# I'm Going to Say It. Misogyny Elected Trump. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 9, 2016, 4:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230 "2016-11-09T16:31:26Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Quint](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/76d3ee/32.png) [@Quint](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quint)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 8:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/61 "2016-11-10T08:56:26Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > And that apathy means they didn’t care enough about being anti-racist, anti-misogynistic, etc. to vote. > > I have always said you are either anti-bigotry, or you are a bigot. There is no middle ground. I may not use that language with those who are just light bigots (so as not to scare them away), but I can’t hold back the truth. What you are saying here is that there are 120 million bigots in the USA over and above those who actually voted for Trump. That number of non voting bigots includes huge numbers of people of color, women, LGBT people and every other disenfranchised group who are worse off with a Trump presidency. Pathetic. ---
**Author:** ![AK84](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/85e7bf/32.png) [@AK84](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AK84)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 9:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/62 "2016-11-10T09:11:07Z")
> [@coremelt](#): > > Really AK84? i’m not in the mood for this. I’ve travelled and worked in India and Pakistan. Women in power are very much a rare exception which can only occur **in elite political families** , the average woman in the sub-continent is subservient to men, both _culturally and legally_. So fuck off with your false equivalence. Yeah, I really doubt you paid much attention then. Could you please mention a legal encumbrance? Or two? Or three? Elite political families? I can name half a dozen prominent female politicians in Pakistan who are middle or working class background. Firdous Ashiq Awan. ANdaleeb Abass, Bushra Gohar, Shela Raza, ANusha Rehman, Raheela Durrani. For India I know less but Shusma Suraj, Mehbooba Mufti and Jayalalitha come to mind. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 5:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/63 "2016-11-10T17:33:47Z")
I applaud OP. Note that one of the most common charges against Hillary is that she stood by her man despite his extramarital blowjobs. This complaint comes from the very same imbeciles and degenerates who proudly pulled the lever for the man who’s bragged of his sexual degeneracy. And one of SDMB’s stupidest right-wingers just started a thread pitting Hillary. I’m not sure exactly what detritus came out of his mouth(\*) but he somehow claims Hillary is responsible for the electoral tragedy — she had the audacity to run for a man’s job and all the male Republiopaths therefore had no choice except to vote for whatever creature, however contemptible, had the R by his name. (\* - I’ve given up trying to educate the idiot and have arranged that I don’t see his posts. This is in self-defense since he went whining to the Mods whenever I tried to educate him.) > [@coremelt](#): > > I’ve travelled and worked in India and Pakistan. Women in power are very much a rare exception which can only occur in elite political families, the average woman in the sub-continent is subservient to men … I often observe the opposite here in rural Thailand. It’s not unusual for a man to turn his money over to his wife, and then ask for spending money, a dollar at a time! Many proprietors and elected officials are female. (This is not to claim the society lacks discrimination and misogyny, just that “very much rare” doesn’t apply here.) ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 6:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/64 "2016-11-10T18:11:35Z")
Let’s try this another way: The media and the Democrats have completely ignored, belittled and marginalized a large part of America. The only one who recognized it, and God help me for saying it… is Michael Moore, who identified the problem and predicted a Trump’s win a year ago. Working class America has been losing their jobs, their healthcare costs have gone up, while their care has gone down. They have no retirement plans. They are losing their houses and their cars. They are farmers, miners, lumberjacks, manufacturing workers, etc. When they are identified they are made fun of as bitter clingers. They are told that they destroy the environment, that their religion is stupid, and they can’t have the guns they believe they have a right too to protect and feed their family. They are mostly, but not all white. They don’t care about race, or religion, or what’s happening in the cities. They care that they are drowning in debt, about to lose the family farm and are having a tough time feeding their family. They think the system is rigged against them, and Donald Trump has promised to tear it down. Meanwhile Hillary is getting endorsed by rich celebrities. This confirms their thinking. The same system that is taking away their lives, and that is building Hillary up, is also attacking Trump, who is rough and unpolished. They identify. They don’t care that some rich little brat in a beauty contest got their boob squeezed, or that Trump says mean things about women or minorities. Their concerns are more desperate and basic than politeness. The party that was supposed to be helping them, made fun of and ignored them, while talking about glass ceilings in the context of one of the most powerful women in the world who is worth more than 400 million dollars. Is she really being repressed because she’s a woman? Does she really have it that bad? Is an unemployed auto worker supposed to feel sorry for he? Can someone who is drowning in debt, and losing their farm while working 100 hours a week supposed to care about her marginalization? They were ignored, and neglected. Trump sent them a message. They have now been heard. Misogyny doesn’t really enter into the equation. Trump is dangerous, and delusionary explanations for his success isn’t going to address the real issue. That issue needs to be addressed, those people need to be represented, and the sooner they are, the sooner Trump can be disposed of. ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 6:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/65 "2016-11-10T18:51:22Z")
I don’t think Clinton’s loss can just be chalked up to “Oh, misogyny!”, but I’m increasingly also doubting this “the forgotten white rural people rose up, out there in Flyover Country, and gave us Trump!” narrative as well. Looking at the numbers (just Wikipedia, and of course this year’s numbers are still to some extent preliminary) for [2008](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2008#Results), [2012](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2012#Results), and [2016](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2016#Results), Trump actually got fewer votes than loser Mitt Romney (60,933,504), and may possibly wind up with fewer votes than huge, big-league loser John McCain (59,948,323; and Trump is currently showing 59,698,506 votes). The reason Clinton didn’t kick his orange ass is that–even though she actually got more votes than he did, 59,926,386–she got almost 10 million votes fewer than Mr. Cool Transformational Barack Obama, the Brilliant Inspirational Orator, Our First Black President (they gave him the Nobel Peace Prize 😕 ); and almost 6 million votes fewer than President of the United States Barack Obama, the calm, steady, thoughtful, moderate centrist incumbent POTUS who gave us at least some semblance of healthcare reform, then defended it from Republican obstructionism, at least kept the American economy from totally melting down, and had Osama bin Laden shot in the fucking face. If she could have racked up anything like those numbers–Our First Woman President! Do it for our daughters and granddaughters!–she would have beaten the Abominable Narcissist pretty handily, and the white rural non-college educated voters could go…wait for President Hillary Clinton’s programs to (in a moderate, sensible, let’s not get too crazy way) actually maybe make their lives a little bit better. Alternatively, maybe the Democrats could have gone for [Our First Jewish President!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernie_Sanders#/media/File:Bernie_Sanders.jpg); maybe the little whipersnapper “Millennials” would have gotten off my damned lawn and put down their smartphones and voted for _him_. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 6:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/66 "2016-11-10T18:52:09Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > There, I said it. Misogyny Elected Trump. > > I’m not saying this because Hilary lost to a man. I’m not saying this because everyone who has been president has been a man. Although these facts certainly speak for themselves. > > I’m saying it because a man has been recorded on tape boasting about his prowess as a sexual predator against women, and this was not enough to prevent his election to the presidency. > > He’s a sexual predator, and he’s proud of it. And to millions, it is not enough to keep him from being president. (post shortened) Misogyny elected sexual predator Bill “Slick Willy” Clinton. Men wanted to be him. Women wanted to be with him. I think a precedent had been set. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 7:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/67 "2016-11-10T19:03:50Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Now as to answer the question: I think the alt-right got Trump elected. Normally they spread between the two parties. But they didn’t this time. > > I don’t think they had to be all that numerous to do it, either. > > Then again, I read somewhere that if, no one voted for Stein in Florida, Clinton would have won. If so, fuck 'em. Maybe for the benefit of the stupid people you maybe should tell them just WHO the “alt right” is. Just sayin’. ---
**Author:** ![Two\_Many\_Cats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/8dc957/32.png) [@Two\_Many\_Cats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Two_Many_Cats)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 7:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/68 "2016-11-10T19:07:52Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > (post shortened) > > Misogyny elected sexual predator Bill “Slick Willy” Clinton. Men wanted to be him. Women wanted to be with him. I think a precedent had been set. If women wanted to be with him, then he isn’t a sexual predator. Consent makes a difference. ---
**Author:** ![Robot\_Arm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/robot_arm/32/18280_2.png) [@Robot\_Arm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Robot_Arm)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 7:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/69 "2016-11-10T19:25:11Z")
> [@CairoCarol](#): > > However, I would so, so, so DEARLY love to be wrong. If Trump brings down the deficit, reduces unemployment, improves harmony and inclusiveness etc. etc. etc., no one will be happier than me. I’ll take a giant mug of that “I told you so” beer, and I’ll swallow. With pleasure. And I’ll be right there with you. But I want the corresponding promise from Trump supporters. If the deficit goes up, etc., I want them to admit that their man did it and to learn from it. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/70 "2016-11-10T19:27:53Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > And one of SDMB’s stupidest right-wingers just started a thread pitting Hillary. I’m not sure exactly what detritus came out of his mouth(\*) but he somehow claims Hillary is responsible for the electoral tragedy The not subtle hinting that you have Shodan on ignore is very boring and very childish. He only expressed his anger that she was politically incompetent and unable to beat Trump, who he considers dangerous. > [@](#): > > — she had the audacity to run for a man’s job and all the male Republiopaths therefore had no choice except to vote for whatever creature, however contemptible, had the R by his name. No he indicates he voted for her, and was not being blindly ideological like you are. In fact the actual numbers of the results from your election, as MEBuckner below highlights indicate that this ideological narrative is wrong: > [@MEBuckner](#): > > I don’t think Clinton’s loss can just be chalked up to “Oh, misogyny!”, but I’m increasingly also doubting this “the forgotten white rural people rose up, out there in Flyover Country, and gave us Trump!” narrative as well. > > Looking at the numbers (just Wikipedia, and of course this year’s numbers are still to some extent preliminary) for [2008](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2008#Results), [2012](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2012#Results), and [2016](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2016#Results), Trump actually got fewer votes than loser Mitt Romney (60,933,504), and may possibly wind up with fewer votes than huge, big-league loser John McCain (59,948,323; and Trump is currently showing 59,698,506 votes). The reason Clinton didn’t kick his orange ass is that–even though she actually got more votes than he did, 59,926,386–she got almost 10 million votes fewer than Mr. Cool Transformational Barack Obama, the Brilliant Inspirational Orator, Our First Black President (they gave him the Nobel Peace Prize 😕 ); and almost 6 million votes fewer than President of the United States Barack Obama, the calm, steady, thoughtful, moderate centrist incumbent POTUS who gave us at least some semblance of healthcare reform, then defended it from Republican obstructionism, at least kept the American economy from totally melting down, and had Osama bin Laden shot in the fucking face. > > If she could have racked up anything like those numbers–Our First Woman President! Do it for our daughters and granddaughters!–she would have beaten the Abominable Narcissist pretty handily, and the white rural non-college educated voters could go…wait for President Hillary Clinton’s programs to (in a moderate, sensible, let’s not get too crazy way) actually maybe make their lives a little bit better. Alternatively, maybe the Democrats could have gone for [Our First Jewish President!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernie_Sanders#/media/File:Bernie_Sanders.jpg); maybe the little whipersnapper “Millennials” would have gotten off my damned lawn and put down their smartphones and voted for _him_. The observed problem from the numbers of the results are that there was the total collapse of the support that your President Obama obtained - and indeed Trump did not do so well at all, so lashing out blindlly at the Republicans is not very sensible, it is Mrs Clinton that did worse. This is a failure of the candidate and her lack of ability to actually mobilize despite have the very great resources and a very celebrated ‘ground game.’ This is the lack of the charisma. That is not a problem of being a woman, it is the problem of being a person not good at the political campaigning by her fundamental nature. ---
**Author:** ![Quint](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/q/76d3ee/32.png) [@Quint](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quint)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/71 "2016-11-10T19:30:04Z")
> [@MEBuckner](#): > > I don’t think Clinton’s loss can just be chalked up to “Oh, misogyny!”, but I’m increasingly also doubting this “the forgotten white rural people rose up, out there in Flyover Country, and gave us Trump!” narrative as well. > > Looking at the numbers (just Wikipedia, and of course this year’s numbers are still to some extent preliminary) for [2008](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2008#Results), [2012](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2012#Results), and [2016](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election,_2016#Results), Trump actually got fewer votes than loser Mitt Romney (60,933,504), and may possibly wind up with fewer votes than huge, big-league loser John McCain (59,948,323; and Trump is currently showing 59,698,506 votes). The reason Clinton didn’t kick his orange ass is that–even though she actually got more votes than he did, 59,926,386–she got almost 10 million votes fewer than Mr. Cool Transformational Barack Obama, the Brilliant Inspirational Orator, Our First Black President (they gave him the Nobel Peace Prize 😕 ); and almost 6 million votes fewer than President of the United States Barack Obama, the calm, steady, thoughtful, moderate centrist incumbent POTUS who gave us at least some semblance of healthcare reform, then defended it from Republican obstructionism, at least kept the American economy from totally melting down, and had Osama bin Laden shot in the fucking face. > > If she could have racked up anything like those numbers–Our First Woman President! Do it for our daughters and granddaughters!–she would have beaten the Abominable Narcissist pretty handily, and the white rural non-college educated voters could go…wait for President Hillary Clinton’s programs to (in a moderate, sensible, let’s not get too crazy way) actually maybe make their lives a little bit better. Alternatively, maybe the Democrats could have gone for [Our First Jewish President!](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernie_Sanders#/media/File:Bernie_Sanders.jpg); maybe the little whipersnapper “Millennials” would have gotten off my damned lawn and put down their smartphones and voted for _him_. OK. So this is what I was trying to say only eloquently and intelligently put. With stats to back it up to boot. ---
**Author:** ![nightshadea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/7ba0ec/32.png) [@nightshadea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nightshadea)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 7:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/72 "2016-11-10T19:53:15Z")
what I never understood is why didn’t she use bill and his presidency more “the last time we were here we (America) were great …after that not so much now elect us and let us finish cleaning up up the mess… barry did a great job but its taking longer than we thought” ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/73 "2016-11-10T20:08:47Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > This is the lack of the charisma. That is not a problem of being a woman, it is the problem of being a person not good at the political campaigning by her fundamental nature. If a voter doesn’t care enough to vote for the politician who better represents them, it’s not the politician’s fault, it’s the voter’s. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/74 "2016-11-10T20:39:11Z")
No, it is the politician who is a failure who does not generate the engagement. It is the job of politics to motivate and generate interest - this is the real world, not the civics lessons abstractions. but if you wish to continue the losing, of course the activists American Left can continue to practice the contempt of those who are not like them in motivation and interests. ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2016, 9:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/75 "2016-11-10T21:40:59Z")
Yeah, just to be clear, I don’t actually _like_ how important “likeability” or “charisma” are to politics. I think it’s pretty stupid. And Clinton certainly didn’t have any trouble motivating _me_ to go vote for her. I think politics is too important to rely much on “likeability” or “charisma”, even in years when Donald Trump _isn’t_ on the ballot for President of the United States. But I also know that I’m kind of weird. Before November 8, the most recent election I voted in was back in June; it was a primary runoff election for county tax commissioner. (The candidate I voted for lost. Oh, well.) So, I’m not a normal voter. And precisely because politics is too important–_especially_ this year–candidates and party establishments MUST take into account the way actual flesh-and-blood voters behave in the real world. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/76 "2016-11-11T16:36:21Z")
> [@Two\_Many\_Cats](#): > > If women wanted to be with him, then he isn’t a sexual predator. > > Consent makes a difference. Not every woman who had been recruited accepted Slick Willy’s offer of a cigar. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [November 11, 2016, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230/77 "2016-11-11T17:01:28Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > No, it is the politician who is a failure who does not generate the engagement. > > It is the job of politics to motivate and generate interest - this is the real world, not the civics lessons abstractions. > > but if you wish to continue the losing, of course the activists American Left can continue to practice the contempt of those who are not like them in motivation and interests. It’s the politician’s job to represent the people. It’s the people’s job to choose the politician. The failure of the people to engage in their own governance is their own failure. The paradigm that it’s the politician’s job to motivate the people is exactly what gave us Trump. Provocation instead of contemplation. I am a pragmatic centrist. I’m quite happy to see the Left lose and very eager to see the Right lose. But everyone loses when only a small fraction of adults take seriously their duty to choose their representatives. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/im-going-to-say-it-misogyny-elected-trump/771230.md?page=3)