# im a ghost! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [April 25, 2001, 12:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271 "2001-04-25T12:03:08Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Morrison\_s\_Lament](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Morrison\_s\_Lament](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morrison_s_Lament)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 1:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/81 "2001-04-27T13:00:26Z")
Holland just revealed that they will not sell ANY submarines or weapons to Taiwan, despite US pressure. I think that gives me the authority to declare China’s full fledged (nuclear) support to the Dutch authorities (Coldie) in taking out the Icelandic threat (Bjössi). I’ll have to get myself a new citizenship when Iceland is wiped off the map of course, but I’m sure China will be happy to work something out with me after the great victory of the Alliance. Hop Holland! Zhongguo Tai Hao Leh! — G. Raven ---
**Author:** ![Morrison\_s\_Lament](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Morrison\_s\_Lament](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morrison_s_Lament)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/82 "2001-04-27T13:03:41Z")
p.s. my pinyin sucks, so don’t comment on it 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Astroboy14](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/df705f/32.png) [@Astroboy14](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Astroboy14)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 2:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/83 "2001-04-27T14:20:58Z")
> [@](#): > > p.s. my pinyin sucks, so don’t comment on it Hey, **Morrison** : your opinion sucks! Nyah Nyah Nyah Nyah Nyah!! 😛 ---
**Author:** ![kabbes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/e99b99/32.png) [@kabbes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kabbes)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 2:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/84 "2001-04-27T14:47:53Z")
Ya see? You have to hand it to a **bj0rn** thread for sheer plot twist. It starts of with a cryptic OP, develops into a discussion of language and posting style via a symbolic recursive link, briefly threatens to be a dialogue about the nature of ignorance and continues by evolving into a debate over the winners of an Iceland-Netherlands war. Where will it go next? Only YOU can decide. pan ---
**Author:** ![bj0rn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a88e57/32.png) [@bj0rn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bj0rn)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/85 "2001-04-27T15:16:44Z")
i think this is going nowhere…or everywhere if you want to. but obviously people are just going to continue acting ignorant. bj0rn - thanks for this spiritual experience ---
**Author:** ![Jodi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/7feea3/32.png) [@Jodi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jodi)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/86 "2001-04-27T15:46:43Z")
BJ0RN – > [@](#): > > jodi: the problem with your logic is that you can not compare a spoken statement to a truck. “Back up the truck” is a (relatively obscure and arguably lame) American idiom meaning to start over. Even if you did not understand this, there is nothing in my last post that compared a spoken statement to an actual truck. > [@](#): > > you, for example write a message, hand it over to the reader and then you recieve a feedback. if you run the reader over with your truck you are not very likely to recieve any feedback at all. The problem is that you, BJ0RN, often make sense to only yourself. However, people helpfully _try_ to figure out what you are talking about and then respond to what they _think_ you are talking about, and then you get all pissy because you have been “misunderstood.” Your response to ASTROBOY in this very thread is a perfect example of that. And if someone actually _does_ confess that they don’t know what the hell you’re talking about, you serve up another incompehensible random neural firing and if they _still_ don’t get it, you conclude they are stupid. If _you_ have something to say – a point to make – and you fail to convey it, that is _your_ problem, not the problem of those who are futilely attempting to understand you. > [@](#): > > its not proper protocol to start whining and bitching about the statement given if you dont understand it for that is not an understandable or constructive feedback. Actually, if I posted something that doesn’t make sense, I would expect one of two things to happen: 1. Someone would attempt to make it make sense (“Maybe she’s really saying _this_; I will assume so and respond to that.”) When people do this to you, if they are wrong – and they often are because your statements are so ellipical – you get mad because you have been “misunderstood.” 2. Someone will frankly say “That doesn’t make any sense! What is she talking about?” When people do this to you, you get mad and conclude they are “stupid.” All I’m saying is that if people do not understand your points, the most obvious and likely reason why is that you have been insufficiently clear. And, no, neither an attempt to make a statement make sense nor an acknowledgement that it does not, is the same as a “fuck off!” ---
**Author:** ![Morrison\_s\_Lament](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Morrison\_s\_Lament](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morrison_s_Lament)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/87 "2001-04-27T16:22:40Z")
How many times must a troll be annoying, before he is forever ignored? This guy has posted more than 700 posts, most of them complete and utter rubbish designed only to irritate and baffle those who read them. He continually insults people by calling them names when they ask him to explain his nonsensical statements, and seems to derive some perverse pleasure from it to boot. I am unlucky enough to have followed many of his threads and I tell you there is little content to be found in any of them. He is obviously interested in philosophy and tries to use it to split hairs down to neurons. If you start an argument with this man, you will not get anywhere and you will get there immediately. — G. Raven p.s. this is the pit, so: “Haltu nu einu sinni kjafti mannandskoti eða reyndu ad meika eitthvad sense” ---
**Author:** ![Esprix](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/esprix/32/7899_2.png) [@Esprix](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esprix)\ **Post date:** [April 27, 2001, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/88 "2001-04-27T18:54:07Z")
And the newbies learn the enigma {koff koff incoherent ignorant idiocy koff koff} that is **bj0rn**. :rolleyes: Between him and **Wildest Bill** , my eyes are going to roll right out of their sockets… Esprix ---
**Author:** ![racinchikki](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/eada6e/32.png) [@racinchikki](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/racinchikki)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 12:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/89 "2001-04-28T00:24:07Z")
I don’t know bj0rn so I’m not touching any of that. I’d just like to say that there is a difference between ignorance and stupidity. Ignorance is simply lack of knowledge. If you give an ignorant person facts, they then gain knowledge and cease to be ignorant. Therefore it is easy to fight ignorance. Stupidity is failure to comprehend knowledge. Fighting stupidity is more or less futile, unless you’re equipped with a whiffle bat or other weapon. ---
**Author:** ![Mysphyt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/dbc845/32.png) [@Mysphyt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mysphyt)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 6:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/90 "2001-04-28T06:30:53Z")
> [@](#): > > _Originally posted by Jodi_ > “Back up the truck” is a (relatively obscure and arguably lame) American idiom meaning to start over. I’ve always been personally partial to “Roll back the Soul Train.” ---
**Author:** ![Primaflora](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/898d66/32.png) [@Primaflora](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Primaflora)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 8:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/91 "2001-04-28T08:22:27Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bj0rn \* > \*\* > i consider myself fluent enough in the written english language to communicate among native english speakers and other non-natives on an international message board… > > \*\* shame really that you continue to labour under this delusion… how can we help you realise that considering yourself fluent enough to communicate is not in fact sufficient? You actually need to be fluent. And you are not. ---
**Author:** ![wariat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@wariat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wariat)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 2:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/92 "2001-04-28T14:44:20Z")
As a lurker of two years’ standing I will break my duck with a pro-bj0rn post, which I dare say will get me off on the wrong foot with everybody else - and actually I don’t care. (a) There is not very much wrong wih bj0rn’s English, which he writes well as a non-native speaker, except that it is much closer to English English than Amerenglish. This clearly causes problems for many of you, but I have noticed that sometimes other native but non-American English speakers have similar difficulties. You are not easy people to communicate with outside your own idioms. (b) There is not much wrong with bj0rn’s ideas, either, as I think kabbes has shown. Being clearly a naturally diplomatic soul, he has not laboured the point of the collective defending itself against the unfamiliar, but there it is anyway. © For my money, bj0rn’s originality counts for a lot, and I would trade in [insert here name of disliked prolific poster of choice] ten times over for more of bj0rn. ---
**Author:** ![Miller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/miller/32/481_2.png) [@Miller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Miller)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2001, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/93 "2001-04-28T19:50:55Z")
Wariat: Good point about Bj0rn writing English English, not American English. I am an American, and am always totally baffled by London\_Calling and all the other posters from the UK. Why, when I was in London last summer, I had to carry and English to English phrase book, just to navigate around the city. When I watch PBS, it’s like watching Telemundo, for all I can comprehend the enourmous gulfs between these two languages. I don’t think Bj0rn’s problem is poor English skills. His spelling, grammar, and vocabulary are about as good as most native speakers. I think he’d be equally incomprehensible in any tongue. Look at his reaction to Jodi’s off-hand truck metaphor. Even if you’re not familiar with this particular idiom, its not too hard to figure out what it means (or don’t they have trucks in the Netherlands?) Or at the very least, how hard is it to recognize it as a metaphor, even if the specific meaning eludes you? No, the problem here isn’t poor English skills, its poor thinking skills. ---
**Author:** ![wariat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@wariat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wariat)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2001, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/94 "2001-04-29T00:21:49Z")
Nimune: thanks for your little gob of flaccid sarcasm, despite which there are real differences of tone and structure between the two versions of the language. I generally find myself, as an English-English speaker, rephrasing what I write if I think that it will be read by Americans, because I know from long and irritating experience that otherwise I will generally not be clearly understood. As for the rest, of course I don’t agree: I think bj0rn is extremely bright, but with a highly idiosyncratic sense of humour. * * * “Since no-one will understand you in any case, you may as well say what you please.” (Szewczyk) ---
**Author:** ![Coldfire](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/a587f6/32.png) [@Coldfire](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Coldfire)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2001, 1:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/95 "2001-04-29T01:12:30Z")
I suppose my English is somewhat of a mix between English and American English (if indeed there is such a thing). And somehow, people seem to understand me. The majority of the posters from the UK don’t seem to be experiencing a lot of communication problems. Sure, the odd slang term. But that goes both ways. bj0rns English doesn’t resemble English any more than it does American English, IMHO. Welcome aboard, by the way. ---
**Author:** ![Weirddave](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/919ad9/32.png) [@Weirddave](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weirddave)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2001, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/96 "2001-04-29T03:37:15Z")
> [@](#): > > English to English phrase book, This just struck me as a funny concept, even though I know I speak American and not English. Icewater down your spine thought for the day: Suppose Bj0rn posted as often as handy? ---
**Author:** ![Morrison\_s\_Lament](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Morrison\_s\_Lament](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morrison_s_Lament)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2001, 6:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/97 "2001-04-29T06:31:47Z")
I’m originally Icelandic (like Björn). I also used to live in England and Holland (which also subscribes to the British way of speaking English as opposed to the American way) and yet I have no idea what the hell Bj0rn is talking about most of the time. It has nothing to do with Icelandic or English grammar or choice of words. Yanks need not feel they are being left out of anything. He is simply talking out of his ass 90% of the time. — G. Raven ---
**Author:** ![SPOOFE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/c5a1d2/32.png) [@SPOOFE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SPOOFE)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2001, 10:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/98 "2001-04-29T10:29:36Z")
And you forget that he’s just plain rude to people who disagree with him, no matter how politely they voice their dissent. ---
**Author:** ![Morrison\_s\_Lament](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d26b3c/32.png) [@Morrison\_s\_Lament](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morrison_s_Lament)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2001, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/99 "2001-04-29T14:46:52Z")
Indeed, he’s the kind of guy to start screaming in a crowded restaurant because someone looked at his food the wrong way. — G. Raven ---
**Author:** ![wariat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@wariat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wariat)\ **Post date:** [April 29, 2001, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271/100 "2001-04-29T16:10:03Z")
You REALLY don’t like him, do you? Coldfire: thank you, and much appreciated. For the rest, all I can do is speak as I find, but I suppose that doesn’t mean you have to find the same. My own view remains as I have said: that bj0rn is basically humourous; and that his writing patterns are less off-putting seen from this side of the Atlantic - but if you don’t agree, I’ll live with it. As to real differences betw US and UK English, well, I still maintain that there are some significant ones, although they lie more in style and tone than in vocab and grammar. But I suppose that’s not a subject for a bj0rn-bashing thread. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-a-ghost/63271.md?page=6)