-06-28T03:37:33Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > I didn’t move out of Illinois due to the taxes, I moved out because of the crime rate - people were getting shot and murdered in my neighborhood and I didn’t want to be the next statistic. > > There’s more to Chicago and Illinois problems than _just_ the taxes. You could always just change neighborhoods. Most people just move to the suburbs. Chance of being a victim to violent crime in: Indianapolis: 1 in 76 Indiana: 1 in 258 Chicago: 1 in 110 Illinois: 1 in 261 Source [1](https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/in/indianapolis/crime), [2](https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/il/chicago/crime) ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2017, 12:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/57 "2017-06-28T12:26:11Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > You could always just change neighborhoods. Most people just move to the suburbs. I did move to the suburbs. It just so happens the suburb was in Indiana. The eastern border of Chicago is the state line so the 'burbs east of Chicago are all in a different state. ---
**Author:** ![ultimate11](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/49beb7/32.png) [@ultimate11](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ultimate11)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2017, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/58 "2017-06-28T12:28:13Z")
> [@Jophiel](#): > > You could always just change neighborhoods. Most people just move to the suburbs. > > Chance of being a victim to violent crime in: > Indianapolis: 1 in 76 > Indiana: 1 in 258 > Chicago: 1 in 110 > Illinois: 1 in 261 > > Source [1](https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/in/indianapolis/crime), [2](https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/il/chicago/crime) My parents (and thus, so did I) did so in 2001 due to the crime rate (although questionable in my opinion cause they left Daley’s neighborhood, but taxes is another factor too), to me it’s kinda a bummer, but at least they got a good deal on a rented mobile home. I think they pay, what, $500 or something in rent? We’re still in Illinois, but I’m sure Cook County can find a way to keep it afloat…right? At least I still have public transit access- albeit less since I’m not near the CTA, but the Pace 330 will do just fine (and even more so since they added Sunday service in 2015, giving me access to the city if I choose to take transit). As I’ve said, if neither side doesn’t want to work on this, then both sides should just get voted out. ---
**Author:** ![Jophiel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jophiel/32/66_2.png) [@Jophiel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jophiel)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2017, 1:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/59 "2017-06-28T13:12:54Z")
> [@Broomstick](#): > > The eastern border of Chicago is the state line so the 'burbs east of Chicago are all in a different state. I try not to think about that part of Indiana. It’s all Krazy Kaplans and Gary, IN and bad traffic leading to I-65. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [June 28, 2017, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929/60 "2017-06-28T16:12:44Z")
You really want to stay south of the Interstate, even better if you’re south of Route 30. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/illinois-debt-budget-crisis/789929.md?page=4)