# I'm Giving My 17 Year old an Ultimatum **URL:** \ **Category:** Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share\ **Created:** [July 30, 2003, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933 "2003-07-30T17:03:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 16\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Shayna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/shayna/32/17976_2.png) [@Shayna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shayna)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2003, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/81 "2003-08-02T00:23:52Z")
I beg to differ (though only slightly), **Quadgop**. You’re right – only her son is responsible for his actions, not her. However (and this is where we part ways), he is still under her care and control, living under her roof and under her guidance. She has an opportunity to help save him from himself and _now_ is the last and only time it will be within her power to do something about it. If she fails him, he will fail, no question about it. As his parent and guardian, it’s her _responsibility_ until he’s either of legal age and/or out of her home, care and control. She has the choice to let the next year slide by, call him a man, kick him out on his own and let the chips fall entirely on his shoulders – or – she can be the parent now and get this child the help he desperately needs to become a responsible adult man. I just hope she makes the right one. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2003, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/82 "2003-08-02T01:00:45Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Isabelle \* > \*\*No he does NOT physically abuse me or threaten me. But he can have a wild temper and slam things and has been known to punch a hole in the wall and kick a hole in the door. His father was physcially abusive and demonstrative with his anger so I feel he has picked up on some of these bad traits. > \ > \*\* I had an abusive ex-boyfriend who never touched me, but he demonstrated his anger and bad temper by punching things, throwing things, etc. when I “made” him angry, just like your son. I left him because he was abusive and I felt threatened by him. Your son’s actions are definitely in the grey area for physically abusive. When you ask him to do something and he gets mad and kicks a door, it probably makes you feel scared and upset and you adjust your behaviour accordingly so you don’t upset him (ie, walking on eggshells around him). This isn’t a healthy dynamic. ---
**Author:** ![Bill\_H](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/a5b964/32.png) [@Bill\_H](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bill_H)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2003, 1:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/83 "2003-08-02T01:04:12Z")
He’s 17 and he’s making 24k/year? When I was his age (20 years ago, remember it like it was yesterday), I worked at my high school, fixing computers. They paid me $2.85/hour. and that was when minimum wage was $3.15/hour, but since I was a minor that was legal (you figure the logic, cause I sure couldn’t.) And I managed to save enough money to buy a car. Man, I sound like my grandfather. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2003, 6:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/84 "2003-08-02T18:09:21Z")
Point taken, **Shayna**. And a good point it is. ---
**Author:** ![artemis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/91b2a8/32.png) [@artemis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/artemis)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2003, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/85 "2003-08-02T18:27:16Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Dolores Claiborne \* > \*\*The last couple of weeks he has been trying a little harder, because I think he is starting to see the light, but it might be too late for him. ☹ \*\* **Dolores Claiborne** , I’m sorry to hear about all the trouble your son has managed to get himself into, and I hope he DOES manage to get himself straightened out in time. ---
**Author:** ![occ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/8c91f0/32.png) [@occ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/occ)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2003, 11:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/86 "2003-08-02T23:52:18Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Isabelle \* > \*\*His last cell phone bill was $675!!! > \*\* …Wha?! How the hell can one spend that much on a cell phone in a month? He’s either lying, or using the phone to call pay-per services, or _something_. No friggin’ way. Business users who talk during their entire workday won’t be spending anywhere _near_ that much on a monthly bill. People using weird worldwide-access plans won’t be spending that much. That’s just insane. ---
**Author:** ![Capcha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/82dd89/32.png) [@Capcha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capcha)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2003, 12:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/87 "2003-08-03T00:54:19Z")
My uncle’s family was exactly like that. They had a boy and girl. The parents had problems all the time, till they divorced (when boy was 18 and girl 15) The boy was horrible to be around, never listend to his mother, violent, hit his sister a couple of times, chores undone. Basicaly he thought he was the ‘man’ of the house. I don’t know what happened, but once he hit 20, he made a complete 360 personality change. I hope things turn out for the best for you **Isabell** 🙂 Why don’t you get your son to sit infront of you, and simply ask him:“Just tell me what’s the deal? How do you feel about me?” ---
**Author:** ![Mockingbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/c68b51/32.png) [@Mockingbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mockingbird)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2003, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/88 "2003-08-03T01:30:24Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by bouv \* > \*\*I am still in shock and awe of how $500 is gone in one weekend. I make a paltry $200 a week and I couldn’t spend it all if I tried! > \*\* :dubious: I can spend that in a week on necessities like food, car insurance, electricity… poof. When it comes to luxury spending, I can make that $200 vanish in moments and have things to show for it. That you couldn’t spend it all if you tried is a little hard to believe. ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2003, 5:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/89 "2003-08-03T05:26:43Z")
It’s an Adobe PDF. [Flordia Child Labor Laws](http://www.myflorida.com/dbpr/pro/farm/compliance/childlabor/forms/poster_leg.pdf) FYI - According to the PDF, when out of school, there is no hours limitation. ---
**Author:** ![fessie](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/c37758/32.png) [@fessie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fessie)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2003, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/90 "2003-08-03T11:20:41Z")
**Isabelle** I can really relate to your situation, as I was a troubled and difficult 17-yr-old who made good money & had nothing to show for it (and a lousy temper to boot). So I have some strong opinions on this - I hope my assumptions about your situation have some merit; please excuse me if I’m being presumptuous. I think the posters here who are saying there’s nothing wrong with being strict and firm, that a loving parent has rules, are correct. However it’s pretty clear that your household has not been run that way in the past, no doubt because of some big problems with your marriage and divorce. It sounds like you have some guilt about your ex-husband’s lack of parenting & wish you could give your son more. It sounds like you have a hard time saying “no” and what you’d really like is for your son to stop asking. One thing I don’t agree with is the way posters are demonizing this boy - I think that your son is treating you the way you have taught him to treat you. If you want a different outcome, you’ve got to set a different agenda. The rules are up to you to make. OTOH changing course midstream can be impossible, and being a single parent!; I can’t even imagine how difficult that must be. I really hope you get some outside help with this, you deserve support and resources. I’ve read your statements about what you do for him and it’s clear you’re bending over backwards - it must be terribly frustrating to get such disrespect in return. From what you describe your son sounds to me like the “identified patient”. Anecdotal information from the psychologists I’ve known says that a child’s misbehavior is almost always a family problem, not just a “bad kid”. I don’t think you see him as a rotten human being; you obviously still love your son or you wouldn’t be so concerned for his future. Kids pick up on and express a lot of unspoken emotions - all the behaviors in a family are interdependent. Is it possible that he’s acting on the emotions (anger? entitlement? your guilt about his father?) that no one else is expressing? That’s not to excuse your son’s rudeness or to dismiss the need for discipline - I totally agree that you’ve got to lay down the law. But clearly you’re ambivalent about your son’s misbehavior or you would’ve taken stronger action earlier. You’ve acknowledged that you don’t really think kicking him out is an option. I agree with **greck** that it’s really important (in the long run) to dig deeper. I’ll betcha anything it will benefit you both. In the short run, cancel that cell phone & don’t give him any more money; let him work out his own problems. It could be that he has to break away from you and experience some pain & mistakes on his own before he’ll be able to grow up - you may not be able to protect him from it. ---
**Author:** ![Amberlei](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e56c9b/32.png) [@Amberlei](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Amberlei)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2003, 12:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/91 "2003-08-03T12:18:57Z")
Several people have asked, but I haven’t seen an answer. Is he still in school? That would make a huge difference in how to handle the situation. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2003, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/92 "2003-08-03T16:27:25Z")
{geometry nitpick} > [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by 5U1C1D3 \* > \*\*\he made a complete 360 personality change. > \ > \*\* I just wanted to point out that 360° is a full circle - his personality would have been back exactly where it started from. {/geometry nitpick} ---
**Author:** ![Capcha](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/82dd89/32.png) [@Capcha](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Capcha)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2003, 3:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/93 "2003-08-04T03:12:06Z")
lol Featherlou, that’s why i aded the pesonality change…because if i have said 180 degree, it would have meant 1/2, right??😛 ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2003, 5:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/94 "2003-08-04T05:41:05Z")
Actually, a 180° personality change would mean he is exactly the opposite of what he was. That’s why when someone does a complete reversal of opinions or position on something, it’s called doing a 180. (I guess the geometry hijack wasn’t _quite_ finished yet. :D) ---
**Author:** ![Knighted\_Vorpal\_Sword](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ac91a4/32.png) [@Knighted\_Vorpal\_Sword](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knighted_Vorpal_Sword)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2003, 1:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/95 "2003-08-04T13:36:19Z")
Gee, I feel lucky. I was still living at home, going to college (full time) and working (part time). My father told me it was time to contribute something to the house - I forget what it was, maybe $20 or 25 a week. A few months after I finally moved out, he asked me to stop by for a few minutes. Dad gave me back all the money I had given him over the months. “Here - I was only going to spend it if we really needed it, and we didn’t need it.” ---
**Author:** ![little\_bit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/258eb7/32.png) [@little\_bit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/little_bit)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2003, 5:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933/96 "2003-08-04T17:19:46Z")
Just one point not made by others… I am not a lawyer, but my aunt is, so I asked… As a minor, any money he earns is yours, not his. You are within your legal rights to have his employer send his wages to you as long as he is your legal dependent. You might want to mention this to him. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-giving-my-17-year-old-an-ultimatum/191933.md?page=4)