And if they’re from the wrong place, you kill them.
Nope. Those are words in which /ʃ/ is spelled in a way other than “sh.” I’m looking for the reverse: words in which “sh” represents a sound other than /ʃ/.
Chronos, the [del]proper[/del] Scottish “ch” of loch is a different plosive. In the International Phonetic Alphabet, that phoneme is represented by /x/ (which of course is not that of /k/ + /s/ one hears at the end of box, because that would be too easy. So you’re right that I left out a possible pronounciation of “ch.” (Of course, most Americans pronounce “loch” to be a homophone of “lock,” which is why I forgot it.)
I think that if you are using it as an adjective describing someone or something from Wales, Welsh is pronounced with a regular “sh”, but if it is to welsh on a deal it may be pronounced as “welch” (or “weltsh” if that is clearer).
How is “Welsh” not pronounced with a “Sh” sound?
Yes, but I’ve always seen the verb spelled with ch at the end. Also, as the designation /tʃ/ implies, the “ch” sound is just /t/ and /ʃ/ smushed together, albeit so quickly that it’s all but impossible for native speakers of English to hear. I certainly can’t, though it’s voiced counterpart of /dʒ/ is a lot more obvious to me as being a blend of /d/ and /ʒ/.
Merriam-Webster gives /welch/ as an acceptable variant.
I didn’t realize this until now, but the expression I grew up with was “to welch on a bet,” but apparently, it’s actually “to welsh on a bet,” with “welsh” pronounced as “welch.” (ETA: Although now I see Merriam-Webster has an entry for “welch” as a variant of “welsh.”)
I think welshing on a bet/deal was originally a racial slur against the Welsh. Perhaps the altered pronunciation began as a half-hearted gesture towards political correctness.
Welsh on a Bet (follow-up letter.)
Glad I could help! But none of the other words I listed had /s/ + /h/ combos. “Dishonest” and “dishonor”, for example, are just /s/, with a mute <h>, and “newshour” is /z/ with a mute <h>.
I’m going to nitpick here and point out that /x/ is a fricative, not a plosive.
I have heard the “welch” pronunciation" for “welsh”, but never “cazhmere” for “cashmere”. How many people actually pronounce it that way?
Among Americans, enough that Merriam-Webster lists that pronunciation first. The OED, on the other hand, lists only the /ʃ/ variant.
Sorry; that last bit should have read “the phonemic sequence /ʃ/ or /sh/”.
Phew. I was starting to panic that I have been pronouncing it “wrong” all these years (as clearly it is a word I use often). I’m struggling to think how it would sound without a /ʃ/.
In what dialect is the “sh” in cashmere “zh”? It’s a straight “sh” where I come from.
As psychonaut mentions, it’s common in the American dialects. I say “cashmere” with the voiced “zh” sound, for example.
You are correct.
Where are you from?
I can’t recall ever hearing it with as “cashmere”; only “cazhmere.” I was raised in Memphis.
I know you didn’t ask for proper nouns, but as we’ve exhausted the other possibilities, here are a couple:
Cheshunt (a town north of London) is pronounced ˈtʃesənt or ˈtʃezənt.
Bosham, in Sussex, is ˈbɒzəm (but nearby Cosham is ˈkɒʃəm)
Edit: “cashmere” is never anything other than “cash-meer” for me (UK).