So you admit you’re trolling?
No, I admit that there is no common ground to be had between us, so why should a genuine dialog even ensue? A genuine dialog is not something you want. There is no compromise to be had; only a pounding of basically, “Nope, you’re wrong, you have privilege” to everyone who disagrees in any way.
Well if you aren’t here for genuine dialog, why are you here? Shits and giggles from getting all the libtard tears flowing? Kinda the definition of being a troll.
ETA: I’m done with this hijack.
If you look through the thread, I gave lengthy responses and what I find were honest answers. It’s more anger than “shits and giggles” because I do not see any way for this issue to be resolved in the future without further division taking place. I do not genuinely see any way to resolve this issue without at least one, or some, of the ‘hyperbolic’ things I said taking place.
Because again, I will ask (and my own question went unanswered, as it always does when it comes to this topic): Ok, if white privilege exists, what do you want ***ME ***- who has no power, wealth or connections - to do about it other than acknowledge it?
How about we start with babysteps? Like step 1: acknowledging the existence of white privilege.
A white person can put on nice clothes, get a nice hair cut, take elocution lessons, and move to a ritzy neighborhood and escape the stigma of poverty.
A black person doesn’t have this privilege because people find it expedient to equate “black person” to “poor person”, even though the statistics indicate this makes no sense.
Picture a school with a predominantly black student body. If your mind does NOT automatically picture an impoverished, inner-city broken school, then you’re a special person. Americans associate “ghetto” with a predominantly black anything. If this isn’t racism masquerading as classicism, I don’t know what is.
I acknowledge it exists, otherwise I would simply have said, “no it doesn’t” and left the thread. But I also ask how are we to define ‘whiteness’? A friend of mine from college is married to a black man, and she had children with him. Their children are lighter skinned than even I am. Are they white, despite having a black father? I already said earlier in the thread that I myself do not consider myself to be white, but because I am not as dark as some, I am tagged as being such.
Do I believe privilege exists? Yes. Do I believe the lighter one’s skin is, the more likely they are to have it; and the more privileged they are likely to be? Yes. Do I believe every single person who is not Black, Asian (basically, any person who is not easily visually definable as another race), or who can be visually considered to be a Muslim, has it? No. Because that’s grouping too many varied people into a big catch-all box.
So, yes, I accept it exists. I just do not believe it is as broad and all inclusive of literally every single person who is not visibly Black, Asian, or who is/or can be mistaken for being a Muslim. Is that really so unrealistic?
If it were that easy, I wouldn’t be living in the neighborhood I am. You’re way oversimplifying poverty for both whites AND blacks. You’re taking a very “white man’s burden” brush to it, in the sense that you’re assuming a lot on behalf of a whole race of people (unless you’re black yourself, than I apologize). If I were Black, I would actually find it offensive that you’re speaking for me and my experience in such generalities. It’s actually almost insulting.
Speaking for myself as a city dweller in which there are many ghettos and projects, they aren’t associated with blackness, at least among those I know, so much as they are with poverty and crime, which go hand in hand regardless of race. The fact that blacks tend to be poorer than whites is a sad corollary.
I’m white. But you don’t hear me sniveling about it. People don’t despise white people. They despise whiners.
Here’s what the solution to the problem is: grow up. Stop feeling like you’ve accomplished something just by being white and go out and actually do something of value. If you accomplish something as an individual, you’ll find you no longer feel threatened by other people surpassing you.
nm
When did I say I felt like I accomplished something by being white? And where did I say I felt threatened by people surpassing me? Plenty of people, black, white, and every color in between have surpassed me lol. It simply becomes tiresome in that I feel when these conversations take place, you view me as part of a monolithic bloc, rather than as an individual person with an individual set of circumstances.
Well, it’s a good thing that I’m black then. Otherwise I’d have to hang my head in shame that I’ve offended such a fine, well-spoken poster such as yourself. :rolleyes:
You’re way too new to this board to be running your mouth the way you’ve been doing over the past couple of days. Slow your roll, dude. Some of us have been around the “privilege” mulberry bush quite a few times, so you’re going to have to do a lot better than “you’re hurting my white feelings!” to score any points. You might actually learn something if you stick around long enough. But you won’t learn anything if you don’t learn to slow down and digest what’s being communicated before you post.
It doesn’t boil down to the belittling statement you just made. It boils down to what I said here:
"I acknowledge it exists, otherwise I would simply have said, “no it doesn’t” and left the thread. But I also ask how are we to define ‘whiteness’? A friend of mine from college is married to a black man, and she had children with him. Their children are lighter skinned than even I am. Are they white, despite having a black father? I already said earlier in the thread that I myself do not consider myself to be white, but because I am not as dark as some, I am tagged as being such.
Do I believe privilege exists? Yes. Do I believe the lighter one’s skin is, the more likely they are to have it; and the more privileged they are likely to be? Yes. Do I believe every single person who is not Black, Asian (basically, any person who is not easily visually definable as another race), or who can be visually considered to be a Muslim, has it? No. Because that’s grouping too many varied people into a big catch-all box.
So, yes, I accept it exists. I just do not believe it is as broad and all inclusive of literally every single person who is not visibly Black, Asian, or who is/or can be mistaken for being a Muslim. Is that really so unrealistic?"
To start with, probably to treat phenomena that have been involved in society for decades and centuries as reasonable things that really do exist and still might have effects and ramifications today. It might take nuance and thoughtful consideration.
I don’t know; I can’t predict the future. I hope not, but privilege may still exist and have effects on society for a long time.
Find me the person who has said that literally every white person benefits from white privilege and literally every non-white person is a victim of white privilege, and I’ll glad beat them up for you.
I don’t think this person exist. I think you are creating a straw man argument so that you can score a point in a debate that is way above your head. If you agree that white privilege exists, why have you been so hostile to everyone who has been posting about its existence?
Why have you been acting like a discussion of white privilege says something negatively about you, if you don’t have any problem with the concept?
I have no problem admitting that I enjoy privilege in certain areas. Admitting that I benefit from certain aspects of my identity doesn’t detract from my goodness as a human being. It just means that I need to think twice before I get up in someone’s face and blame them for not being as fortunate as I am. As long as you are able to appreciate that your identity has set up you for certain advantages, then you don’t have to actually do anything else. The simple appreciation of this fact is all you need to be a better person.
Does this help alleviate some of the pressure you’re feeling, as a white guy in a debate about white privilege? I hope it does. There really is no need for you to keep harping about your ethnic make-up like it matters one bit to this conversation. No one is blaming *you *for anything. (By the way, you can be a black person such as myself and benefit from white privilege. Every day I’m aware that my light skin affords me with advantages that are not granted to my darker skin sistern and brethern. This doesn’t keep me up at night with guilt and shame, but it does motivate me to keep participating in conversations like this one.)
Thank you, Monstro. Well said.
You don’t think I do that? It’s called common human decency. You don’t think I realize that Black people, on the whole, have had a much shittier time of it, and don’t in some ways have it as easy as I do overall? Of course I do. I’m not the type of person to look at someone who is poor and blame them for their lot, because I’m pretty much poor myself and I know there are things beyond a person’s control. When you’re a Black person, this is on the whole magnified. When you’re of lighter tones, this is on the whole lessened. I knew that long before I ever heard the phrase “white privilege.” It is common sense living in this country to know there are, and have been, great disparities.
It’s more the accusatory tones that I have personally experienced from others (previous to this particular debate) which have led to a hostile reaction to it. Because believe it or not there have been people who have tried to make me feel like it’s literally, personally, my fault and like I should feel bad about it. Like I keep saying, I don’t even consider myself white and when I keep getting told I am, that tends to make one cantankerous too. “You’re white.” “No, I’m not.” “Yes you are.” It becomes quite tiresome. So, over the course of time as this debate has become more contentious, so have I.
Also, I think the concept of white privilege focuses too much on “White and Black” people, and it divides two races along a narrow stretch of field. No one really talks nearly as much about the injustices the Jews suffer (and still do), or injustices the Native Americans suffered, and still do, or how the Mexican-Americans have suffered and still do, and honestly, that infuriates me as well. It’s not simply a Black matter, or a White matter as much as it is an American matter, and yet it has become so simplified that two races alone, really, are at such odds.
Stop taking it so personally. I certainly don’t.
That’s one of my big problems with the alt-right crowd. Just such intense anger about something that really doesn’t affect their day-to-day lives that much except that it has become one of their “must defend my race” cards.
Just let it go.
Sorry, I stopped reading after this. This topic is much broader than Reddy Mercury. We aren’t just talking to Reddy Mercury. It is WONDERFUL that Reddy Mercury appreciates white privilege, but obviously other people do not or we would not be having this conversation.
The more you make white privilege about you and what you do/don’t do, you just confirm to me that you don’t understand what we’re talking about.
You were addressing me, so why should I not have responded with “I”? When you ask me questions, I tend to think you want a response from me.