# I'm going to call the kettle black: Let's see the birth certificate! **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [March 23, 2015, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749 "2015-03-23T01:39:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![WPA-Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a6a055/32.png) [@WPA-Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WPA-Guy)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 1:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/1 "2015-03-23T01:39:57Z")
Ted Cruz has announced that he is a candidate for President in 2016, however, he was born in Canada, not the US. And his father is Cuban, although his mother is American, born in Delaware. So, if a big stink was made in 2008 for candidate Obama (who apparently was born in the US), shouldn’t the same be made now? Just sayin’. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/2 "2015-03-23T01:45:46Z")
Hey! At least wait until his donors have thrown a few million bucks down the rathole! ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/3 "2015-03-23T01:45:56Z")
You can make as big a stink as you want to, but why would you want to associate yourself with the lunatic fringe? Let the nutters expose themselves as such and then point and laugh at them. That’s the way it’s usually done, anyway. ---
**Author:** ![E-DUB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/e-dub/32/403_2.png) [@E-DUB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/E-DUB)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/4 "2015-03-23T02:11:31Z")
It isn’t about “associate yourself with the lunatic fringe”, it’s about shining a light on the blatant hypocrisy of persons who made such a big deal about questioning one candidate’s bona fides but are suspiciously silent when one of their own has arguably bigger grounds to be questioned on. ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/5 "2015-03-23T02:13:29Z")
Welcome to Politics 101 ---
**Author:** ![FXMastermind](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fxmastermind/32/7289_2.png) [@FXMastermind](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FXMastermind)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/6 "2015-03-23T02:15:10Z")
[![](https://www.newscorpse.com/Pix/Caps/breitbart-obama-booklet.jpg) ](https://www.newscorpse.com/Pix/Caps/breitbart-obama-booklet.jpg) It’s crap like that spread around the internets that feeds the lunatic fringe. You need to go find an old magazine that talks about his early life and how he was born in Canada, then start demanding answers. ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/7 "2015-03-23T02:15:54Z")
But why bother? Raising the question makes no sense, because like the Birthers you’ll never be right. It occurs to me that we will never have any sort of political peace as long as we take the position that because they did it first it necessarily follows that you should do it as well. Let the idiots be idiots. Don’t emulate them. ---
**Author:** ![Master\_Wang-Ka](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/master_wang-ka/32/3325_2.png) [@Master\_Wang-Ka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Master_Wang-Ka)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/8 "2015-03-23T02:18:52Z")
I think the OP raises a good point. Are we going to see the same over the top psychotic-break style racist (or even nonracist) insanity with a Hispanic president that we did with a black one? ---
**Author:** ![Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e36b37/32.png) [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Airman_Doors_USAF)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/9 "2015-03-23T02:21:34Z")
Cruz would have to win first. He’s not going to win. Just so you know. Sorry for the spoiler. ---
**Author:** ![Spavined\_Gelding](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/958977/32.png) [@Spavined\_Gelding](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Spavined_Gelding)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/10 "2015-03-23T02:25:02Z")
No, no, no. Don’t do it. Let our boy Trump bring it up, or maybe that octogenarian sheriff from Arizona. Either of them will carry a lot more weight with the people who are likely to vote for Ol’ Ted. If we do it the rational thinkers could easily conclude that we are engaged in special pleading driven by our partisan interests – not that the people carrying on about the Kenyan Usurper didn’t have the purist of motives. ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/11 "2015-03-23T02:26:46Z")
I’m curious as to the depth of Birthers hatred. I’m not entirely confident they wont turn on Cruz. I mean, he _is_ a half breed after all. And he wasn’t born in The USA. All that is needed is for one of his opponents (like say Huckabee) to spark the flame and the birthers will be all over his shit. ---
**Author:** ![suranyi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e36b37/32.png) [@suranyi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/suranyi)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/12 "2015-03-23T02:29:28Z")
I’m not a birther: I know Obama was born in Hawaii Having said that, there’s a huge difference between the birther issues for Obama and a possible “birther” issue for Cruz. Obama birthers were trying to prove he was born outside the U.S. By contrast, there’s nothing for Cruz birthers to prove: Everyone already knows he was born in Canada. ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/13 "2015-03-23T02:32:23Z")
> [@Master\_Wang-Ka](#): > > I think the OP raises a good point. Are we going to see the same over the top psychotic-break style racist (or even nonracist) insanity with a Hispanic president that we did with a black one? Not unless Hillary officially changes her name to _Clintonista_, apparently. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/14 "2015-03-23T02:34:52Z")
I still believe he’s a sleeper agent for La Revolucion. ---
**Author:** ![Iggy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iggy/32/3364_2.png) [@Iggy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Iggy)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/15 "2015-03-23T02:41:14Z")
> [@suranyi](#): > > I’m not a birther: I know Obama was born in Hawaii > > Having said that, there’s a huge difference between the birther issues for Obama and a possible “birther” issue for Cruz. Obama birthers were trying to prove he was born outside the U.S. By contrast, there’s nothing for Cruz birthers to prove: Everyone already knows he was born in Canada. Moreover, _if_ the Obama Birthers were correct (and they most certainly are/were not) and Obama had not been born in Hawaii but was actaully born outside the US then, under the laws at that time, it is true that Obama would not have been a US citizen from birth. His mother did not qualify to pass citizenship to his under _jus sanguinis_ even though she was a US citizen. Even if you want to raise an issue about the location of Cruz’s birth, he still qualified as a US citizen from birth under the laws in force at the time. His mother did qualify to pass US citizenship to him under _jus sanguinis_. So really, there is nothing to grasp at. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 2:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/16 "2015-03-23T02:54:39Z")
> [@Airman\_Doors\_USAF](#): > > But why bother? Raising the question makes no sense, because like the Birthers you’ll never be right. > > It occurs to me that we will never have any sort of political peace as long as we take the position that because they did it first it necessarily follows that you should do it as well. Let the idiots be idiots. Don’t emulate them. I sympathize with what you’re saying and in an ideal world you’d be right. But if one side unilaterally limits itself to only fighting within a set of rules and the other side is willing to do anything to win, then the side that’s willing to do anything will win all the fights. It just has to take every conflict past the point of reason and the other side will give up rather than cross over into craziness itself. In the long run, it might be better if the “sane” side is willing to fight craziness with craziness. If the “crazy” side can no longer gain an advantage from using these tactics unopposed and has to start defending itself from crazy counterattacks then it might agree to take craziness off the table. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/17 "2015-03-23T03:10:40Z")
> [@WPA-Guy](#): > > Ted Cruz has announced that he is a candidate for President in 2016, however, he was born in Canada, not the US. And his father is Cuban, although his mother is American, born in Delaware. > > So, if a big stink was made in 2008 for candidate Obama (who apparently was born in the US), shouldn’t the same be made now? > > Just sayin’. Be careful. Someone might be along shortly to chastise you for pointing out conservative hypocrisy. And, as noted, if you wish to equate yourself with The Birthers, go ahead. Do you know what type of reception they got on this MB? ---
**Author:** ![Stringbean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Stringbean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringbean)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/18 "2015-03-23T03:20:28Z")
Boy oh boy, the scariest candidate in my lifetime now has a face and name. His birth certificate is the least of my concerns. ---
**Author:** ![Lord\_Feldon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lord_feldon/32/341_2.png) [@Lord\_Feldon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lord_Feldon)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/19 "2015-03-23T03:46:58Z")
> [@Shakes](#): > > I’m curious as to the depth of Birthers hatred. I’m not entirely confident they wont turn on Cruz. I mean, he _is_ a half breed after all. And he wasn’t born in The USA. Some of them already have. Most of them just hate Obama but a few drank all the different flavors of Kool-Aid. Eventually it didn’t actually matter if Obama was born in the US, because his father was foreign therefore so was he, QED. There are also birther types who believe Rick Santorum is ineligible, as well as Mitt Romney, Bobby Jindal, and Marco Rubio. ---
**Author:** ![WPA-Guy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/a6a055/32.png) [@WPA-Guy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WPA-Guy)\ **Post date:** [March 23, 2015, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749/20 "2015-03-23T03:49:06Z")
I am by no means want to be associated with birthers. I know his citizenship would pass muster (except by crazy people). I wish politics was like the court of law – past precedents dictate present treatment. Or present actions invalidate your position. For example: if your moral campaign rails against births outside of wedlock, I don’t want to hear from you about limiting birth control. Or if you question someone’s citizenship be prepared to face the same intense scrutiny. Hypocrisy drives me nuts. It probably stems from a lawsuit my father was involved in years ago. As a member of the School Board, he, and the rest were sued because apparently the Board calculated the taxes incorrectly, overcharging the taxpayers. Several years later the judge ruled “Yes taxpayers, they did make a mistake, but in your favor.” I recently found a scrapbook where several locals at the time, gave their hotheaded opinion of the situation, but after the suit was settled, not one of them manned up and said they were wrong. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-call-the-kettle-black-lets-see-the-birth-certificate/715749.md?page=2)