# I'm dating a woman who abandoned her two kids. I need some advice. **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 18, 2015, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311 "2015-05-18T16:41:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![RivkahChaya](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rivkahchaya/32/8919_2.png) [@RivkahChaya](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RivkahChaya)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 7:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/41 "2015-05-19T07:06:00Z")
A lot of women would chew their arm off, because of the way society looks at women who don’t fight tooth and nail for their children. If it weren’t were for societal expectations, and knowing how she would be judged by individual people and society at large, my mother would have sent me to my aunt and uncle’s earlier, with no problem. I’ll bet there are women who fight just because they know how people will look at them if they don’t. Don’t misunderstand: I agree that this woman probably won’t ever be anything deeper than “friends with benefits,” albeit, I don’t really know. She’s not devoid of sensitivity, since she knows enough to have kept this information to herself briefly, but did not try to conceal it forever. I think that shows that she knows how she comes across to other people. People who have “personality disorders” usually don’t. ---
**Author:** ![CairoCarol](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cairocarol/32/3825_2.png) [@CairoCarol](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CairoCarol)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/42 "2015-05-19T10:33:41Z")
The comparison to giving them up for adoption doesn’t quite work. Of course we would not fault a woman for having no contact or financial responsibility for a baby she had given up for adoption. However, we would expect a normal person to feel at least a little wistful about the child she had decided to relinquish. It sounds like this woman doesn’t care at all. Further, from what little we know it sounds like she brought the children into the world in a stable environment - she had a husband and family who were evidently able to provide the necessary emotional and physical support for raising children. People give kids up for adoption when they don’t have that kind of framework. Okay, so maybe she had a child and then realized as a result of the experience taht she wasn’t fit for motherhood. In that case, why did she have a second child? It’s not _impossible_ to imagine a scenario that fits the known facts and in which she is blameless and capable of normal emotional reactions, but it’s damned hard. ---
**Author:** ![ratatoskK](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ratatoskk/32/2987_2.png) [@ratatoskK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ratatoskK)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 11:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/43 "2015-05-19T11:56:10Z")
My hunch is that she was abusive and barred from seeing the children. But that’s just a WAG. ---
**Author:** ![monstro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ba9def/32.png) [@monstro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/monstro)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/44 "2015-05-19T12:11:38Z")
> [@RivkahChaya](#): > > A lot of women would chew their arm off, because of the way society looks at women who don’t fight tooth and nail for their children. > > If it weren’t were for societal expectations, and knowing how she would be judged by individual people and society at large, my mother would have sent me to my aunt and uncle’s earlier, with no problem. > > I’ll bet there are women who fight just because they know how people will look at them if they don’t. > > Don’t misunderstand: I agree that this woman probably won’t ever be anything deeper than “friends with benefits,” albeit, I don’t really know. She’s not devoid of sensitivity, since she knows enough to have kept this information to herself briefly, but did not try to conceal it forever. I think that shows that she knows how she comes across to other people. People who have “personality disorders” usually don’t. I disagree with your last point. The notion that people with personality disorders are totally clueless is a myth. Every person I’ve interacted online with a PD knows they are a hot mess. They may not know how to stop being one, but they recognize that’s what they are. I find your overall post interesting, though. Reminds me of this [article](http://www.dailymail.co.uk/femail/article-2303588/The-mother-says-having-children-biggest-regret-life.html) that we [discussed](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=687870) a couple of years ago. Dopers diagnosed this woman with every personality disorder on the books, even though there was no indication she had done anything wrong (though disclosing her name was questionable behavior). It amazes me how people never hesitate to judge someone who doesn’t have the “right” emotions. So it’s no wonder that mothers play up their love and devotion. We live in a society that says there something is fundamentally wrong with you if that’s not how you feel. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/45 "2015-05-19T12:17:02Z")
She, left and evidently had no feeling for the people she carried for 9 months and gave birth? Just how much feeling would she have for you? How difficult would it be for her to say “is not cut out for a relationship” 6 moths down the line. Run. Like. Hell. ---
**Author:** ![sandra\_nz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/eada6e/32.png) [@sandra\_nz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sandra_nz)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/46 "2015-05-19T12:28:46Z")
I don’t think I could even continue a friendship with an adult who abandoned their children for no good reason\*. - I’m assuming that you know much more detail than you gave us in your original post, and that you have not seen any compelling reason/rationale for her abandoning her children. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 12:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/47 "2015-05-19T12:38:56Z")
> [@Strainger](#): > > I hate to be cliche, but beauty is only skin deep. Maybe you could flay her? ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 12:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/48 "2015-05-19T12:39:28Z")
> [@sandra\_nz](#): > > - I’m assuming that you know much more detail than you gave us in your original post, and that you have not seen any compelling reason/rationale for her abandoning her children. And if you don’t, then this is the point in the relationship where she needs to tell you the whole story in full detail and four-part harmony, if this is to be more than just a “let’s have fun and good sex together for awhile, then go our separate ways” sorta thing. Because I completely agree with this: > [@](#): > > I don’t think I could even continue a friendship with an adult who abandoned their children for no good reason\*. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 4:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/49 "2015-05-19T16:05:42Z")
> [@RTFirefly](#): > > And if you don’t, then this is the point in the relationship where she needs to tell you the whole story in full detail and four-part harmony, if this is to be more than just a “let’s have fun and good sex together for awhile, then go our separate ways” sorta thing. > > Because I completely agree with this: And if he wishes to stay with her anyway, find a way to get in touch with her ex and get his side of the story. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/50 "2015-05-19T16:47:05Z")
> [@TBG](#): > > Well, for one thing the law says both parents have obligations to the children financially. This broad’s a deadbeat, same as if a guy did this. Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the law less black and white than that? He is legally entitled to alimony, but he has the freedom to refuse it. It sounds like the parents both agreed that there would be no alimony and no contact. I don’t see how that’s a violation of the law. ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctor_jackson/32/32_2.png) [@Doctor\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/51 "2015-05-19T17:21:16Z")
> [@YogSosoth](#): > > It sounds like the parents both agreed that there would be no alimony and no contact. Not sure how it “sounds like” that, since there are no facts presented to support such a conclusion. ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/52 "2015-05-19T17:22:21Z")
> [@YogSosoth](#): > > Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t the law less black and white than that? He is legally entitled to alimony, but he has the freedom to refuse it. It sounds like the parents both agreed that there would be no alimony and no contact. I don’t see how that’s a violation of the law. Alimony and child support are two different things. ---
**Author:** ![Snowboarder\_Bo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/snowboarder_bo/32/229_2.png) [@Snowboarder\_Bo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Snowboarder_Bo)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 5:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/53 "2015-05-19T17:26:12Z")
> [@tapu](#): > > Leave it be. I can see a mother admitting that she’s not a good mother and turning her children over to someone who can care for them. But no contact? No acknowledgment at all? Something’s wrong. > [@Dangerosa](#): > > I’m not sure that someone who is incapable of being any sort of decent parent at all (phone calls, Christmas gifts, postcards - as opposed to a bad parent - abusive) is someone capable of having any sort of decent RELATIONSHIP at all. > > There is something to be said for “I can’t handle day to day parenting” - but there is nothing to be said for “I had kids, and now ignore them.” I have to differ with your opinions; my personal experience has shown me there are indeed people in this world who have given up their children to be raised by others, have had no contact with said children at all in the ensuing years, yet are still good people capable of loving, decent relationships. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/54 "2015-05-19T19:34:46Z")
[ul] [li]Wear a condom, and[/li][li]Don’t expect a lot of fuss on your birthday.[/li][/ul]Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 8:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/55 "2015-05-19T20:04:22Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > I have to differ with your opinions; my personal experience has shown me there are indeed people in this world who have given up their children to be raised by others, have had no contact with said children at all in the ensuing years, yet are still good people capable of loving, decent relationships. Given them up how and when? There is a difference between someone who surrenders their parental rights as part of allowing an infant that they can’t care for to be adopted into another family and someone who forgets they have children when they divorce the other parent. Having worked in CPS, I have a lot of experience with people who are just not suited to be parents. But the one thing we almost never saw was a parent who would voluntarily surrender a child that they had lived with past infancy\* with no further contact. They might agree to the other parent having custody, they might agree to allow a stepparent adoption. They might even agree to an adoption or custody/guardianship arrangement with family members or an open adoption. But all of those situations allow for further contact. I am absolutely certain that there are people who can give up a newborn for adoption and still be a good people capable of decent and loving relationships. I have my doubts about someone who has lived with a child for four or six or ten years and then doesn’t so much as call or send a birthday card- _even though_ the other parent is not pushing them away. - They would sometimes voluntarily surrender an older child who had been in foster care or hospitalized since infancy. ---
**Author:** ![ZPG\_Zealot](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/e47c2d/32.png) [@ZPG\_Zealot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZPG_Zealot)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/56 "2015-05-19T20:09:49Z")
> [@AK84](#): > > She, left and evidently had no feeling for the people she carried for 9 months and gave birth? Just how much feeling would she have for you? How difficult would it be for her to say “is not cut out for a relationship” 6 moths down the line. > Run. Like. Hell. You are assuming she wanted to be pregnant and give birth to those children. She may not have had easy access to an abortion. A lot of women get conned into having kids they don’t want by their SO and their SO’s families. If they later realize what a trap they’ve fallen into and somehow manage to escape, I can’t fault them for not looking back. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/57 "2015-05-19T20:40:46Z")
> [@ZPG\_Zealot](#): > > You are assuming she wanted to be pregnant and give birth to those children. This. I can’t really blame a woman who was tricked into getting pregnant and having kids by time traveling Vikings for not wanting to travel back in time and live in the 9th century and I’m pretty sure abortions hadn’t been invented yet back then. ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 8:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/58 "2015-05-19T20:44:24Z")
> [@Doctor\_Jackson](#): > > Not sure how it “sounds like” that, since there are no facts presented to support such a conclusion. I took the statement that the kids live with the dad and didn’t push her away as being an amicable separation where one side isn’t hounding the other for money. If that is true, I cannot say what she did was unreasonable. If its not and the dad is actively trying to get money from her that she isn’t sending, then I’d think she’s the bad one. ---
**Author:** ![nearwildheaven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/90db22/32.png) [@nearwildheaven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nearwildheaven)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2015, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/59 "2015-05-19T23:02:30Z")
> [@doreen](#): > > they might agree to allow a stepparent adoption. They might even agree to an adoption or custody/guardianship arrangement with family members or an open adoption. But all of those situations allow for further contact. I thought a step-parent adoption meant that the other parent was out of the child’s life, and their extended family too (and just the extended family if the other parent was deceased). Maybe it’s because that has been exactly the case with every such situation I’ve ever seen. Most of the time, it was mainly done as a way to get out of paying child support. ---
**Author:** ![doreen](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/858c86/32.png) [@doreen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doreen)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2015, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311/60 "2015-05-20T00:03:50Z")
> [@nearwildheaven](#): > > I thought a step-parent adoption meant that the other parent was out of the child’s life, and their extended family too (and just the extended family if the other parent was deceased). Maybe it’s because that has been exactly the case with every such situation I’ve ever seen. Most of the time, it was mainly done as a way to get out of paying child support. It can be that way- but it doesn’t have to be.Remember, the reason for the custodial parent and the step-parent wanting the adoption isn’t so the NCP can get out of paying child support. There are many reasons ( so the step-parent can consent to medical treatment, so the step-parent gets custody if the partner dies, so the child can get benefits through the step-parent ) , most of which don’t automatically mean that the custodial parent is going to prohibit all contact with the NCP once the consent to adoption is signed. It’s not like a closed adoption, which precludes any further contact because the parties’ identities are kept secret from each other. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-dating-a-woman-who-abandoned-her-two-kids-i-need-some-advice/720311.md?page=4)